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Old 01-05-2016, 08:42   #226
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Re: How do you Crimp #8 AWG Terminals?

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Originally Posted by redsky49 View Post
I guess this is perspective. My entire boat's total 120V capacity is 30 amps. My 120V branch circuits are 15 amps, with the exception on one 20 amp circuit for the heat pump, which are #12 and #10 (though NEC would call for #14 and #12 respectively).

If I had such heavy electrical demand that I had 30 amp circuits (and it was not possible to use a higher voltage or three phase service), I would invest in a proper tool to make crimped fittings/terminals.

In the past, I have made several crimped fittings on heavy wire sizes, 0000 - 350 MCM, for inverters for example. In that case I used a 12 ton portable hydraulic crimper that I was fortunate enough to borrow. A crimper of this type is certainly a luxury, but it makes a perfect crimp.

I think the old maxim, "the right tool for the right job" would serve you well. If your life, or the life of others, could be dependent on your wiring, I would use the correct tool, or maybe run two wires. Your call.
From what you write, you seem to have AWG8 wiring between the shore power inlet, breaker and on to the switch panel?

Like written in posts in this thread, you can crimp #8 perfectly fine by using uninsulated lugs instead of insulated terminals, using a quality ratcheting AWG10 terminal crimper that everybody should have. You then add some heatshrink to insulate and have good AWG8 terminations
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Old 01-05-2016, 13:28   #227
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Re: How do you Crimp #8 AWG Terminals?

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Originally Posted by s/v Jedi View Post
From what you write, you seem to have AWG8 wiring between the shore power inlet, breaker and on to the switch panel?

Like written in posts in this thread, you can crimp #8 perfectly fine by using uninsulated lugs instead of insulated terminals, using a quality ratcheting AWG10 terminal crimper that everybody should have. You then add some heatshrink to insulate and have good AWG8 terminations


We are in accordance regarding uninsulated terminals. I will also confess to having removed a wire strand or two from a conductor (in the past) in order to get a wire to fit a slightly undersized terminal.

WARNING! THREAD HIJACK!

Regarding the 120V shore service to the boat, your question made me go back to check.

The shore power cord for my boat - 30 amp, 120V - is indeed #10 wire (This is a Hubbell cord, Marinco lists the same for their power cord). From the ship's 120V receptacle to the back of the shore power/generator selector, and to the 120V panel, is all #10. From my generator (4.4 KW) it is a #10.

Per the NEC I am in accordance (in my case I am using 105 degree C conductor, in excess of NEC's 90 degree C ratings) with allowable ampacity ratings:

http://www.barr-thorp.com/wp-content...NEC-Tables.pdf

I am not certain how this relates to ABYC standards, though my belief is that they have adopted (with modifications) the NEC standards. NEC is National Electrical Code, the governing document for electrical work in the US. Other countries (may) have differing requirements.

The ABYC here in the US lists, per Table VII-A:

90 Degree C #10 cable - 55A/45A for outside and inside engine spaces.

105 Degree C #10 cable - 60A/51A for outside and inside engine spaces.

ABYC is the American Boat and Yacht Council (ABYC - develops consensus safety standards for the design, construction, equipage, maintenance, and repair of small craft), sort of a Lloyds light. They establish voluntary standards for their dues paying members. The data shown above may not be current.

Exercise due caution when dealing with electricity. 85-90% of boat fires are due to electrical problems. If unsure of your abilities, consult a qualified professional.

Apologies for the thread drift. I usually don't have internet access, and when I do, I tend to run on.

Cheers!
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Old 01-05-2016, 13:39   #228
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Re: How do you Crimp #8 AWG Terminals?

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Originally Posted by redsky49 View Post
Per the NEC I am in accordance (in my case I am using 105 degree C conductor, in excess of NEC's 90 degree C ratings) with allowable ampacity ratings:
It is not the ampacity but the voltage drop that matters. The boats that I've seen all have #8 for 30A and #6 for 50A. The shore power cords are a size smaller to improve handling and reduce cost. Losses add up with length.
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Old 01-05-2016, 14:13   #229
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Re: How do you Crimp #8 AWG Terminals?

Voltage drop is of far greater concern with low voltage DC conductors. Not so much with AC. Are you speaking about boats you have observed in North America?

With the nominal 120V US system, typical measured voltage at the shore side might be anywhere from the 90-130V. For the purpose of calculations, I have always used 110V as the design voltage. Marinas are pretty infamous for poor voltage delivery.

The good thing is that most 120V AC devices are rather tolerant about voltage variance, though there are some significant exceptions.

At this point I will admit that I am a mechanical engineer (retired), and probably know just enough electrical to get myself in trouble. I will defer to others, more qualified, to respond further.
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Old 01-05-2016, 14:15   #230
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Re: How do you Crimp #8 AWG Terminals?

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5lb sledge hammer
I wonder where guys like you lay a hammer crimper down on the boat where you are willing to hit it with a hammer. And how do you do it in a tight area?
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Old 01-05-2016, 15:12   #231
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Re: How do you Crimp #8 AWG Terminals?

Quote:
Originally Posted by redsky49 View Post
Voltage drop is of far greater concern with low voltage DC conductors. Not so much with AC. Are you speaking about boats you have observed in North America?

With the nominal 120V US system, typical measured voltage at the shore side might be anywhere from the 90-130V. For the purpose of calculations, I have always used 110V as the design voltage. Marinas are pretty infamous for poor voltage delivery.

The good thing is that most 120V AC devices are rather tolerant about voltage variance, though there are some significant exceptions.

At this point I will admit that I am a mechanical engineer (retired), and probably know just enough electrical to get myself in trouble. I will defer to others, more qualified, to respond further.
Well... no. Voltage drop for AC follows the same rules as for DC: amps times wire resistance.

The spec for US 110/120V power is that the voltage is 110 +/- 10%. This gives 99-121V. In many cases you get less from a marina and when that is put through two back-to-back shore power cord sets then what is left is often too low. We use that anyway.

Many boats that go bow-first into a slip need two power cords because the inlet is in the cockpit.

Some isolation transformers (like Victron) boost incoming voltage a bit (4%) to compensate, which is nice.
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Old 01-05-2016, 15:22   #232
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Re: How do you Crimp #8 AWG Terminals?

I have this commercial professional tool with a set of dies for various wire & lug sizes. You can probably rent one.
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