500: Lagoon 500 Nearly Sunk

[minaret]

Originally Posted by Sand crab

Minaret, I love ya man but Is this the same skipper who ran over the dinghy painter several times before finally getting it "right"

No, man, it's not. The boat was under the command of a local skipper when the incident occurred. But shortly thereafter the skipper who brought the boat out from Europe, who was much more experienced (40 years pro it says), arrived on the scene and took over. He's the one who claimed the boat would have sunk to the bottom in deeper water. It's all in the link.

[smj]

I seem to remember a Lagoon in the BVI's that sunk to the bottom. It's been awhile so the memory is a little foggy.

[djtopper]

Originally Posted by minaret

No, man, it's not. The boat was under the command of a local skipper when the incident occurred. But shortly thereafter the skipper who brought the boat out from Europe, who was much more experienced (40 years pro it says), arrived on the scene and took over. He's the one who claimed the boat would have sunk to the bottom in deeper water. It's all in the link.

Yes, the story explained that. It's when I felt a chill up my spine. Every book about (cruising) catamarans starts with all the praise and glory related to being unsinkable. Granted, this episode may have been largely due to an overlooked hole between compartments, but still. Even flooded with water they're supposed to float. More precisely, if they capsize (which would imply soon-to-be-filled-with-water) they should still float.

I can't help but wonder what would happen if a 500 (and several other models of catamaran from other companies) capsized. I'm going to guess that much of the catamaran literature regarding "unsinkability" hasn't taken into account fully loaded cruising boats with generators, HVAC systems, washing machines, dish washers, water makers, batteries, heavy engines, etc...

Cars undergo crash tests. Why don't boats undergo float (or sink) tests?

[Captain Bill]

Originally Posted by djtopper

Cars undergo crash tests. Why don't boats undergo float (or sink) tests?

Pretty simple really.... Costs. 50 foot boat $1million, high end car $50,000. Number of 50 ft boats sold... 50? Number of high end cars sold....50,000? Cost per per unit.....Boat $20,000....... Car $1.

[djtopper]

Originally Posted by Captain Bill

Pretty simple really.... Costs. 50 foot boat $1million, high end car $50,000. Number of 50 ft boats sold... 50? Number of high end cars sold....50,000? Cost per per unit.....Boat $20,000....... Car $1.

Yes, I get that and of course it's true. But take airplanes for example. They're on par with boats in terms of expense. But each and every nut and bolt has been tested and certified for safety. Perhaps that's because of the increased risk of being up in the sky. But still, there aren't many Pilatus rolling of the line each year either.

Either way, it feels as though there needs to be some kind of standard test set that manufacturers can elect in or out of. Right now, there's not much it seems.

But perhaps that's ok since you ARE required to have X number of life vests, etc... In all but the most extreme cases you should be able to bail out then hop in your dinghy or life raft and wait.

I will say that I'm glad to know a cat can actually sink. It will definitely affect my future responses to potential problems, leaks in particular. Who knows, this thread may have already saved someone's life in the future.

[colemj]

All cats can sink. It only takes a fire or an extreme catastrophic holing/breaking apart to cause it. Plan on that and you can't go wrong.

Mark

[Sand crab]

Sorry for the confusion Minaret which was all mine. I didn't realize there were 2 captains. I hadn't read that page in a while. I suffer from CRS.
Still friends?

[minaret]

Originally Posted by Sand crab

Sorry for the confusion Minaret which was all mine. I didn't realize there were 2 captains. I hadn't read that page in a while. I suffer from CRS.
Still friends?

Of course. I can see not having much faith in the opinion of the 1st skipper.

[Lagoon4us]

Why you people believe Catamarans are unsinkable confounds me, are you stupid or just pretending to be?

Being unsinkable is a requirement of a dinghy full of flotation for survey purposes, compartmentalisation to reduce risk is a survey requirement also to reduce risk.

Stupidty is hard to design around as is bad seamanship, monohull/trimaran/catamaran it matters not, put a big enough hole in it and it's going down, the secret is not to do that in the first place... SheeeesssssssshhhHHHHH!

[minaret]

Originally Posted by Lagoon4us

Why you people believe Catamarans are unsinkable confounds me, are you stupid or just pretending to be?

Being unsinkable is a requirement of a dinghy full of flotation for survey purposes, compartmentalisation to reduce risk is a survey requirement also to reduce risk.

Stupidty is hard to design around as is bad seamanship, monohull/trimaran/catamaran it matters not, put a big enough hole in it and it's going down, the secret is not to do that in the first place... SheeeesssssssshhhHHHHH!

Perhaps it's all the people on the CF multihull forum who are constantly saying "our boats may capsize but at least they don't sink like a mono", or some variation thereof.


Sheeeesh!

[Lagoon4us]

Originally Posted by minaret

Perhaps it's all the people on the CF multihull forum who are constantly saying "our boats may capsize but at least they don't sink like a mono", or some variation thereof.


Sheeeesh!

Fairy tales at best, wonder who ALL these people are? Sounds a bit like schoolyard stuff, this whole mono/multi crap is just that, crap!

Here in Marmiris last week a group of 20 or so yachtie's at anchor sheltered from a 55knot blow, two boats ended up in the mud a local Gulet (surprising) and an American on a Swan 44 or so (experienced cruiser's), in the morning i dragged the Swan off the mud to their delight and thanks.

This whole stupid, perpetual, argument should cease ie GROW UP people! What design or configuration boat we choose to cruise in is just that GET A LIFE and stop the stupidity, all boats can sink!!!!!!

We are all equal in and out of our armchairs, when cruising you deal with your error's of judgement constantly because nature has no mercy with error, to pick fights over what boat you cruise in is just DUMB.....

[minaret]

Originally Posted by Lagoon4us

stop the stupidity, all boats can sink!!!!!!

I couldn't agree more!

[Palarran]

Originally Posted by Lagoon4us

Why you people believe Catamarans are unsinkable confounds me, are you stupid or just pretending to be?

That is really, really funny!

For the record, I haven't seen a thread on the multihull forum claiming all cats are "unsinkable" in many years. And any from a while ago certainly had enough cat owners state that they will sink as those who claim they won't.

But Minaret, they will sink differently than a mono. Much slower.

[minaret]

Originally Posted by Palarran

That is really, really funny!

For the record, I haven't seen a thread on the multihull forum claiming all cats are "unsinkable" in many years. And any from a while ago certainly had enough cat owners state that they will sink as those who claim they won't.

But Minaret, they will sink differently than a mono. Much slower.

Now that I'll buy. Appreciate your honesty and lack of illusions throughout. Hope you guys don't think I'm a cat basher cause I'm not. Production boat basher (from experience), maybe.

[Lagoon4us]

Originally Posted by minaret

Now that I'll buy. Appreciate your honesty and lack of illusions throughout. Hope you guys don't think I'm a cat basher cause I'm not. Production boat basher (from experience), maybe.