420: Lagoon 420 Owners & Fans

[ess105]

Originally Posted by Intentional Drifter

Lord-a-mercy how the prices have gone up! Doing a side-by-side comparison with the boat as I ordered it - $108K increase for 2008 delivery. Glad I ordered it when I did.

Think about what that means to the book value of your deposit.

[Peter Cronk]

Originally Posted by ess105

Think about what that means to the book value of your deposit.

Greetings All,

Had a test sail on 'Hybrid' out of Ft. Lauderdale in 14 to 16kts winds. The boat did 8.2kts under sail only and was very smooth in very sloppy rough seas (the seas just out of Ft. Luderdale are usually quite rough with very confused seas). A Leopard 46 went out just ahead of us and we were actually catching up. Was told the Leopard 46 is fast in smooth waters and light winds but suffers from the low bridge clearance in rough seas. Nick claims he did 13kts in >20kts winds on the way down from Annapolis

Overall I still cannot get over the size of the boat. There are some small pre production problems and most of the things I asked about are on 'the list'. Did not get to experience the regeneration as Nick did not know how to use or maybe it has some problem????? The boat is extremely well layed out and far exceeds my expectations. This is some boat and will be very hard to compete with once they get it all sorted.

The Nav station stool will have three fixed positions. Apparently is not useable in the current state in anything except at anchor in calm seas.

I have some photos but are more of detail of what is under the floor panels as most of the other shots are already posted. Unfortunately I did not get to photo the forward storage spaces and they had a plie of stuff in them anyhow but there is a lot of space there.

In the large space near the owners head the space is approximately 44inches tall by approximately three??? feet wide and well over 6 feet long. I will look at this space for maybe the washer dryer ( the space designated for this in the owners head is too good to loose to the washer dryer) and a built in additional freezer or a work space or whatever but is a good large space.

The space behind the Anchor chain etc locker is also large but not quite as wide. Is where the 'Skippers' cabin goes. The two forward lockers are also quite large and in the 'Skipers Cabin' version, the Starbord locker is the 'Skipers' head. Both are good for for sails, lines etc.

The watermaker is meant to go in the space just behind the stairs on the Starboard side. There is now an option of extra water tanks and I think these go where the water maker goes on the Starboard side and ?? not too sure on the Port side. Anyhow on 'Hybrid' the water maker is not there and neither are the extra water tanks but there is oddles of space under the floor boards. Water tanks can be flexible bladders so these spaces could be utilised easily.

For the Voltaic wannabees of us; there is oddles of space on the hard binimi. Think, weight permitting, you could easily put 8 or more of the 160W BP panels up there. Once we understand the regeneration stuff, not too sure you will want to anyhow. This boat sails very well and with over 8 knots in rough seas with 14kts wind, think the advertised regeneration will provide heaps of power. If we then couple with a 4KW 72VDC to 110VAC inverter, we will have power to burn on any appliance including hot water for some time even at anchor.

'Hybrid' has the 21KVA generator and is a must. With this in mode 5, (all power to the motors and none anywhere else), for the generator operating modes, the whole generator power as being used by the motors at full power for about 7kts of boat speed. Think the smaller generators will really struggle.

Nick says the gallery is the exact same size as the L440 and there is now an option of a third sink same as in the L440.

Looked hard at the AC installations. Is Cruiseair and is 16BTU in the Sallon, 12BTU in the owners cabin and 7BTU units in each of the other cabins. The duct in the owners cabin hanging space will be changed to run under the seat and come up behind the seat. Think I will stick to doing myself and does not look too hard at all.

The holding tanks are in similar positions on the L410 and L440 so I think this is probably the optomial position. I would not bother trying to change and try to utilise the abundunt space under the floor for other things such as water maker and water storage.

And, yes, the great protusion in the owners cabin did hit me fair in the eye. I included a photo of what they did on the L440 and if Lagoon do not do similar, I will. Asked why they did not have doors on the cupboard in the owners head. Was told 'is a good question' and was because the project manager ran out of funds and was a cost saving. For finish sake only, I will put these on. What else did they skip on????????

Hybrid had problems with its electronics. Is just a symptom of being rushed for the shows I think. Again, I am now glad I opted to do my own. Anyone experienced with the RAYECH 6 software???

All in all, I could not get enough of the boat. Also looks much better in person than the photos etc. Is taller than a L440 and I could not see too much difference in size to a L440. Nick claims that the decision on a 440 or 420 will come down to the helm station - flybridge or cockpit - especially as the pricing gets closer. Sooo, our risk at the start was a good guess.

I am ready!!!!! Is it here yet???

BTW, my new hull number is 26. My boat was destined for the Miami show and as they are now going to use Hybrid for shows for some time, we all are now back in the same que. So now the hull numbers and dates make sense. Still think will slip some more. My guess is that will slip by another month at best. Think they still have a bunch of things to work out befor production?? Nick claims that they have sold over 90 boats world wide to date!!!! similar to the sales schedule on the 440 on start up.

Boat looks really good and cannot wait to get my hands on #26.

[Intentional Drifter]

Thank you, Peter. Very nice write-up. A question or two:

"In the large space near the owners head the space is approximately 44inches tall by approximately three??? feet wide and well over 6 feet long. I will look at this space for maybe the washer dryer ( the space designated for this in the owners head is too good to loose to the washer dryer) and a built in additional freezer or a work space or whatever but is a good large space.

The space behind the Anchor chain etc locker is also large but not quite as wide. Is where the 'Skippers' cabin goes. The two forward lockers are also quite large and in the 'Skipers Cabin' version, the Starbord locker is the 'Skipers' head. Both are good for for sails, lines etc."

I'm unsure where you're talking about. Can you be more specific? Either be identifying on a layout or photo?

Thanks.

Again, very nice.

ID

[Quiet Riot 420]

Peter, You said you have some pictures of the 420 system. Could you please check to see if you have a picture that identifies the battery chargers manufacturer. The name is 4 letters long and starts with the letter "A". I really would like to check out these chargers on the web (especially the two 25 amp 72V to 12V chargers). Even with 2 of them installed on "Hybrid", that is only 600 watts of power being passed thru to charge the house batteries or run an inverter off of them. Did Nick mention how you can tell want is on the fix list and what is not. For saftey reasons, I really would like them to move the galley outlet out of the cockpit/ galley doorway. They need an outlet near the microwave cabinet!

[Peter Cronk]

Originally Posted by Intentional Drifter

Thank you, Peter. Very nice write-up. A question or two:


I'm unsure where you're talking about. Can you be more specific? Either be identifying on a layout or photo?

Thanks.

Again, very nice.

ID

Sorry. Go on deck and forward of the Sallon. There are three hatches in a row just forward of the sallon itself. These are the storage lockers on the port side and middle and one over the forward cabin bed on the starboard side. The large locker next to the Owners head is the large one I was talking about. Some of the Lagoon people reckon that it would be easy to put the washer /dryer in here thru the cutout out in the owners head and with an additional access hole in the wall between the owners head and the locker. Could glass back over or leave as an access hatch. This would leave the cupboard in the owner's head as is. Is a really good deep locker and would be very handy for towels, linnens etc. So, hope I got that location OK. My initial thoughts are to use the large storage area next to the owners head as a washer/dryer, workshop and general storage with shelves etc. Would make sense and do not want too much weight here to balance with the bedroom on the other side.

The next locker is under the middle hatch just forward of the saloon. This is where the 'skipper's' cabin goes. Here I think the rear end of this would make a good built in freezer (out of polyurethane foam and freezer unit etc). As well as general storage. Is in the centerline so better for weighty items.

The other two storage lockers are under the two most forward hatches (one on each side). The hatches next (behind) these are over the shower stalls. I do have a photo of one of these and they come with a good ladder already installed. These are high and have a full 6 feet clearance height wise. On the skippers version one of these (the Starboard one) is the skippers head.

Grab one of the photos of the deck and you should see what I am talking about.

Did you get to see a boat for real yet???

[Peter Cronk]

Originally Posted by Quiet Riot 420

Peter, You said you have some pictures of the 420 system. Could you please check to see if you have a picture that identifies the battery chargers manufacturer. The name is 4 letters long and starts with the letter "A". I really would like to check out these chargers on the web (especially the two 25 amp 72V to 12V chargers). Even with 2 of them installed on "Hybrid", that is only 600 watts of power being passed thru to charge the house batteries or run an inverter off of them. Did Nick mention how you can tell want is on the fix list and what is not. For saftey reasons, I really would like them to move the galley outlet out of the cockpit/ galley doorway. They need an outlet near the microwave cabinet!

Nick did say all of your concerns re outlets etc are on the list. Everyone has been hitting them on these!!!!! as well as the microwave cupboard. BTW the dimensions of the opening in this cupboard is 22"x12". Also for those who will bwe selecting their own TV monitor etc the room above the cupboard on the Starboard side is approximately 18"high by 29" long; and on the port side (Gallery side) is 19.5" high by 23" long.

The name on the battery charger is : ENAG

Have attached a photo if I can ever work out how to attach!!!!! Someone may have to walk a poor communications engineer thru how to use the site!!! Ah! just worked it out. My file sizes exceeds the upload allowed.

I intend to install a 72VDC to 110VAC invertor pure sinewave at 4KW. A company in Australia make such a devil and export around the world. Is www.latronics.com and I am using a 24VDC version of this box in my house at Moreton Island (no electricity, water or roads). They will Conformal coat all the electronics as well as make it selectiable for 110/240V as well as 60/50 hz. Is a good box but not cheap and does not come with a built in battery charger. The boat will already have a charger for both the 72V and the 12V anyhow.

For our case I want to leave the 12V for just the electronics, water pumps and all 12V things. Will do the 110VAC inverter directly from the big 72VDC battery bank. This will increase efficency greatly and save the need to put in a hugh 12V system. I would rather put in extra batteries for the 72V system.

Make sense??

[Intentional Drifter]

Got it! Thanks, again, Peter.

ID

[Peter Cronk]

[ Could you please check to see if you have a picture that identifies the battery chargers manufacturer. The name is 4 letters long and starts with the letter "A". ![/quote]

Looked on the manuf site : www.enag.fr Could not find our 72V to 12v converter (is dc to dc) so guess is a special build for Lagoon - mmmm expensive to fix!!!!!!!

[pieter97]

[quote=Peter Cronk]Greetings All,

...Had a test sail on 'Hybrid' out of Ft. Lauderdale in 14 to 16kts winds. The boat did 8.2kts under sail only and was very smooth in very sloppy rough seas (the seas just out of Ft. Luderdale are usually quite rough with very confused seas). A Leopard 46 went out just ahead of us and we were actually catching up. Was told the Leopard 46 is fast in smooth waters and light winds but suffers from the low bridge clearance in rough seas. Nick claims he did 13kts in >20kts winds on the way down from Annapolis
-----------------
Peter,
We were onboard the Leopard 46', we sailed underneath you out of Everglades, we sped away, you guys tacked, we came back and were back in Everglades before you! Another guy who is buying a 46' made a video of all this.
Bridge clearance on the Leopard 46' is a whopping 35" in the stern. The bridge deck starts forward at 11' from the bow.
Anyway, the sales people called me as they went out again over the weekend, with 30 -35 knots of wind This was a 'real' seatrial.
The boat was under 2 reefs in main and jib, we did 12-14 knots all the time and the 10-15' seas were not an issue. Gino Morelli who designed it made sure that with fine entry bows and high clearance,the boat hardly slams. I'd take this cat anywhere.

[cjenkins]

Peter,

Thanks for the detailed review. We were at the Annapolis show and did not get to go out on the boat due to mechanical problems.

We you say "Still think will slip some more. My guess is that will slip by another month at best." do you mean the production schedule may move back another month, or move up? Or is it just your boat that you think may slip up or back?

Charlie

[Don K.]

There are no good news from the Barcelona-Boat show: The problems that occured with the electrical drive are still not solved. Apparently up to now none of the boats is working properly. All test-sails have been cancelled again.
While the management from France was like any dealer always emphazising that it was only a "little problem", this can unfortunately not really be the case, since it has been going on for months now.
What effect this will have on the delivery dates could not be finally determined at this stage.
Nevertheless the factory seems to continue with its policy, not to offer diesel-engines (yet?).

Something that was made clear is, that if you choose the smaller gen-set this will not even be sufficient to have the motors go at full speed. This might probably be the result of changing the motors from 8 kw to 10 kw without adapting the size of the gen-set. So the bigger gen-set seems to be a MUST...

It is all a bit surprising, since Lagoon always argued that the system had been tested thoroughly on the 410 and the 440.

To sum it all up: The boat itself - despite little details that partly have been discussed here already - continues to be convincing, but the engine-trouble continues and no one is exactly communicating the dimensions of the problems that turned up...
What made me curious is that the guys from "multihull" stated in their test that the system was fully running. If even the factory states, it hasn´t been working up to now, may that only be wishful thinking - but why do they call it "test" than?

Can it be that there is no power outlet on the navi-table? Nor in the toilet of the owner cabin?

[Intentional Drifter]

Hi, Don --

What is the source of your information on this? Did you go to the show?

ID

[Don K.]

Yes I have

[Don K.]

Have you got any news from your dealer?

[Don K.]

I just had another look at the "test-"announcement of multihulls:
"Hybrid propulsion, does it work? We would like to state here clearly the fact that the new propulsion system offered by Lagoon works, and works well!"
A bit too enthusiastic ...