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Old 02-02-2015, 18:54   #31
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Re: Home Made Shorepower Cords

I am not offended nor do I wish to offend.
By the way I just checked out Lush, the Oyster 885 that is for sale for about 4.5 million British pounds. It has a normal looking 50-amp cord.
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Old 02-02-2015, 19:19   #32
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Re: Home Made Shorepower Cords

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Originally Posted by Charlie View Post
I just clicked on a wire size calculator Wire Size Calculator and found that 208v three phase can run 50 amps on a #10 wire if you drop it to single phase it would require a #8. I don't understand why but I guess the number of phases is the big difference.
I get #14 for 16 amps, 240 volts, single phase, copper, 50 feet. That's 2mm squared in metric.

How I wouldn't want to go back to wimpy 120v. All those amps -- dangerous.

I made my own shore power cord. My boat has a 32 amp Marinco connection at the boat end, but our power is all 16 amps, so a blue 16 amp end plug on the land end. This is really not rocket science. I used 4mm squared wire to give some reserve.

The other good thing about Euro power cords is that you can carry an extension cord. I have a 30 meter extension cord which allows me to hook up almost anywhere.

The down side to Euro shore power is that the sockets are not entirely standardized. In Estonia and Russia I ran across standard Schuco sockets (!). I happened to have an adapter (don't ask me why I bought it). The French have some oddball sockets I've never seen before; I had to borrow an adapter. That wasn't so bad, but the 4 amp (!) service in St. Malo and some other places was a bummer.

And in Scandinavia, I did occasionally find 32 amp type sockets (even though the power was only 16 amps). Note to self -- by that adapter.

I also think about being a "Y" connector to join two 4 amp connections to make one 8 amp connection. Can any electrician say whether that works?
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Old 03-02-2015, 08:53   #33
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Re: Home Made Shorepower Cords

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Originally Posted by dohenyboy View Post
Another thing I have noticed walking here on the dock is that nearly all the sailboats here are from the UK and they employ home made shore power cords. This includes not only 30 amp cords, but the 50 amp 125/250 cords as well.
It appears that the boat owners have bought the Marinco male and female connectors, and attached them to a piece of outdoor extension cord. Sometimes, on the 30 amp cords, the boat end of the cord retains the female plug that came with the extension cord.
I know that a 30 amp cord runs about $100 and the 50 amp ones are almost $500 for a 50-foot cord. Expensive, yes. But when you consider that the 50 amp Marinco etc. cord is make up of four 6 gauge wires plus insulation, and compare to the size of these home-made lines, seems to me that there is a fire waiting to happen.
Just compare the size of the cords in these photos, home-made versus the standard
Most of these yachts by the way look like they are worth well over $1 million.
Makes me wonder about what other short cuts lurk inside. Or am I wrong?

Part of the reason is that its difficult to buy complete 230VAC shore power cables in the UK and Europe generally , most people , make up their own.

secondally, Blue cable is the correct colour for 230VAC ( Red for three phase ). Yellow is 110 and should be avoided.

The other reason is that European boats and marina pillars use IEC 60309 sty;le plugs and sockets, and not the quite frankly useless marinco/US flat style connector, that typically arcs and burns.

I always use ARTIC marked cables , typically to BS6500, which is rated to +5 degrees C or better. fittings are typically "water resistant" to Ip55. Theres not much point in having after greater degree of water tightness.

IN my view ( as a professional engineer) The combination of IEC 60309, and BS6500 rated components results in a superior cable to the standard Marinco style US shore cable.

Dave
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Old 03-02-2015, 09:01   #34
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Re: Home Made Shorepower Cords

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Originally Posted by goboatingnow View Post
...........
IN my view ( as a professional engineer) The combination of IEC 60309, and BS6500 rated components results in a superior cable to the standard Marinco style US shore cable.
The Marinco style US shore cable system certainly leaves a lot of room for improvement and one company has already tried (in the USA), but the problem with trying to invent or use something better is, the shorepower outlets in the USA are pretty standardized and you would have to buy and carry adapters for every marina you visit. And using the adapters, you would be no better off than using the standard plugs in the first place.

Even using an improved connector on the boat end means your boat is now non-standard and you can't borrow or buy a cable if you need a replacement or longer cable.
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Old 03-02-2015, 09:07   #35
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Re: Home Made Shorepower Cords

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Even using an improved connector on the boat end means your boat is now non-standard and you can't borrow or buy a cable if you need a replacement or longer cable.
Indeed and one of the big advantages of IEC60309 connectors is that they are increasingly standard in Europe on boats and marina pillars, In fact , with the exception of one or two places, I have havent used anything else in recent years in the med.

(and as the cables are symmetrical , i can use by friends spare ones as extension cables longest run so far 350 metres , wee bit of a voltage drop problem though )

dave
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Old 03-02-2015, 09:28   #36
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Re: Home Made Shorepower Cords

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Originally Posted by goboatingnow View Post
IN my view ( as a professional engineer) The combination of IEC 60309, and BS6500 rated components results in a superior cable to the standard Marinco style US shore cable.

Dave
Preach it brother! I absolutely agree, also as a PE - EE. One of my biggest frustrations here in the States is the ubiquity of Marinco style connectors. My career has been in the petroleum and chemical industries where use of IEC (60)309 connectors helps mitigate risk in explosive or corrosive atmospheres. I've always wondered why the US marine industry never leveraged off this existing, wholly adequate standard.
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Old 10-02-2015, 03:14   #37
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Re: Home Made Shorepower Cords

What is the best way to waterproof the cable to plug join, or is it pointless as so many binnacle sockets are not weatherproofed?
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Old 10-02-2015, 06:08   #38
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Re: Home Made Shorepower Cords

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What is the best way to waterproof the cable to plug join,
You can't and that is the reason for buying pre-made molded cord sets.
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Old 10-02-2015, 06:12   #39
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Re: Home Made Shorepower Cords

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Originally Posted by Garrettw View Post
Preach it brother! I absolutely agree, also as a PE - EE. One of my biggest frustrations here in the States is the ubiquity of Marinco style connectors. My career has been in the petroleum and chemical industries where use of IEC (60)309 connectors helps mitigate risk in explosive or corrosive atmospheres. I've always wondered why the US marine industry never leveraged off this existing, wholly adequate standard.
There are several thousand marinas in the USA using the "Marinco style connectors". Crappy as they are, they are the standard for the USA. Boaters can't change their cords unless the marinas change their sockets and marinas can't change their sockets until most boaters change their cords.
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Old 10-02-2015, 10:02   #40
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Re: Home Made Shorepower Cords

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What is the best way to waterproof the cable to plug join, or is it pointless as so many binnacle sockets are not weatherproofed?
Silicone sealant
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Old 10-02-2015, 11:39   #41
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Re: Home Made Shorepower Cords

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There are several thousand marinas in the USA using the "Marinco style connectors". Crappy as they are, they are the standard for the USA. Boaters can't change their cords unless the marinas change their sockets and marinas can't change their sockets until most boaters change their cords.
I suppose what I was really getting at was that I don't know the history of Marinco's "standard" and what ultimately led to its USA installed base over other standards.
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Old 10-02-2015, 12:45   #42
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Re: Home Made Shorepower Cords

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I suppose what I was really getting at was that I don't know the history of Marinco's "standard" and what ultimately led to its USA installed base over other standards.
If I had to guess I would guess that the standard was already in place and Marinco is just the best known manufacturer of these plugs and sockets.
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Old 10-02-2015, 14:22   #43
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Re: Home Made Shorepower Cords

For some reason I'm thinking It was Hubbell who got the marinized line going well... but Marinco took over by marketing or marketing more choices....?
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Old 10-02-2015, 14:44   #44
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Re: Home Made Shorepower Cords

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There are some smart people on this thread and some good responses, but...

... would someone explain to me why people without a 10th grade understanding of electricity would post opinions? Without any knowledge of resistance, heating, NEC, or ohms law? It's plain dangerous. We worry about fires; I saw a guy get completely toasted by unfused 460/3 because he tried something he didn't understand. He lived, but his hand was melted to a pair of pliers.

I refuse to post on diesel engines, because I don't run them. It's kind of like that.
I hear you!
There are plenty "jacks of all trades & masters of none" in these forums, no disrespect meant to anyone.
As sailors need to be obviously, how ever there can be great communication of ideas, experience and lessons learned from these forums........you just better be wise enough to differentiate, then of course there is MAINE SAIL, he won't steer you wrong.
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Old 10-02-2015, 15:37   #45
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Re: Home Made Shorepower Cords

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Small cords keep the snow on the docks melted.
That explains why there's no snow on the docks in the West Indies!
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