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Old 24-09-2013, 14:37   #91
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Re: Lithium Batteries

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Originally Posted by Capt Hugh Wilde View Post
What is your history with these batteries and what are you using for a BMS with them?
Like Maine Sail I'm cycling them to see what they can do. Went from 18 nm to 80 nm with the same battery weight, LiFePO4 vs lead.

No BMS, just a bottom to top balance.
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Old 28-09-2013, 16:00   #92
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Nanopulsers

A good friend of mine who has been a marine electrician for a long time turned me on to these units, and he has been using them for a number of years and has had good result with them.
No more than they cost, I could not see not trying them.
Have any of you had any experience with them

I have already installed them, but it would be nice to get some added feed back on them.

http://www.engines1.com/images/nanop...nanopulser.pdf
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Old 28-09-2013, 16:20   #93
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Re: House bank 6 volt vs 2 volt cells

From a purely statistical point-of-view, fewer bigger cells will be more reliable. If a group of cells has an MTBF(time to failure of 50% of the cells) of, say, 1200 hours, a bank of 6 cells will have a calculated MTBF of 200 hours. If you would use twice as many cells of half the capacity each, the calculated MTBF would drop to 100 hours. So 4 6-volt golf cart batteries (about 200AH each) would be twice as reliable as 4 12-volt batteries hooked in parallel.

What usually drives the decision is form factor and weight considerations.
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Old 29-09-2013, 08:27   #94
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New Question

I have looked at all the different views on this question and I believe I am going to recommend using 6 - 2 volt cells to build the bank.

Now the next question is.

We are planning to use Lifeline AGM batteries.
Is there an AGM brand that you prefer over Lifeline that makes a 2V cell?

And thank you all for your input on Lithium batteries, but my guy isn't ready to take that big a step yet. I wish he was.
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Old 30-10-2013, 18:39   #95
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Solar charger system

I have a Victron Blue Solar MPPT 150/70 charge controller already installed, and this week the 3 - 290 watt LG solar panels came in.

Shouldn't have any trouble keeping this bank charged.
If all the hype is true, with good sun we can make 61 amps, that should make short work of it.
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Old 11-12-2015, 11:38   #96
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Re: House bank 6 volt vs 2 volt cells

I am dredging up an old thread because I'm evaluating battery options since we had a little electronics issue in relation to lightning this summer. Our insurance company is covering the cost of replacing our battery bank and we have to select new batteries.

Currently we are using 4 x 6v (Trojan T-145p) but I am thinking we can fit 6 x 2 Volt Lifeline AGMs. We could sure use the Ah capacity and I am convinced that with their world wide distribution network that I should be able to get replacements just about anywhere.

A couple of notes before I ask my questions:

We have only one high amp charging source - our engine alternator is a Balmar 165 Amp. Then we have wind and solar but they top out at about 40 amps on a good day. Our shore power charger is a 70 AMP Mastervolt.

We currently use about 200 Ah a day but expect to almost halve that by replacing the fridge insulation and refrigeration equipment this summer.

This would mean we would only be discharging the batteries by about 8 to 10% a day (the 2 volts have a capacity of 1200 Ah). We could reduce weight and go with 900 Ah batteries but I like having the extra capacity for weeks where its cloudy.

I have a couple of questions about the lifeline 2 volt batteries:

1) What has been their historic reliability? Where do they fit on the scale of reliability?
2) Will cycling them by only 10% reduce their lifespan?
3) Will charging them with only 25 to 35 amps from the solar negatively impact their lifespan and performance?
4) How much space do I need to leave between the batteries for airflow and expansion?
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Old 11-12-2015, 12:50   #97
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Re: House bank 6 volt vs 2 volt cells

For off grid homes I've had very good life from 2 volt AGM cells. On a boat for ease of replacement combined with a redundant bank I would opt for two strings of the 66 lb., 660 ahr @ 20 hour rate cells. In the highly unlikely scenario of a cell going bad you still have the other string. So total of (12) 2 volt cells in two series 12 volt strings. Total 1320 ahr @ 12 volts, ease of lifting them, and a redundant battery bank.

As to your questions,

1.) I've seen longer life spans from the 2 Volt cells than the common L16 6 volt.
2.) 10% DOD will lengthen cell life vs 50% DOD
3.) What shortens the life of a battery is spending time fully discharged. With any lead acid battery you should size it for max 50% DOD.
4.) Powering typical house loads and charging at 0.2C won't generate heat or cause expansion so they can be side by side with no problem.
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Old 11-12-2015, 13:00   #98
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Re: House bank 6 volt vs 2 volt cells

Yeah, I'd like to have a dozen batteries totaling 1320 AH myself, only two problems, I can't afford that and I'd have nowhere to put all of them
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Old 11-12-2015, 16:52   #99
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Re: House bank 6 volt vs 2 volt cells

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Originally Posted by zboss View Post
I am dredging up an old thread because I'm evaluating battery options since we had a little electronics issue in relation to lightning this summer. Our insurance company is covering the cost of replacing our battery bank and we have to select new batteries.

Currently we are using 4 x 6v (Trojan T-145p) but I am thinking we can fit 6 x 2 Volt Lifeline AGMs. We could sure use the Ah capacity and I am convinced that with their world wide distribution network that I should be able to get replacements just about anywhere.

A couple of notes before I ask my questions:

We have only one high amp charging source - our engine alternator is a Balmar 165 Amp. Then we have wind and solar but they top out at about 40 amps on a good day. Our shore power charger is a 70 AMP Mastervolt.

We currently use about 200 Ah a day but expect to almost halve that by replacing the fridge insulation and refrigeration equipment this summer.

This would mean we would only be discharging the batteries by about 8 to 10% a day (the 2 volts have a capacity of 1200 Ah). We could reduce weight and go with 900 Ah batteries but I like having the extra capacity for weeks where its cloudy.

I have a couple of questions about the lifeline 2 volt batteries:

1) What has been their historic reliability? Where do they fit on the scale of reliability?
2) Will cycling them by only 10% reduce their lifespan?
3) Will charging them with only 25 to 35 amps from the solar negatively impact their lifespan and performance?
4) How much space do I need to leave between the batteries for airflow and expansion?
I think the 900 amp hrs would give you enough, but if the have the room for the larger batteries, it never hurts, but going to them would nearly double your current battery capacity. Your current bank weighs 288 lbs, 6 1200 amp 2 volt Lifelines weight 714 lbs. The 900 Amp hr bank would weight 540 lbs.

I think the 900's would be your best bet.
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Old 11-12-2015, 19:20   #100
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Re: House bank 6 volt vs 2 volt cells

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Yeah, I'd like to have a dozen batteries totaling 1320 AH myself, only two problems, I can't afford that and I'd have nowhere to put all of them
Its only 6 batteries. Either the larger 2v (1200 Ah) or the smaller 2v (900 Ah) both have the same footprint (by battery) as the Trojans. I currently have four batts and can make room for 2 more.

I may just as well go for the 900 Ah, I'm not sure it would make much difference at all in power, in a practical sense, but as a responder pointed out it is a lot less weight.

That would still give us 4 days of non-conservation-mode power. If it hits four days and I'm still down, I crank up the engine and go for a toot around the island for two hours, maybe catch some Tuna! Here is the thing, I had bought a Honda generator to make up for the fact that I only had one day of reserve power and if the sun didn't magically appear I had to run the engine, and I didn't want to do that on a regular basis. With this new battery bank and lower consumption, I'm in a situation where I may not need the generator.
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Old 11-12-2015, 19:51   #101
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Re: House bank 6 volt vs 2 volt cells

Someone else was abdicating a dozen batteries I think, but I may have misread that.
I don't have a whole lot of of experience with this yet, but it seems once I get behind in the battery charge status, I have a heck of a time catching up, plus if you go AGM's you really want them fully recharged as much as possible. Only way I have been able to accomplish that is shore power or a generator or a long motoring, I'm better off with the generator as I can shove 185 amps that was as opposed to 140 with my Alternator. I'm discharging the bank as we speak with the idea of seeing in the morning if my Alt will really make full power or not now that I have an ammeter on it.
With AGM's I don't see anyway around a generator or frequent Marina visits etc.


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Old 12-12-2015, 19:34   #102
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Re: House bank 6 volt vs 2 volt cells

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Originally Posted by a64pilot View Post
Someone else was abdicating a dozen batteries I think, but I may have misread that.
I don't have a whole lot of of experience with this yet, but it seems once I get behind in the battery charge status, I have a heck of a time catching up, plus if you go AGM's you really want them fully recharged as much as possible. Only way I have been able to accomplish that is shore power or a generator or a long motoring, I'm better off with the generator as I can shove 185 amps that was as opposed to 140 with my Alternator. I'm discharging the bank as we speak with the idea of seeing in the morning if my Alt will really make full power or not now that I have an ammeter on it.
With AGM's I don't see anyway around a generator or frequent Marina visits etc.


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I saw that too... I guess if I had the room that would be nice but like you I do not.

If I were going to do a backup battery configuration instead of using six 2v batteries for the backup, I would use a single 12 volt firefly carbon foam connected to an echo charger. With 80% discharge capacity I could easily run most of my daily needs off that one battery. If we went into deep conservation mode I bet we COULD make 80 Ah work.

In fact, now that I have said that... two of those batteries aren't looking like such a bad idea
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