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Old 07-10-2007, 13:02   #1
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Can this Trojan T105 be saved?

One of my T105's has a dead cell. The other 3 are fine.

I have a series/parallel 12 volt system and the batteries are about 10 to 12 years old.

The hydrometer bulb won't even float at all on the center cell, but the other two are fine.

I tried putting 30 amps through it from a big old charger but no change.

Can I blast it with a high current from a 12 volt battery or something?


Suggestions would be appreciated (especially from Rick)

Steve B.
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Old 07-10-2007, 13:15   #2
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Well taken care of Trojans going 10 years is pretty good. I've heard stories of 14 years but it's not common. My own experience is 7 years is as good as I ever saw. One bad cell is a serious problem because it will trick the charging system into cooking the whole bank. You can't fix one cell.

I really would not trust either batteries as a replacment won;'t really match the one that appears OK. I would remove both batteries and any others if you havppen tom have 4. A bank of 4 T105's is a popular house bank. I'm using 4 right now that are new.
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Old 07-10-2007, 13:27   #3
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Paul,

I realized what was happening within one day of plugging in the charger (xantrex 20+)
and the batteries never went dry, so I think the others are still ok. A quick check with a voltmeter showed between 6.5 and 6.9 on each battery, but the bad one was 4.4v.
These batteries perform engine start as well as house.

Steve B.
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Old 07-10-2007, 13:29   #4
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You get in trouble replacing just one battery. They should be of similar age so they can take the same charging. The pattern is the bad one trashes the good one.
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Old 07-10-2007, 13:40   #5
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A TWELVE year-old battery (of any type), that exhibits less than ideal characteristics, can be considered trash (that has MORE THAN paid for itself).
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Old 07-10-2007, 14:03   #6
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I agree with Gord. If your T-105's are 12 years old, replace them and don't even think about it. Unless you're going for some sort of record, in which case nobody will believe you, anyway :-)

You've got far more than your money's worth from these. Time for an update.

Bill
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Old 08-10-2007, 19:07   #7
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Ok, you all convinced me. Well, halfway anyway. I took 2 of them off and left the other two. The remaining ones still check fine with a hydrometer and I recalibrated my e meter to reflect the reduced ah capacity.

BTW, I raised the stern by over a half inch!
This may cause me to go on a weight and electricity savings rage, installing LED lights etc.

Steve B.
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Old 08-10-2007, 20:25   #8
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Quote:
took 2 of them off and left the other two. The remaining ones still check fine with a hydrometer and I recalibrated my e meter to reflect the reduced ah capacity.
OK so one cell in the old batteries goes south and trashes the whole bank. Think of all the money you'll save.
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Old 08-10-2007, 20:41   #9
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I'm not cheap, I'm just thrifty!

From all I've read above, anything I get from the remaining batteries (2 six volt) is gravy, and having an electronic background I think I'll know when it's time to send the remaining ones to the recycle farm.

I'll keep you posted on how long the remaining bank lasts.

Steve B.
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Old 08-10-2007, 20:48   #10
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From all I've read above, anything I get from the remaining batteries (2 six volt) is gravy, and having an electronic background I think I'll know when it's time to send the remaining ones to the recycle farm.
The charging profile on the new vs. old batteries can't be worse than what you want to do. It will of course work - for a while. Meanwhile the new batteries take a beating while you attempt to beat the dead horse until it dies. Then down the road the new batteries that were trashed kill the not as old batteries you saved money on. All the money saved today just compounds.
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Old 08-10-2007, 22:02   #11
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Paul,
I'm NOT replacing any batteries. I had 4, one died, so I removed one more and am going with the 2 that are left.

No new ones (yet), and when I get new ones, I'll buy 4 and dump the two remaining old ones.

After all is said and done I'll be able to say,

"No batteries were harmed during the making of this excercise."


Steve B.
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Old 09-10-2007, 04:51   #12
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Do the kind thing and give it a proper burial.
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Old 09-10-2007, 08:19   #13
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The battery cell could have failed by partial parting of one of the pole connections, but it sounds more like a sulphate problem.

There are two ways to address a sulphate problem. the addition of a chelate to the solution that will help grab the sulphate off the plate (avialable in auto and hardware stores), works a little bit.

The best way if possible is to insert a small air bubbler in the battery, and use a fish pump to push air in and the bubbling action will help dislodge the sulphate from the plates. Works great.

But check the bubbler out, with some the acid just disintegrates the bubbler. There may be enough sulphate fall off the plates and build-up on the bottom of the battery to short out the plates.

Removing cells of batteries from a series parrallel system will work fine....

Lets say 3X6 volt with 3X6 volt to make a 6X12 volt with 360 amphours.

If you remove one 6 volt then the amphour rating would fall to 240 amphours, not 300 amphours. this ensures the remaining two cells in the short bank won't be over worked, the 3 in the intact bank will be fine. Cranking amps work the same way.

If you lose one more battery, readjust connections so that you have 2X6 volt and 2X6 volt at 240 amphours.

And so on.
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Old 09-10-2007, 08:53   #14
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In the good ole days (the 70's) we use to drain old batteries, flush them with water, add some sand w/ water and put them on a shaker for a while. Then flush them out real good and put in new acid.

Like what jscott was saying, once the sulfate settles to the bottom and shorts out the plates, the cell gives up. cleaning out the sulfate will re-generate it for a while longer providing the plates haven't been eaten away.
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Old 09-10-2007, 14:23   #15
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Senor, if you were REALLY thrifty...you'd get out the saw and file, remove the bad cell, and replace it with a single new cell. And of course, clean out any old sulphate from the bottom of the battery box while you were at it.[vbg]

Actually, you probably can install some shorting bars across that bad cell and then add a single 2.2v cell externally, if you really want to push it.
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