440: Sd50 saildrive oilchange

[dirkdig]

Just about to haulout and antifoul.
Going to drop the saildrive oil out and change.
Does anyone know if i can refill from the top dipstick inlet.
Last time we filled from the bottom up.

[Jacana]

Was told I had to fill from bottom on my sd 20 legs,but have had no problems filling from top.Safest way is to check level then drain oil and measure how many litres to empty ,refill from top with same amount and check level again.

[dirkdig]

Thats what i thought, then after several minutes of use check again in case of any airpockets that come out of the new fill.

[meirriba]

I have SD50 on L400. Drained from below and filled from top. As said above - check quantities (filled = of drained, if full before change).

[dirkdig]

Coming out tomorrow.
Got a bucket for each saildrive oil drain,will check for any bits of metal etc as well as amount of oil

[DavefromNZ]

In August we had to replace both SD50 engine shaft seals due to leaks. That was at 270 hours. Now, 4 months and 50 hours later one has failed again. Yanmar need to sort out their quality control!!!!!

[impi]

Not sure how old your SD 50's are but be aware that there is a new longer replacement dip stick as previously the dipstick was too short and resulted in over filling and over pressurizing. I can write a book on SD 50's ... spent huge amounts of time with agents and also flew to the US to meet with the supplier distributors. They DO HAVE ISSUES with the SD 50's - OIL CHANGE AT MORE THAN REGULAR INTERVALS IS A MUST DO !!!

Also, whilst the vessel is out of the water - replace the lower shaft seals and do a visual inspection where the seal lip runs. A groove here will allow sea water ingress!

[DavefromNZ]

Thanks Impi. The SD 50s are about 3 years old. We were aware of overfilling and so after the last fix had the level at about 1/3 way up the dipstick. However no one could tell me if it should be dipped with or without the stick being screwed in?

We replaced the lower shaft seals also in Aug. They are going to try to fix the upper seals this time with the yacht in the water as the engine can be slid forward about 6 inches. Last time that was enough to drop the SD 50s but I am not sure if they will have enough room to work, do they need to use a puller on the seal?

All this days before a 6 week trip I have been planning all year for!

[impi]

Originally Posted by DavefromNZ

Thanks Impi. The SD 50s are about 3 years old. We were aware of overfilling and so after the last fix had the level at about 1/3 way up the dipstick. However no one could tell me if it should be dipped with or without the stick being screwed in?

We replaced the lower shaft seals also in Aug. They are going to try to fix the upper seals this time with the yacht in the water as the engine can be slid forward about 6 inches. Last time that was enough to drop the SD 50s but I am not sure if they will have enough room to work, do they need to use a puller on the seal?

All this days before a 6 week trip I have been planning all year for!

The dipstick must not be screwed in ... just on-top of the thread. Over filling causes the seals to 'push out' ... if the top seals go it shows by a leakage between the engine / saildrive housing. On the Lagoon 440 one has enough room to move the engine forward for this task. The agent simply used a 'bent screwdriver' to pry the top seal.

I am wondering why you are having the seal problems? One thing you may want to be watching for is how the oil is changed with the boat in the water. If you use too much air pressure it will push the seals out ... something I am pretty cautious of.

When re-filling, make sure to replenish the oil with at least the same capacity you removed if the oil was at the right level. Often, a top up will need an overnight for the oil to 'settle in' ... do not screw the filler cap down but rather leave it 'loose on the top' to allow air to 'flow' without causing a vacuum ...a re-check in the morning is essential and if requiring a 'top up' keep checking until the oil is full.
I have heard from a number of owners that they are using oil, only to find they never got it filled in the first place ... just looked that way as the oil takes a while to subside into the casing.

Frequent changes DEFINITELY are the key to getting longer life out of the SD50's ... and check with the dealer for oil type updates. I was already told to change oil type twice ... not very comforting!

Also - on the SD you are having trouble with ... make sure the prop turns FREELY by hand when out of gear. I know of a cruiser who got rope around his prop and bent the casing. Hope this helps.

[DavefromNZ]

Thanks again for the info. I have found 3 cases on the Internet of upper seal leaks because the guys believe that the shaft metal is too soft and the seal wears a grove in the shaft. One had a chrome sleeve put over the shaft. I am not sure if I can get the shaft out and apparently need 25cm space to move the engine forward.

I found the Yanmar Bulletin from 2009 where they acknowledged the seal/over pressure problem and increased the dipstick from 29mm to 43mm.

[impi]

Originally Posted by DavefromNZ

Thanks again for the info. I have found 3 cases on the Internet of upper seal leaks because the guys believe that the shaft metal is too soft and the seal wears a grove in the shaft. One had a chrome sleeve put over the shaft. I am not sure if I can get the shaft out and apparently need 25cm space to move the engine forward.

I found the Yanmar Bulletin from 2009 where they acknowledged the seal/over pressure problem and increased the dipstick from 29mm to 43mm.

Personally I would not go with a chromed sleeve ... I have tried all sorts of things with my fleet of earthmoving equipment in this regard and have favoured the argument for a more 'porous' metal shaft which allows oil to impregnate and keep the lip of the seal lubed. A hard sleeve will cause the seal lip to wear quicker and yes, there is a balance between too hard and too soft. Chrome never lasted well when we used that method. I must say that we had wear on the lower shaft and have not seen it on the upper shaft.

Another reason why seals go, is due to bearing wear ... but then again your shafts are not that old ...

Moving the engine forward is not a huge task if you have the room ...

[DavefromNZ]

I did a run today to try to figure out the problem. I found that the oil level started at 1/3 dipstick and quickly went to over the top of the dipstick and was very frothy (no not a sea water leak). So I lowered the level and ran for a short time with the dipstick out to try to get the air out. I then ran with the dipstick screwed in and the level remained steady at 1/2 dipstick.

First run had no leaks so I thought I had solved the pressure problem. However there was a small leak after returning to the marina. I think a bit better now however I would still like to have the seal replaced again but the yanmar dealer can't now do it before I leave for a 2000nm trip in a week. I will try another dealer.

Anyone know if the SD50 needs pressure? I.e can I leave the dipstick a bit loose to relieve pressure rather than it leaking at the pinion shaft seal?

[impi]

Dave - sounds odd to me for a low hour drive that has never been opened before.
Are you 100% sure you have the correct oil in there? You do know they changed the oil specs from the original type they used right?

[Captain Bill]

Originally Posted by impi

Personally I would not go with a chromed sleeve ... I have tried all sorts of things with my fleet of earthmoving equipment in this regard and have favoured the argument for a more 'porous' metal shaft which allows oil to impregnate and keep the lip of the seal lubed. A hard sleeve will cause the seal lip to wear quicker and yes, there is a balance between too hard and too soft. Chrome never lasted well when we used that method. I must say that we had wear on the lower shaft and have not seen it on the upper shaft.

Another reason why seals go, is due to bearing wear ... but then again your shafts are not that old ...

Moving the engine forward is not a huge task if you have the room ...

The shafts are old enough. I had one replaced and a hundred hours later there was a new wear groove. Yanmars response; "that happens". I went with the chrome sleeve. I have about 300 hours on the sleeved shaft. I can't say what effect it's having on the seal because it hasn't been apart.

[dirkdig]

We have a sleeve on one of ours now for 1300 hours,all good given the new saildrive shaft seal failed at 400 hours