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Old 22-01-2006, 11:13   #1
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Post China to Build World's First 'Artificial Sun' Experimental Device

A full superconducting experimental Tokamak fusion device, which aims to generate infinite, clean nuclear-fusion-based energy, will be built in March or April in Hefei, capital city of east China`s Anhui Province.

Experiments with the advanced new device will start in July or August. If the experiments prove successful, China will become the first country in the world to build a full superconducting experimental Tokamak fusion device, nicknamed "artificial sun", experts here said.

The project, dubbed EAST (experimental advanced superconducting Tokamak), is being undertaken by the Hefei-based Institute of Plasma Physics under the Chinese Academy of Sciences. It will require a total investment of nearly 300 million yuan (37 million U.S. dollars), only one fifteenth to one twentieth the cost of similar devices being developed in the other parts of the world.

The new device will be an upgrade of China`s first superconducting Tokamak device, dubbed HT-7, which was also built by the plasma physics institute, in partnership with Russia, in the early 1990s. HT-7 made China the fourth country in the world, after Russia, France and Japan, to have such a device.

"The EAST project research results will be significant for the International Thermonuclear Experiment Reactor, or ITER, in terms of basic research both in engineering technology and physics," said Wan Yuanxi, who is in charge of the project.

Wan said ITER will also be a full superconducting experimental Tokamak fusion device with an advanced configuration, but much larger than EAST.

The program, still in its initial stages, involves Russia, Japan, the United States, the European Union, China and the Republic of Korea.

Controlled nuclear fusion is seen as an efficient way for people to generate infinite, clean energy to offset the dearth of fossil fuels such as oil and coal.

Scientists believe that deuterium can be extracted from the sea and an enormous amount of energy can be obtained from a deuterium-tritium fusion reaction under huge temperatures of 100 million degrees Celsius. After nuclear fusion, the deuterium extracted from one liter of sea water will produce energy equivalent to 300 liters of gasoline.

If a device is developed that can withstand temperatures as high as 100 million Celsius degrees and control a deuterium-tritium reaction, it will be as though an "artificial sun" had been created able to supply infinite, clean energy for human beings.
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Old 22-01-2006, 11:49   #2
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Sun

They need an artificial sun as the one we use is being blocked by them with polution. They lose about one month per year growing time from crap in the air that stops the sun getting through. BC sells them the coal. If they expand there space the way we have in North America they would use up all the growing fields for shopping malls and roads. Chindia ( China and India ) have some major logistical challenges facing them, due mostly to the size of their populations. If they all used as much resources as we do in North America, there just would not be enough to go around. It could be time that we start to lead and clean up our own act with regards to energy consumption. This is made difficult in Canada and parts of the US because it is so darn cold in the winter, and so darn hot in the summer. There is however a gradual movement to make changes. We are finally getting the super thrifty small cars here, like wat they have in Europe. In the meantime we ( in Canada ) get cheap stuff made in China. Tools are cheaper now than when I was a kid. Chindia turns out educated people on a massive scale.
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Old 22-01-2006, 12:23   #3
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Hey Michael.

I too, have noticed that tools were more expensive in the past. And that China has been exporting out of their country cheaper tools.

Their tools are sometimes less quality made than U.S. or European made tools are? But, diffinately cheaper.

Yeah those countries over there. Not enough resources to go around. Like both our countries have. And yeah. You're right about it gets hot in the summer. Here in Phoenix, Arizona. An average summer day here is around 115 F / 46.1 C.
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Old 22-01-2006, 14:39   #4
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Tools

This is a popular subject with my red neck tractor buddies. We have a trade suplus in Canada, so we can buy tools made in China and they can buy our coal. But the Yankees currently have a large trade deficit so buying more foreign does not help. I just got a new 1/3 sheet sander for $20-. I have bought sets of wrenches ( spanners ) for $10- which is the old price for only one. My 2 1/2 ton floor jack that I purchased to work on the brakes was cheaper that paying for the brake job at the shop. It also lifts the boat with a four foot eye beam as a lever.
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Old 22-01-2006, 14:41   #5
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Hmmmm, so what would you call the China Syndrome if it were to start in China. The America syndrome??Doesn't kinda sound right.
I get a little edgy when countries start playing with that sort of stuff. I mean, how the heck to you contain a 100mill degrees. And if you did, imagine what would happen if the containment failed. Yikes!
I hate nuclear energy, but at least it can be controlled to an extent, but fusion is another ball game. Once it's active, it remains active (as far as I understand). What happens in a hundred years or a thousand years or ten thousand years from now. How to you stop it if you want or need to.
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Old 22-01-2006, 14:46   #6
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Very carefully Wheels.

Fusion energy is something to be very careful with.

I'm not a scientist. But, I believe it has something to do with "matter" & "anti-matter?"

If those two were to collide with eachother. KABOOM!! And the entire planet Earth is history. Or something like that?
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Old 22-01-2006, 16:36   #7
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This is a very basic explanation to what the differences are. It is not intended to be exact as exact is a little complex and nerdy. I'll go there if somone really wants.
The main difference is the way energy is produced in a "nuclear" reaction. In Fission, atoms a collide and are blown apart and the resulting energy pruduces vast quantities of heat. But with the destruction of the Atom, radiation such as Gamma rays and Xarrays and so on are also produced.
In Nuclear Fussion, the atoms are fused together, once again resulting in heat energy, but with much less radiation as the Atom is not striped away. When the two Atom's fuse, they become a heavier element. Thus creating something else. Becuase of the intense heat, these "new" elements also fuse together and become the next heaviest element. Thus the energy cycle can be prolonged as fuel is not actually "burn't up as such, but is converted. Eventually the elements are too heavey to produce enough energy during a collision and the Fusion starts to degrade and eventually fades away. But that's along time.
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Old 22-01-2006, 16:42   #8
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I should have added. At the present, the only way to produce Nuclear Fussion, is to have mega heat to start the cycle and to continue it. The heat also means some atoms still are in nuclear Fission mode. It's kinda an out of controll, controlled process. Nuclear Fission could be considered a controlled out of controll process.
The holy Grail is Cold Fussion. Cold Fusion will produce the same energy as Nuclear, but without the heat. Thus also without the radiation and the radio active waste. But it still remains out of reach thus far.

It's also a point to make, the Deuterium produced from 1ltr of seawater, is small. Really small. So hence the energy produced adding up to about 300Gal worth of Petrol. If the entire 1ltr of water could be turned into fuel, it would run a car for about 10,000yrs. So it is a very efficient way of producing energy.
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Old 22-01-2006, 18:42   #9
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Wheels is 100% accurate in his top-level description of fusion. I say this as a person who has a degree in Physics, worked on NASA spacecraft that measure solar-terrestrial plasma levels, and took grad courses in Plasma Physics and Controlled Fusion.

The Tokamak cannot run out of control and blow up the earth. Not enough fuel or heat to sustain the fusion reaction if there was a breech. Also, as Wheels said, it's a bit cleaner than fission, which is what we use in all reactors to date.

All in all, if they can get more energy out of the reactor than they put in to heat it, it's a success. That is the difficult part about starting and sustaining a controlled fusion reaction.
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Old 22-01-2006, 18:55   #10
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Wheels are you related to Rutherford, he was from your area.
For those that do not know he was the first guy to split an atom. Another Kiwi first.
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Old 22-01-2006, 20:55   #11
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Yep, we had Rutherford AND William Pickering come from here. I suspect Sean will know who William Pickering was. He was a young Kiwi Lad that got one of those really cool jobs. He ran JPL back in the 50's and was the guy behind getting Explorer 1 into space three months after the Russians launched Sputnick.
In 1958, NASA was formed. At that time, NASA had three distinct charters.
1: Near Earth Satellites. To make measurements of Earth from space. To explore the near Earth environment. explore the Cosmos from observing points points above Earth's Atmosphere.

2eep space missions to explore the Solar Systems.

3: The development of manned space travel.

As the director of JPL, William argued for and recieved the charter to develop deep space missions. William was essentially given the contract to, "Go out and Explore the deeps of the Solar system"

William was born in Wellington and lived as a wee Lad on Roxburgh street. He made the front cover of Time Magazine on March the 8th 1963. The heading.... William Pickering: From Roxburgh Street to Venus.
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Old 22-01-2006, 21:44   #12
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Well Wheels & Sean.

I was kinda joking around about the anti-matter thing. But, how dothey control the heat factor?

How do they keep it from melting the housing for this device? Makes me wonder about certain things?
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Old 22-01-2006, 23:47   #13
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Simply put, there is nothing in the universe that can withstand 100mill degrees. It's the very reason why the fussion works. All the material is beyond physical substance and exists in a plasma world. Super super super, (add as many in as you want) heated gases of the elements being used and created. It will be an electromagnetic containment I suspect. In otherwords, the Plasma is being contained by a force feild using magnetics. This has been done for many years now. Veriouse other products like the ceramics on the Space shuttle are created this way. They heat required are far above any metals we have that could possibily hold anything like that molten. The pure ceramics used in the heat tiles, would take on elements from the containers, so they have to be contained in a way that no other contamination can enter the ceramic.
The same thing twith the Fussion. Deuterium is used because it is a "controlled " base to start the Fussion from. Knowing what elements are created and how fast and how long and so on, allows for the control to continue. If an element of some other material got into the Fussion chamber, you will have other elements being created. In such a small controlled environment, this can lead to all sorts of problems. Think of it this way, with such huge numbers of degree's involved, with so many atoms colliding, a fraction of a percent outside the calculations could be catastrophic.
This process is basically what the Sun is. A massive Thermonuclear Fussion.
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Old 23-01-2006, 01:26   #14
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**** so much for scoring a few brontasaurouse ribbs and spending a night by the fire with your over-hairy female neandertal,not that there is anything wrong with a hairy nipple,I have encounted a few,I suppose 6 different models of the same car ,with 10 different colour scheams with 5 different sports packs and matching interior made this kind of tecknology nesicary.Too much,too late ,too deep.But it does sound allright.Lets hope we dont have to pay out of our realm of exsistance to be able to afford it.PS.Dont pay out on my spelling,I have all your posts on file.
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Old 23-01-2006, 06:50   #15
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Yeah Wheels.

I figured the best material for a containment lining, would be tiles like they use on the space shuttle.

I also liked what mudnut said. Good point, with funny view. Brontosaurus Ribs, yum yum!!
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