Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 29-09-2013, 13:26   #16
Registered User
 
transmitterdan's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2011
Boat: Valiant 42
Posts: 4,019
Quote:
Originally Posted by john540 View Post

You could take all the 12 volt batteries from the readers of cruisers forum and wire them together in parallel and I wouldn't hesitate to grab the positive and negative terminals.
John,

Things aren't so simple where a large (or even small) motor is concerned. When a motor has it's current interrupted the voltage across the motor can become a lot more than 12 volts. If the interruption is in the ground return to the battery then the negative terminal of the motor can go way below ground. If you happen to be in a path that bypasses the interrupted ground you can get quite a shock and arcing is indeed possible. It's possible that is happening in this case. The challenge is to find the intermittent connection and fix it. It could be in the motor itself or it could be anywhere between the motor and the battery.
__________________

__________________
transmitterdan is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 29-09-2013, 14:27   #17
Registered User

Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Apalachicola, North Florida
Boat: 1969 Morgan 28, Stiletto 27
Posts: 171
Re: How to find & fix a short in windlass

At the risk of appearing a simpleton, I ask if you cleaned your battery terminals and connectors.

Corrosion on the terminals can cause intermittent flow, varying flow with varying loads, and varying voltage. As components are made to work in a specific voltage range, this can throw "how it should work" out the porthole.

When you say " I disconnected the solenoid and switch, and connected "it" directly" what was the "it"?

Jumping a battery (in the bow) direct to the winch with nothing else in the circuit will tell you if the winch works, Yes or no. You have lots of good advice on what to do with a bad winch.

Add just the solenoid and touch a jumper to the switch terminal on the solenoid from the battery. That will tell you solenoid good or not.

If the solenoid and winch are good, add the switch. If it fails, the switch is bad. If that works, the problem is in your transmission wires, between the battery terminals and the power lines that attach to the solenoid or the switch. Power lines shorted to ground, bad connection, bad breaker/fuse, could be the problem. load and no load behavior or voltage will vary, as does energy available.

Basically, clean ALL terminals, then start with only a battery at the bow and winch, adding one component at a time.

If the primary problem occurred for some time, it could have caused a secondary problem, which confuses troubleshooting a lot. Both problems will have to be resolved.But deal with one piece at a time, and eventually you will find the bad piece(es), and soon have a happy anchor winch.

Others have said most of this, many said it better, but here it is all in one piece. Good luck!
__________________

__________________
Bestathook is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29-09-2013, 15:45   #18
Senior Cruiser
 
JusDreaming's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Stuart, FL & Bahamas Cruising
Boat: Lagoon 37
Posts: 880
Images: 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bestathook View Post
At the risk of appearing a simpleton, I ask if you cleaned your battery terminals and connectors.

Corrosion on the terminals can cause intermittent flow, varying flow with varying loads, and varying voltage. As components are made to work in a specific voltage range, this can throw "how it should work" out the porthole.

When you say " I disconnected the solenoid and switch, and connected "it" directly" what was the "it"?

Jumping a battery (in the bow) direct to the winch with nothing else in the circuit will tell you if the winch works, Yes or no. You have lots of good advice on what to do with a bad winch.

Add just the solenoid and touch a jumper to the switch terminal on the solenoid from the battery. That will tell you solenoid good or not.

If the solenoid and winch are good, add the switch. If it fails, the switch is bad. If that works, the problem is in your transmission wires, between the battery terminals and the power lines that attach to the solenoid or the switch. Power lines shorted to ground, bad connection, bad breaker/fuse, could be the problem. load and no load behavior or voltage will vary, as does energy available.

Basically, clean ALL terminals, then start with only a battery at the bow and winch, adding one component at a time.

If the primary problem occurred for some time, it could have caused a secondary problem, which confuses troubleshooting a lot. Both problems will have to be resolved.But deal with one piece at a time, and eventually you will find the bad piece(es), and soon have a happy anchor winch.

Others have said most of this, many said it better, but here it is all in one piece. Good luck!
I have a similar problem, mine clicks, but when I manually bump the gypsy forcing the motor, it takes off! So I am assuming it is brushes, yours could be the same
__________________
Denny and Diane
Lagoon 37
http://www.svjusdreaming.bravehost.com/
http://www.sailblogs.com/member/svjusdreaming/
"The only way to get a good crew is to marry one." -Eric Hiscock
JusDreaming is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29-09-2013, 15:54   #19
Senior Cruiser
 
DeepFrz's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Winnipeg
Boat: None at this time
Posts: 7,930
Re: How to find & fix a short in windlass

+1 on what Bestathook says.
__________________
The Blue Dot Campaign. This Changes Everything.
DeepFrz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29-09-2013, 16:04   #20
Registered User

Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Usually South Florida these days
Posts: 825
Re: How to find & fix a short in windlass

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cap Erict3 View Post
Just to clarify, when you connected directly to the motor without a solenoid, it ran intermittently?

Why then install another solenoid?

The simplest and most common issue is sticking or worn brushes on the motor.
Brushes were my first thought too, or a corroded commutator, which is the part that the brushes run against. Corroded connections in general were my next thought.

Anywhere that you saw a spark is a good place to investigate for a short or a poor connection.
__________________
pbiJim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2013, 00:41   #21
Registered User
 
PamlicoTraveler's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Depends
Boat: SB 43' Cutter
Posts: 679
Images: 13
I promised to report back and I think, by golly, we have the damn thing fixed. I was just to the point of giving up and taking the motor off, which would of course mean draining the oil from the gearbox and separating it.

Before doing that I removed the ground connection and used a drill wire brush to clean the connection, but also removed the washers and bolts and replaced them with new ones. That might have been they key.

I then ran another large cable from the grounding post to another post, just give it double grounding. This worked and now everything seems to be working perfectly.

There were so many mysteries and gremlins here, and although my first attempt was to remove and clean the ground post, it really took more than that. The washer and perhaps the bolt were coated with a film of black gunk that apparently served as some sort of isolator from the post. Anyway, as is often the case on a boat, when you start to think about giving up, that is when something works. I had gotten to the point of even researching a new windlass even though I like the durability if this old thing.

Thanks for the help everyone. It gave me ideas to pursue and now it's working. I am going to go back to that 80 foot deep spot and let out all the chain, just to feel even better about the fix.
__________________
The next best thing to playing and winning
is playing and losing ...
[I]
PamlicoTraveler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2013, 11:45   #22
֍֎֍֎֍֎֍֎֍֎

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 13,033
Re: How to find & fix a short in windlass

When you reassembled the ground, did you put silicon grease or anything on the parts? That ensures they will not corrode in the future. They still make good metal-to-metal contact displacing the grease, but it prevents any crud from getting a start on them. NeverSeize will work if you have no dielectric grease.
__________________
hellosailor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-10-2013, 01:17   #23
Registered User
 
PamlicoTraveler's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Depends
Boat: SB 43' Cutter
Posts: 679
Images: 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by hellosailor View Post
When you reassembled the ground, did you put silicon grease or anything on the parts? That ensures they will not corrode in the future. They still make good metal-to-metal contact displacing the grease, but it prevents any crud from getting a start on them. NeverSeize will work if you have no dielectric grease.
No I'd didn't but I should have and I will. I just sprayed it with WD-40, but I should do exactly as you say. It's a damp environment. Thanks!
__________________
The next best thing to playing and winning
is playing and losing ...
[I]
PamlicoTraveler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-10-2013, 03:19   #24
Registered User

Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Cruising the Gulf of Mexico.
Boat: 1980 Morgan 415
Posts: 1,439
All sailboats need a jar of Vaseline close at hand.
__________________
Working on spending my children's inheritance.
Cap Erict3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-10-2013, 17:08   #25
Registered User
 
captainwireman's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Rio Dulce
Boat: Dean Oceancomber 10M
Posts: 125
Re: How to find & fix a short in windlass

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cap Erict3 View Post
All sailboats need a jar of Vaseline close at hand.
I would spend a few bucks on a bottle and a spare of Noalox but Vaseline is far better than nothing although it does not seem to stand up to conditions as well.
__________________

__________________
captainwireman is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off




Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 15:38.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.