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Old 25-05-2016, 09:06   #16
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Re: Are Westerbeke and Kubota the same?

While the Westerbeke water pump">raw water pump starts out as a Johnson pump, in some instances Westerbeke modifies the pump's foot to fit their "custom" mounting bracket. Save your original pump housing and rebuild it with parts from Johnson. Hope that helps.
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Old 25-05-2016, 09:15   #17
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Re: Are Westerbeke and Kubota the same?

Through my own sleuthing I discovered my W58 is the exact same engine as a Perkins 4.154 (which I think is a Mitsubishi block). Bought a Perkins fresh water pump for $89.00 from a tractor dealer in Iowa that was a perfect fit. Same part from Westerbeke but with the magic red paint, $270.

My raw water pump is a Sherwood. Found an off the shelf Sherwood for half the Westerbeke price and replaced my old totally trashed pump. But compared side by side before I tossed the old and they were identical.

For a raw water pump I would think any pump that fits the bracket on the engine and has the correct capacity would work.

After dealing with this engine and seeing what ridiculous premiums Westerbeke charges for their parts I will never, ever buy one of their products again. I don't mind paying a little more if I get the service, parts in stock or a higher spec for some of the accessories but I just hate getting robbed and held hostage by a supplier for standard stuff.
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Old 25-05-2016, 09:15   #18
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Re: Are Westerbeke and Kubota the same?

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Originally Posted by Maine Sail View Post
Your 7.5 is most likely a Mitsubishi block. The raw water pumps are almost always made under contract by Johnson to specifically fit the Mitsubishi blocks. Neither Kubota nor Mitsubishi nor Shibaura (Perkins & Volvo) make raw water pumps.

Like all of Westerbeke's contracts with suppliers the supplier is not allowed to sell any parts direct to the consumer or to bypass Westerbeke in any way. While you may find a Johnson 810-B1 impeller, seals, bearings or parts that are shared, through creative sleuthing, you will not find the complete pump or pump casting anywhere but Westerbeke because Johnson can't sell them to you.

I had to do an end run on Westerbeke, meaning get very creative, just to get a Mitsubishi parts manual for my S4L2 Mitsubishi engine. The minute you say "Westerbeke" to an industrial engine supplier the conversation is done. Heck don't even tell them it is red in color of the conversation is likely done. First I had to find out what tractor uses an S4L2 engine and it turned out that a New Holland did. I ordered the Mitsubishi engine manual based on having a New Holland (can't remember model now but I did get the manual).
My old Westerbeke W-52 required a Sherlock hat to determine that the block at the core of it was a Mazda R2, as seen in 1980-90 Ford Rangers and Mazda B2200 light-duty pickups. The Westerbeke mechanic wanted $13K to rebuild it, whereas a rebuild kit from Australia for an R2 diesel was only a few hundred bucks, because in Australia, the Mazda B2200s last 30-40 years and are still popular for sheep ranches, etc.

I ended up repowering for $11K with a brand-new Beta 60, which runs cleaner, leaner and has eight more horses. But mainly, because I know the Kubota backhoe engine at its core and those "tractor-grade" parts are easy to source and cost hundreds, not thousands. "Marine diesels" at the small yacht size are a total scam in my view, and I learned so much installing my own engine (including the care and feeding of Johnson raw water pumps) that I feel very much ahead of the game.
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Old 25-05-2016, 09:31   #19
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Re: Are Westerbeke and Kubota the same?

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My Westerbeke 55A is a mitsubishi
Half of chrysler's fleet is made by Mit; have been for more than 20 years. About the only quality cars that chrysler sold. Of course nowadays, almost all small diesels are made in china.
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Old 25-05-2016, 10:30   #20
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Re: Are Westerbeke and Kubota the same?

hello,
Had the same problem with Mastervolt. Bought a new and keep the old one to rebuilt. It's an investment... Disasembled it and read the numbers on parst and bought them separately (O-rings and bearings). Lot cheaper. On Mastervolt they use Mitsubishi on Whisper6. Good luck.
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Old 25-05-2016, 10:32   #21
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Re: Are Westerbeke and Kubota the same?

I have a westerbeke 42B I thought was a Kubota block, now I am not sure. I did get a fresh water pump from Vetus for 1/3 rd the price westerbeke wanted.
Does anyone know what my block is? Kubota or Mitsi
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Old 25-05-2016, 11:03   #22
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Re: Are Westerbeke and Kubota the same?

Engine can be a Kubota or Mitsubishi.....what is the brand stamped on the back of the alternator?

That's how I discovered mine was a Mitsubishi.
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Old 25-05-2016, 11:08   #23
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Re: Are Westerbeke and Kubota the same?

I don't know if this will help, ken, but try Depco Pump Company
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Old 25-05-2016, 12:41   #24
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Re: Are Westerbeke and Kubota the same?

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Originally Posted by MarkSF View Post

It's "gall" btw, not "gaul".
Reminded me of 10th grade Latin.....

Gallia est omnis divisa in partes tres
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Old 25-05-2016, 13:30   #25
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Re: Are Westerbeke and Kubota the same?

Some years ago I was almost presented with a very silly bill for the raw water pump (Johnson)for my Westerbeke with a Kubota block.

My engineer was kind enough to explain the shaft was custom and expensive... he offered to make me one for $90 or 10 for $100. Using a new shaft every two or three years has completely solved all my leak problems.

I bought a new johnson pump plus 10 shafts for about the same cost as Westerbeke rebuild kit.

The other nightmare was the heat exchanger that seemed to always leak on the end caps... swapped it for a Bowman and have had no problems for over ten years now.

I'd hate to work out the cost of a Westerbeke built at spare parts prices.

Ross
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Old 25-05-2016, 13:43   #26
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Re: Are Westerbeke and Kubota the same?

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Originally Posted by yachtgemini View Post
Some years ago I was almost presented with a very silly bill for the raw water pump (Johnson)for my Westerbeke with a Kubota block.

My engineer was kind enough to explain the shaft was custom and expensive... he offered to make me one for $90 or 10 for $100. Using a new shaft every two or three years has completely solved all my leak problems.

I bought a new johnson pump plus 10 shafts for about the same cost as Westerbeke rebuild kit.

The other nightmare was the heat exchanger that seemed to always leak on the end caps... swapped it for a Bowman and have had no problems for over ten years now.

I'd hate to work out the cost of a Westerbeke built at spare parts prices.

Ross
I like the way you think. I have a spare everything onboard including a battery charger which I added yesterday. The same thought process as yours. I even had 20 spare springs for the lock mechanisms for drawers.

How is the shaft alone replaced? Do you simply push in a new shaft?
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Old 25-05-2016, 14:09   #27
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Re: Are Westerbeke and Kubota the same?

The slot inside the Kubota that drives the raw water pump is different than the end of the shaft on the Johnson so while it all appears to fit the coupling (from a distant memory) was too sloppy. Also the shaft needed to be a few mm longer.. I seem to recall the impellers for the westerbeke versus the johnson may have been different.

-r
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Old 25-05-2016, 14:12   #28
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Re: Are Westerbeke and Kubota the same?

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Originally Posted by yachtgemini View Post
The slot inside the Kubota that drives the raw water pump is different than the end of the shaft on the Johnson so while it all appears to fit the coupling (from a distant memory) was too sloppy. Also the shaft needed to be a few mm longer.. I seem to recall the impellers for the westerbeke versus the johnson may have been different.

-r
Thanks. You are correct, the Johnson impeller doesn't fit the Westerbeke.
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Old 25-05-2016, 15:31   #29
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Re: Are Westerbeke and Kubota the same?

It is interesting (and perhaps would make for a great psycho-economic study) how we as consumers are perfectly OK with these "proprietory" incompatibilities of various stock components yet would not tolerate for 1 second if say the nozzles at the gas pumps were to be "proprietorily" incompatible with this or that automobile's gas tank opening or would be different among various gas stations.
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Old 25-05-2016, 20:12   #30
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Re: Are Westerbeke and Kubota the same?

[QUOTE=Kenomac;2128208]Spell check drives me crazy. I wrote gall and then the iPad changed it when I moved on.

I feel your pain.
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