450: Is Quick chain counter compatible with another windlass?

[Millerslocal]

Hi all,

Does anyone know if a Quick anchor chain counter is compatible with any other windlass?

Our Quick 1700w winch finally died. Motor has burnt out and not sure if salvageable. It has gone off to the auto-electrician, but not holding out much hope.

It has been struggling to haul in our 12mm chain and 40kg Mantus from anything deeper than 12-15m. Just recently I purchased a new top deck unit (drum/gypsey) so would now have to replace the motor/gearbox. However, am loathe to do this if the new unit will just struggle as much as the original. Ideally we would like to have the option to anchor in 25m, so really do need a windlass that can handle the vertical load of 25-30m of 12mm chain and the 40kg anchor. We anchor at least twice a day.

I cannot buy a bigger motor for the Quick, as their 2000w or 2300w options are 24v only, and I have a 12v system.

Considering a new winch altogether - and know other owners are happy with the Lofrans X3.

My question is - is it possible to adapt the Quick chain counter for use on the Lofrans, or are they manufacture specific? I just bought the chain counter 3 months ago and would be frustrated to have wasted that money if I do switch winches.

And those with the Lofrans X3 - does it cope with a heavy chain/anchor combo from depths of 25/30m?

Thanks!

[RONDO]

i have a 440 and if yours is wired the same then your real problem is the wiring size and length from the factory causing voltage drop under load .You have two good options by adding 1 or 2 batteries near your windlass wired into your house bank using existing cables .Then you could with a series parralell
relay get 24v from two 12v batteries .Or with 1 battery keep your voltage drop under control.i have done both these mods on many yachts with good improvement in function.[lots more grunt]

[tuskie]

Replace or properly repair your 1700w Quick and it will easily retrieve 30m plus of 12mm chain.

Many, many owners have done this. PaulinOz has posted several informative posts about this. Other friends with an older model 1500w Quick on a L440 were certain that it had recently "died" and were shopping for replacements. Luckly a tinkerer with a small workshop managed to miraculously resurrect it for the cost of replacing generic bearings and seals, and a motor overhaul. Good as new and ready to haul 12mm chain for another 5 years at least.

If the winch struggles or slows in the future then it's time to check connections or clean out the motor insides.

[Bean Counter]

The installation manual for the Chain counter says it can work with other windlasses.

"
Other windlasses
In order for the chain counter to measure the exact length of the chain, it has to count the number of rev-
olutions completed by the gear that drives the chain (gypsy). A laps sensor kit is supplied with the chain
counter. This kit includes a cylindrical magnet, a magnetic field sensor and two plastic adaptors to be used
to secure the sensor in place. The magnet is to be secured to the gypsy while the magnetic sensor is to be
fixed to the windlass base.
The standard installation procedure is described below. Unfortunately we cannot describe a procedure ap-
plicable to all types of situation. Adapt this procedure to satisfy your own individual requirements

[Bean Counter]

If your motor has burned out due to corroded wiring leads or terminals , or insufficient cable guage, the the next motor will also burn out irrespective of brand. If you put a more powerful motor on - say 2000 Watts you will need to ensure that existing wiring can handle it. Anyway I think you have had advice on another thread on this aspect.

[DavefromNZ]

Yes it will work with other windlass. It uses a simple read switch, ie a magnet passing a sensor and is easy to measure how much chain passes with one turn and put that number into the chain counter data.

[tuskie]

Originally Posted by DavefromNZ

Yes it will work with other windlass. It uses a simple read switch, ie a magnet passing a sensor and is easy to measure how much chain passes with one turn and put that number into the chain counter data.

Would it be accurate, if the new winch had a different diameter gypsy?

[DavefromNZ]

Sure. It is easy to calibrate the chain counter for any size gypsy.

[SaltyMetals]

I have a Lofrans Airon on a 2004 Jeanneau 43ds with up to 80m of 10mm chain and a 20Kg Bruce . I had trouble with the counter and Quick sent me a new magnet and sensor. Luckily i only had to replace the old totally rusted magnet. You only have to drill a small hole underneath yr gypsy making sure that it will exactly pass over the sensor. Does not matter what the diameter of the gypsy is but you will find that the spot where you drill the hole in the gypsy is a bit limited since there has to be enough thickness to drill a deep enough hole. So you cannot do it too near the outer edge of the gypsy where it is thinner.

Having set it up you go into the CALLIBRATION mode on the cockpit controller/counter and recallibrate so that it then can be told what length of chain is run out on each turn. Really simple. It is all in the manual which you can get online if you do not have it.

Best of luck (maybe the old one will still work)
Andrew
"Genial Bee"

[tuskie]

Thanks Dave and SM.☺

[Millerslocal]

Thanks all!

It's good to know the Quick counter would be compatible with other windlasses if I decide to swap out the Quick.

It is also good to know that maybe the Quick died not as a consequence the chain/anchor weight being too heavy but rather possibly due to voltage draw issues or gunk collecting in the gearbox. Our chain had suddenly rusted badly (went from looking fine to horribly rusty in the space of 6 months) and was giving off a lot of rust flakes etc so most likely would have contributed to muck in the gearbox (new 12mm chain has been ordered).

Mention was made of possibly insufficient cable gauge causing voltage drop - how does one test/evaluate this?

Rondo- your suggestion to add an additional battery close to the windlass to negate the voltage drop makes sense. You mention that it can be added to the existing battery wire to the windlass in series? Could you please elaborate.

I had originally thought the Quick motor simply was not powerful enough to deal with the load hence it failing, but if the failure is due to resolvable issues like voltage drop and collection of dirt within it, then it would make sense just to replace the existing 1700w motor with the same one.

[SaltyMetals]

I should have added on my post that if you replace the magnet you must then make sure it is well sealed inside the hole. I used araldite and kept the gypsy upside down until the araldite had set which securely fixed the magnet and left a flush finish. What often happens (as also in my case) is that the original sealing let in some salt water and then you will find that eventually there is no actual metal left at all, just rusty powder in the hole which can simply be drilled out so the hole inside is a clean metal finish, ready to take the new magnet. Carefull! Don't drill too deep or you will come out the other side which is the surface which grabs the chain.

To test if your wiring is good enough, put a voltmeter across the terminals at the motor and then compare it with the voltage that your battery monitor is showing you at the chart table. There will always be a partial drop in voltage but if it is excessive you can just re-wire with thicker gauge wire by pulling the new one through with the old wire. The other solution is to put an additional battery in the bow. Needs to be an engine starter battery with good CCA, not a Deep Cycle battery. If there is not enough space you could wire two smaller 6V batteries in series and thereby get your 12V. Read Nigel Calder's book on boat maintenance, it has all the details in there, what minimum gauge you need for what distance, etc. A very useful book for all sorts of things. I think there should be a copy on every boat. I have no financial interest in his publication, just a happy client.
Andrew
"Genial Bee"

[DavefromNZ]

I have had my magnet rust out and fail twice and the same with the read switch. Just a big hassle.

[SaltyMetals]

Dave, you don't say how long each magnet lasted. I found mine was comprehensively rusted after 12 years but i have no idea how long it had not been working for the previous owner.

As i mentioned in my previous post i sealed mine with Araldite but after reading your comment it gives me an idea. However good the seal is there is no avoiding the fact that there will be a v small expansion and contraction in the metal of the gypsy as the sun falls on it by day and it cools off at night. Maybe the answer it to take it off after a year, wash it with fresh water and thoroughly dry it (perhaps in the oven at a low temp) and then give it a treatment with something flexible like Sikaflex or Capt Tolley's Creeping Crack Cure. I am sure that would extend the life of the magnet by a few more years. Possibly fix it for good (as if anything in a marine environment could ever be "fixed for good").
Andrew

[DavefromNZ]

Hi Andrew.

My ones only lasted a few years each but they were not well sealed. I did it myself last time and hope a better job. Cheers, Dave