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Old 16-04-2018, 16:30   #61
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Re: Buyer Beware, Not a fair eBay seller.

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Originally Posted by ramblinrod View Post
No mistake.

My statements were 100% accurate.

Your statements above are also accurate except that...

i) E = Electro-motive force in Volts,

and more importantly that...

ii) P = E*I = I^2/R

I digress, these level of details are not necessary to make the point that...

Both 120 Vac and 12 Vdc electrical system wiring faults can and do burn boats and hurt people, and that it is not safe for those who are insufficiently knowledgeable or skilled, to mess with either.
Allow me to add my $0.02...

Once a DC circuit creates an arc, the arc can be maintained. The constant flow of electrons ionizes the adjacent air, creating a conductive path. An AC arc is difficult to maintain because the voltage crosses through 0 volts at a rate twice the AC frequency which effectively extinguishes the arc as the voltage passes through the zero point.

This makes DC inherently more dangerous from the perspective of starting unintentional fires. AC, on the other hand, due to it's higher (as a mains supply) and constantly varying voltage is the more dangerous from the perspective of being electrocuted.
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Old 16-04-2018, 21:44   #62
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Re: Buyer Beware, Not a fair eBay seller.

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........

The thought that it is "safe" for someone insufficiently knowledgeable and skilled to modify marine electrical wiring is clearly false.
I doubt if any reader disagrees with this statement however your previous position was (as I understand it) that one had to be a "marine certified well experienced technician" to be sufficiently knowledgeable and skilled to modify marine electrical wiring. I completely disagree with that proposition. There are many boat owners who do have sufficient knowledge to perform electrical work on their vessels and do so in a safe manner. Of course there are also many who don't.

As to the statement that 90% of boats would't comply with the standards required in your part of the world could well be true, I not there so I can't comment.

However, noncompliance with a standard does not automatically make a circuit unsafe. Sure it is a good thing to comply and standards have a place in the mix of things and if I paying someone to carry out work on my boat, I would expect them to comply with any required standard. Standards are useful to protect professional as much as they are to protect the customer.

I'm sure if you looked at my own wiring in my boat, you could find some noncompliance with some standard but I guarantee it would be both minor and not unsafe. And there are many others more capable than me carrying out their own electrical work.

As a simple example, I'm licensed to install cabling in houses, helicopters and oil/gas installations. Each one has a different standard (rightly so) but if I show someone how to install some cabling in their boat, it will be safe regardless of what you may consider is safe.
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Old 16-04-2018, 23:24   #63
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Re: Buyer Beware, Not a fair eBay seller.

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...however your previous position was (as I understand it) that one had to be a "marine certified well experienced technician" to be sufficiently knowledgeable and skilled to modify marine electrical wiring.
I never stated that.

Quote:
As to the statement that 90% of boats would't comply with the standards required in your part of the world could well be true, I not there so I can't comment.
I never stated that.

Quote:
However, noncompliance with a standard does not automatically make a circuit unsafe.
I never stated that.
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Old 17-04-2018, 00:24   #64
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Re: Buyer Beware, Not a fair eBay seller.

What was this thread about ?
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Old 17-04-2018, 02:14   #65
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Re: Buyer Beware, Not a fair eBay seller.

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What was this thread about ?
A disgruntled EBay buyer, but we've never heard back from him and it's probably time to put tis thread to bed.
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Old 17-04-2018, 02:24   #66
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Re: Buyer Beware, Not a fair eBay seller.

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Originally Posted by ramblinrod View Post
I never stated that.
OK, I misunderstood, my bad


I never stated that.
Really...


I never stated that.
No, I made that statement
..........
StuM is probably right ^^.
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Old 17-04-2018, 02:33   #67
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Re: Buyer Beware, Not a fair eBay seller.

No! you are all wrong and i'm right, agree or move on!
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Old 17-04-2018, 04:55   #68
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Re: Buyer Beware, Not a fair eBay seller.

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Originally Posted by Reefmagnet View Post
Allow me to add my $0.02...

Once a DC circuit creates an arc, the arc can be maintained. The constant flow of electrons ionizes the adjacent air, creating a conductive path. An AC arc is difficult to maintain because the voltage crosses through 0 volts at a rate twice the AC frequency which effectively extinguishes the arc as the voltage passes through the zero point.

This makes DC inherently more dangerous from the perspective of starting unintentional fires. AC, on the other hand, due to it's higher (as a mains supply) and constantly varying voltage is the more dangerous from the perspective of being electrocuted.
OK, now some even more thread drift; here is an old discussion about why a decent arc cannot be created with 12 Vdc. Hint, first you have to bump the 12 V into something like 10 to 30 KV - easy enough to do of course.

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Old 17-04-2018, 08:07   #69
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Re: Buyer Beware, Not a fair eBay seller.

Rather than relying on a mod to put it out of its misery,

let's all just refrain from posting to it any further, and it will sink into oblivion on its own
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Old 17-04-2018, 08:28   #70
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Re: Buyer Beware, Not a fair eBay seller.

Guys.

Y'awl reinforced my conviction that differences of opinion can arise at any time and any place..

Im closing the thread. Should you feel you want to beat the horse to death some more, please contact a mod and he will raise the matter with the mod squad...

Besties...
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