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Old 08-03-2011, 21:06   #61
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Re: 4/0 Lug / Connector Crimper

Maine Sail, know of a Heavy Duty Marine Grade Tinned 4/0 color coded Lug supplier that will ship to Canada? One that I could afford by the way ;-)

Thanks for your help Guys,
Extemp.
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Originally Posted by Maine Sail View Post
So without any markings on the "light duty" lugs how do you know which dies to use? You don't. Did GD tell you which dies to use on them will they give you this data?? Perhaps they will.

The lug on the right is properly marked to be used with the rotating die heads of the same markings. I have the cross reference for FTZ's light duty lugs but who knows whose lugs those are and if the specs are even similar? You know when you get the color and die stamped lugs that they meet an industry standard. Without any markings it's like going to Vegas.

A good rule with lugs is to only buy color coded lugs with the corresponding dies stamped into the lug.
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Old 08-03-2011, 21:09   #62
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Re: 4/0 Lug / Connector Crimper

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Originally Posted by Extemporaneous View Post
Maine Sail, know of a Heavy Duty Marine Grade Tinned 4/0 color coded Lug supplier that will ship to Canada? One that I could afford by the way ;-)

Thanks for your help Guys,
Extemp.
Call both FTZ and Quick Cable in the morning and ask where your nearest distributor is. They both sell excellent power lugs but others make them too. Just google for it.
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Old 08-03-2011, 21:13   #63
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Re: 4/0 Lug / Connector Crimper

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Originally Posted by Maine Sail View Post
Call both FTZ and Quick Cable in the morning and ask where your nearest distributor is. They both sell excellent power lugs but others make them too. Just google for it.
Will do.
I'm on Burndy's site right now having a look.

Cheers,
Extemp.
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Old 08-03-2011, 21:24   #64
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Re: 4/0 Lug / Connector Crimper

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maine Sail View Post
So without any markings on the "light duty" lugs how do you know which dies to use? You really don't. Can GD tell you which dies to use on them & will they give you this data?? Perhaps they will.

The lug on the right is properly marked to be used with the rotating die heads of the same markings. I have the cross reference for FTZ's light duty lugs but who knows whose lugs those are and if the specs are even similar? You know when you get the color and die stamped lugs that they meet an industry standard. Without any markings it's like going to Vegas.

A good rule with lugs is to only buy color coded lugs with the corresponding dies stamped into the lug. they make it a LOT easier on the installer when the time comes to select the dies and make the crimps.
You are correct. Only stampings on the light duty lugs are the wire size.
The Greenlee crimpers, at least my 8-1/0 crimper, has the rotating dies that are stamped wire size, also with colored dots that do not match anything like you have mentioned. So you rotate both sets of dies to the same wire size, unlike the FTZ that mix dies for the different lugs. I found no varible on mine for light duty or heavy duty lug use, just wire size. But then I am also just learning this. Kinda wish I would have just bought the FTZ crimper, but wanted the hex crimp vs diamond.
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Old 08-03-2011, 21:43   #65
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Re: 4/0 Lug / Connector Crimper

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You are correct. Only stampings on the light duty lugs are the wire size.
The Greenlee crimpers, at least my 8-1/0 crimper, has the rotating dies that are stamped wire size, no codes. So you rotate both sets of dies to the same wire size, unlike the FTZ that mix dies for the different lugs. I see no varible on mine for light duty or heavy duty lug use, just wire size. Bu then I am also just learning this. Kinda wish I would have just bought the FTZ crimper, but wanted the hex crimp vs diamond.
Same on my Greenlee K09-2 Type Crimper. On the FTZ site they call for the PURPLE A-B for their 4/0 "Starter Lugs- Tin Plated" and YELLOW A-A for their 4/0 "Power Lugs". No such thing on my crimper!
I just did not foresee this being so tough!

Cheers,
Extemp.
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Old 08-03-2011, 22:23   #66
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Re: 4/0 Lug / Connector Crimper

BTW, I have several sizes of 10-14 heatshrink terminals purchased from GD. Some are Ancor brand, some are CNS (Crimp-N-Seal, sold by FTZ)

So I assume GD purchases from several venders?


From more researching on the FTZ site, the 'light-duty' lugs I see are refered to as 'seamless starter lugs', where as the HD lugs are refered to as 'power lugs', regardless of wire sizing.
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Old 08-03-2011, 22:56   #67
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Re: 4/0 Lug / Connector Crimper

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Originally Posted by US1Fountain View Post
BTW, I have several sizes of 10-14 heatshrink terminals purchased from GD. Some are Ancor brand, some are CNS (Crimp-N-Seal, sold by FTZ)

So I assume GD purchases from several venders?


From more researching on the FTZ site, the 'light-duty' lugs I see are refered to as 'seamless starter lugs', where as the HD lugs are refered to as 'power lugs', regardless of wire sizing.
Why does only part of what's above show in your original post but when I quote your post the additional "From more researching..........." shows up??

Anyway, yes I think one has to be careful now a days if they want a particular brand. Everyone seams to be shopping. Suppliers are no exception.

Cheers,
Extemp.

Weird!! Once I posted this (my post) you're whole message showed up. This has happened a couple times tonight!
Anyone else?

Maybe I've got bigger problems then my lugs being loose! ;-)
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Old 09-03-2011, 01:14   #68
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Re: Location of 1st crimp, then 2nd??

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So I'm reading the Greenlee instructions (I know, I'm not supposed to) and they're tell me to crimp a 4/0 Lug twice. It also says to crimp the lug from the end first with the second crimp toward the wire.
This seams counter intuitive to me. Like it would be pinching or squeezing the wire out of the lug instead of trapping it!
Can some explain why that's the direction a 2 crimp connector is done in?

Thanks,
Extemp.
And here on a Quick How To video it says the opposite!
I know it's a Pneumatic crimper, but it uses the same (or very similar) dies.
Good..... now I can do what I want!

Cheers,
Extemp.
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Old 09-03-2011, 05:41   #69
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Re: 4/0 Lug / Connector Crimper

What Hello’ and Main Sail said.

A properly crimped 4/0 lug should have a pull out force of at least 225 pounds pull.

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Old 09-03-2011, 07:49   #70
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Re: 4/0 Lug / Connector Crimper

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Originally Posted by GordMay View Post
What Hello’ and Main Sail said.

A properly crimped 4/0 lug should have a pull out force of at least 225 pounds pull.

http://www.cruisersforum.com/attachm..._00001-med.jpg
I don;t know where that cam from but I generally use the Mil-Spec numbers. A 4/0 lug for Mil-Spec is 875 pounds and they regularly exceed 2600 pounds!! The ABYC specs are rather an odd bunch. Mil-Spec and NASA are both significantly higher.

Hell I can hit 190+ pounds with just 12GA wire... 225 pounds for 4/0 is scary IMHO....



http://www.tycoelectronics.com/catalog/cinf/en/c/123/150?PID=5225&RQS=C~1^M~BYPN^TCPN~35107^RQPN~MS2503 6-111
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Old 09-03-2011, 07:55   #71
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Re: Location of 1st crimp, then 2nd??

Quote:
Originally Posted by Extemporaneous View Post
And here on a Quick How To video it says the opposite!
I know it's a Pneumatic crimper, but it uses the same (or very similar) dies.
Good..... now I can do what I want!

Cheers,
Extemp.
After doing some more research last night I discovered this is correct. With power lugs you crimp close to the wire first and with industrial lugs closest to the stud hole first. The reason for this is that with power lugs you want the wire jacket as tight to the lug as possible. Crimping the hole end can cause this gap to grow. It does not always grow but can. If using adhesive heat shrink over the lug and jacket then this matter little.

Don't fully know why they do it differently with industrial lugs, but they do. I have done it both ways, backwards and forwards and never had any issues either way with the gap.

It was my understanding from reading information on industrial lugs that when you crimped the wire end first you could over fill the lug and bunch the wire causing an over crimp situation. I generally crimp the stud hole end first as they do in industrial crimps.

I have changed the wording on my site to reflect power lugs more accurately but as I said the only reason is to keep the gap between jacket and lug close. I also just got off the phone with tech support at QC and will sum that up later...
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Old 09-03-2011, 08:54   #72
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Re: 4/0 Lug / Connector Crimper

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maine Sail View Post
I don;t know where that cam from but I generally use the Mil-Spec numbers. A 4/0 lug for Mil-Spec is 875 pounds and they regularly exceed 2600 pounds!! The ABYC specs are rather an odd bunch. Mil-Spec and NASA are both significantly higher.

Hell I can hit 190+ pounds with just 12GA wire... 225 pounds for 4/0 is scary IMHO....

http://www.tycoelectronics.com/catalog/cinf/en/c/123/150?PID=5225&RQS=C~1^M~BYPN^TCPN~35107^RQPN~MS2503 6-111
ABYC E-9 (1998) Tensile Test Values for Connections - Table XIII
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Old 09-03-2011, 09:10   #73
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Re: 4/0 Lug / Connector Crimper

So I purchased a pair of Anchor heavy duty(Its certainly heavy) lug crimpers and have yet to have a chance to use them. After reading this thread should I be concerned with the quality of the finished product.

I am aslo suprised that a company with Anchors market penetration ships the tool with no instructions.
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Old 09-03-2011, 09:16   #74
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Re: 4/0 Lug / Connector Crimper

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ABYC E-9 (1998) Tensile Test Values for Connections - Table XIII
Yes and I have always had a discomfort for those rather low values. The right crimp tool on 12Ga wire can support over 190 pounds yet the "standard" is just 35 pounds while Mil-Spec is 110 pounds. Don't know why there is such a huge discrepancy between ABYC tensile values and Mil-Spec? 10-15% I'd understand but that gap is huge...

I have personally put over 900 pounds on a 1/0 lug and not pulled it out. Did damage my bench though...
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Old 09-03-2011, 09:34   #75
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Re: 4/0 Lug / Connector Crimper

I have a pair of the Anchor Hevy Duty lug crimpers tha I have yet to use, after reading this post should I be concerned with using this tool?
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