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Old 10-04-2010, 22:09   #31
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yeah, it's not like wires ever get hot.

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Originally Posted by Don Lucas View Post
I'm having a hard time believing soldered connecions just melting. I would tend to believe if they melt there was a bigger problem already.
This is a huge non-issue. On boats, crimps work, solder does not.
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Old 10-04-2010, 22:12   #32
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Ratcheting Crimpers?.......Don't leave port without them......

Chuck those single crimper tools and the pack of assorted terminals that come with them.

Connectors? I buy them by the box.....you will go to the po'house if you buy them in the three packs....because you ALWAYS need 4!!!!!!!

I have seen many...many soldered wires.....95% of them were't worth a fiddlers farrago......then they were wrapped with electrical tape.......might as well put them together with Home Depot wire nuts and liquid electtrical tape.
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Old 10-04-2010, 22:25   #33
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Well, now that we've clearly settled the crimp vs. solder issue....

What about those euro-style terminal blocks? Where the wire goes in a little hole and a screw is tightened down on it? I've use a few to fix the mess of wires in the nav station. For power distribution and NMEA signals. A plus is no crimp tool, no crimp terminal, half the number of connections as the there is no terminal to terminal strip interface. No solder either...

Unlike the useless wire-under-screwhead old-school technique, these screws exert a huge point pressure on the conductor. Probably not a physically strong as a crimp, which is related to the rigging crimp, but I don't plan on hanging any anchors in my nav station....

Whaddya think?

They're very common in industrial controls and commercial electrical projects.
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Old 10-04-2010, 22:58   #34
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I use them on occasion...in areas where I know they will remain dry...sometimes on instruments whose plugs have broken or where the plugs can't be pulled though tight areas
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Old 11-04-2010, 05:07   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maine Sail View Post
Bubble,

Which crimper is it? Most any good double ratchet crimper is uni-directional. You need to insert the wire & connector into the correct side of the tool. With the Ancor tool the wire goes in the side with the color coded dots. This side of the crimp die makes the strain relief crimp and the other one makes the wire crimp. The two sides of the dies are not the same size!!


They are called "double crimp" because they make two crimps, one for strain relief and one for the bare wire. If you use the wrong side the crimp will fail.




Also you need to use the proper connectors with the proper crimper. Any good quality insulated double crimp connector will be made of three pieces. Use a cheapo terminal, with only two pieces and thin walls, and the tool will not get a good crimp because the connector is too small for the crimp dies.
I can't believe that I didn't know that the wire HAD to go in my anchor ratcheting crimper from only one side. That explains why every once in a while it doesn't work for me!

OK, I have another potentially silly crimping question. Is there a trick to using a butt connector to connect two wires of different size diameters?

Thanks for the good info.

Mike
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Old 11-04-2010, 05:15   #36
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mike, they do make step down butt connectors, but if your in a pinch and only have a regular butt connector, you can strip the smaller wire much longer and fold it on itself a few times to increase the thickness...
i know i know, not the best practice, but it will get the job done in a pinch
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Old 11-04-2010, 05:20   #37
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Thanks pressuredrop. That is exactly what I did. After doing so someone told me about the step-down connectors. I have yet to come across any though.

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Old 11-04-2010, 05:50   #38
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Shhhh!!--did someone say "insurance company fire investigator" :
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Old 11-04-2010, 06:06   #39
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Now I know I can't...........

Can someone tell me the best way to solder 2 wires together?

There is 3 wires I need to do because connectors wont get though the hole to hide them

Does one twist the wires together first then melt the solder over them?

I notice soldering is something that requires 3 or 4 hands. 1 for the iron, one for the solder and 1 or 2 for the thing being soldered. What fool invented it!?

Talking about fools: I must be one as I actually looked up on the net for these all great rachet type crimpers. You guys are seriuosly loony if you think I am spending $300 on a pair!


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Old 11-04-2010, 06:17   #40
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Hi Mark,

Scroll back up the thread about halfway. I found the Ancor double ratchet crimpers on Amazon for $59.16 with free shipping.

Of course, free shipping or even shipping at all doesn't apply to whatever little hole you're currently anchored in. Guess that's the price you have to pay to sail off to exotic locales while the rest of us read about it on the forum.
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Old 11-04-2010, 06:49   #41
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Mark, the best way i have found to make a solder joint is to start by making sure the wires to be soldered are clean, shiny, and not corroded. If they show any sign of corrosion cut back to clean wire before attempting to solder. Cut 2 pieces of heatshrink for each joint, make them longer by around an inch each side of the joint. slip them over the wire, then twist the bare ends together tightly parallel to each other, get them as tight as possible. I find it easiest, when location permits, to support or clamp the iron using a c-clamp or vise grips, or find some way to prop the iron (make sure it won't fall!) and you'll then have 1 hand for wires, the other for solder. Once the iron gets hot, tin the tip, and leave a small bead of solder sagging off, then put the twisted connection in the bead (quick heat transfer) and apply solder at the same time. You'll see the solder melt and spread fast, don't hold there long. While that cools, go on to the next joint. If it's a long job, keep a wet sponge handy to wipe the tip of the iron, then re tin and bead. After the wires have cooled, wipe a bit of dielectric grease on the joint and wire insulation near it, (just a little works fine, no need for excess) then slip the first piece of heat shrink over and apply heat, when fully shrunk slip the second piece over and do the same. You will have a strong and well supported joint that is protected against impact, vibration, moisture, and causing stray voltage in wet environments or if submerged. I am not an engineer or electrition, but have spent over 25 years building and operating everything from R/C airplanes/boats/racing to ORV's, mud trucks and all sorts of motorcycles (boats too). I've never had a joint like this fail for any reason, and it's far easier to tell when they are done right and when they are not. Large ratcheting crimps in tight areas make for difficult (at best) proper use, then sealing a large crimp properly (to my satisfaction) is difficult at best and creates sharp corners to potentially wear thru insulation faster. They may be fine for large ships and airplanes with long, open wire runs, but IMHO are just a better way for the average worker connect wires, and not necessarily the best way TO connect wires.
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Old 11-04-2010, 06:51   #42
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Quote:
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Does one twist the wires together first then melt the solder over them?
Yes. You can use a "lineman splice" (google it or see the attached photos). Don't forget to put shrink tubing over the splice.

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Originally Posted by MarkJ View Post
I notice soldering is something that requires 3 or 4 hands. 1 for the iron, one for the solder and 1 or 2 for the thing being soldered.
You got it.

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Talking about fools: I must be one as I actually looked up on the net for these all great rachet type crimpers. You guys are seriuosly loony if you think I am spending $300 on a pair!
You can actually get one for about $50-$60 USD. Worth it, even for a cheapskate like me.
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Old 11-04-2010, 07:44   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeandrebecca View Post
I can't believe that I didn't know that the wire HAD to go in my anchor ratcheting crimper from only one side. That explains why every once in a while it doesn't work for me!

OK, I have another potentially silly crimping question. Is there a trick to using a butt connector to connect two wires of different size diameters?

Thanks for the good info.

Mike
Yes, for the smaller gauge of the two wires, bend the wire 180 degrees at the very end so you essentially have two thicknesses of the wire being crimped. Or wrap the wires around each other first and then put both in at the same end of the butt connector. If you can, avoid using butt connectors because of the possible voltage drop across them.
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Old 11-04-2010, 08:02   #44
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NASA’s Terminating Standards

Soldered ➥ http://www.hq.nasa.gov/office/codeq/doctree/NS87393.pdf

Crimped ➥ http://www.hq.nasa.gov/office/codeq/doctree/87394.pdf
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Old 11-04-2010, 08:12   #45
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Thanks Ziggy, My2ndWind and Skipper Mac

Great info. Great photos. Looks easy. LOL <--- watch me stuff it up!


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