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Old 08-11-2011, 22:05   #1
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A Couple of Questions for L380 Owners

Hi,
Im due to pick up my L380 from the factory in April. I have a few things I would like to fit when it's being commissioned and would love some advice on any or all of the following.

My plan is to be as self sufficient as possible and not a huge consumer of power or water, so no washing machine, no microwaves or heaters or aircon or generators.

Power

Additional batteries - what is needed/recomended to add to the existing for adequate storage?

HO Alternator - if I need to run th eengines to charge the batteries, Id prefer run for a minimum of time, I was thinking of replacing the existing Alternator with a high output one in either both engines or one only, this also gives me a spare alternator (or 2) - or - add an additional pulley/belt to one or both. What is a good option and pricing? I see lots of threads on here but I find it all a bit confusing, I really just want to hear of what works with the 380 engines and space ( I have the yanmar
3YM30 SD)

Solar panels - Id like a lot I guess, maybe 4/135W on the davits and one more on the hard bimini ? total 675W with a MPPT controller?

Wind Generator - AIR Breeze mounted on a pole somwhere aft - suggestions for location and mounting and anything else required?

Have I missed anything to have a simple to mannage, self sufficient power system?


Water

either a katadyn power survivor40 or 80 or a spectra ventura150. Im leaning toward the spectra because it seems to have half the power required and also the option of later fitting the auto controller.
Where is the best place to locate it? I was thinking in the forward locked next to the water tanks, would that be the quietest and most efficient place? If I do go for the smaller katadyn40 is there any downside if I need to run it daily for a few hours? would it be noisy or annoying to have to do it? or even every few days to top up the tank for 8 hours?

Thats the main things I need to resolve pretty soon. Also Id like to know options for downwind sailing. My 380 will come with the genneker rig but no genneker. Should I buy one? if so whats the specifications to suit? I was thinking of using Tasker sails from thailand - any other recomendations? a spinaker also maybe? I will be tradewind cruising mostly and not in a hurry, but it would be nice to keep moving in 5-10 knots with a kite.

Id also be interested in anyone experience or recomendations of chandlers and contractors in Les Sables.

Any advice is greatly appreciated on any of these points.

Thanks !
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Old 08-11-2011, 23:52   #2
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Re: A Couple of Questions for L380 Owners

.

Power

Additional batteries - what is needed/recomended to add to the existing for adequate storage?

Lots of space under the bed starboard the "sky" is the limit


HO Alternator - if I need to run th eengines to charge the batteries, Id prefer run for a minimum of time, I was thinking of replacing the existing Alternator with a high output one in either both engines or one only, this also gives me a spare alternator (or 2) - or - add an additional pulley/belt to one or both. What is a good option and pricing? I see lots of threads on here but I find it all a bit confusing, I really just want to hear of what works with the 380 engines and space ( I have the yanmar
3YM30 SD)

Lots of possibility but remember the cabling size, you can't install a extra alternator only replace the existing off course need poly system.


Solar panels - Id like a lot I guess, maybe 4/135W on the davits and one more on the hard bimini ? total 675W with a MPPT controller?

We have two 245W on the davit with MPPT give lots of power see blog for image and detail


Have I missed anything to have a simple to mannage, self sufficient power system?

You need to install a good remote panel for the inverter,.



Don't hesitate to ask a great boat lots to do and learn
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Old 11-11-2011, 04:07   #3
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Re: A Couple of Questions for L380 Owners

Thanks for the info.
Batteries - I'm not sure what size and number of comes as standard..any idea?

HO Alternator - I'm thinking it may be an expense I dont need. Can I just swap the existing for a slightly higher output one without changing cabling etc? Otherwise I will stick with the ones that come. Any idea what output they have?

Solar and wind...still considering whats needed. I really dont want to have to run the engines for power. The only items using power will be the usual onboard electronics plus watermaker and laptop.

Inverter..It says it comes with 220V shore power charger, but I guess that isn't necessarily an Inverter/charger. Again the only items needing 240v at sea would be a laptop, phone chargers, a few other chargers like cameras etc. Can I just install a smallish 1000w inverter to take care of those things ? wondering what it comes with and if it can be used with a separate inverter or if I need to replace it with an inverter/charger
also, do you have a watermaker? whats the best location for that?

Thanks again
Monte...
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Old 11-11-2011, 10:18   #4
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Re: A Couple of Questions for L380 Owners

Thanks for the info.
Batteries - I'm not sure what size and number of comes as standard..any idea?

The standard package will not be enough top run for long period away from the plug. Our was upgraded immediately by previous owner

HO Alternator - I'm thinking it may be an expense I dont need. Can I just swap the existing for a slightly higher output one without changing cabling etc? Otherwise I will stick with the ones that come. Any idea what output they have?

If engine are Yanmar 3YM30 those are the 29hp they are 60 or 80 Amp the max you can go with HO is 120-140 with a serpentine kit after you would kill the bearing and take to much power away.

Solar and wind...still considering whats needed. I really dont want to have to run the engines for power. The only items using power will be the usual onboard electronics plus watermaker and laptop.

Just do a energy budget it's eye opening, we went with Solar panel and honda generator when all fail.

Watermaker on 12 volt do a lots of research on that we are going with 110 V

Energy budget, time to count. · SV Letitgo

Inverter..It says it comes with 220V shore power charger, but I guess that isn't necessarily an Inverter/charger. Again the only items needing 240v at sea would be a laptop, phone chargers, a few other chargers like cameras etc. Can I just install a smallish 1000w inverter to take care of those things ? wondering what it comes with and if it can be used with a separate inverter or if I need to replace it with an inverter/charger
also, do you have a watermaker? whats the best location for that?

It come with a dolphin charger for the small battery bank. You will need to upgrade once you go bigger. You will need minimum 2000w for the inverter to enable running of the longer list that you believe you will need LOL

We don't have a watermaker this month but will in the next three forward locker will be where he live.

Thanks again
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Old 11-11-2011, 18:51   #5
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Re: A Couple of Questions for L380 Owners

Thanks again mate. I checked out your energy budget..nice job!
As I have no experience with what I will use personally, I will go from your experience to date. I would like to make whatever I do expandable should the need arise (Add alternator, more solar panels, additional windvane, but dont want to do overkill initially.

So lets assume I have your energy consumption and would only like to turn on the engines to charge batteries if I go over your worste case scenario on passage budget.

Also lets assume I add a wind generator putting out 65Ah/day.

I will use an MMSI controller to control both. Somthing like Blue Sky Energy Inc. | Solar Boost 3024iL DUO

That just leaves the amount of solar and the battery bank to be decided.

So what would you recommend is ideal for that scenario?...i.e. 4 /250Ah batteries and 4 /135w solar panels with X controller and Y 2000w charger/inverter.
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Old 11-11-2011, 22:13   #6
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Re: A Couple of Questions for L380 Owners

Go in step depending on what you are doing I would go large bank first with inverter then solar what ever you feel like wind generator, hydro generator ect....



Also lets assume I add a wind generator putting out 65Ah/day.

That fairly high if I may Nigel Calder doesn't even add anything for a wind generator input
and on the boat I have been we never saw magic number from them either


I will use an MMSI controller to control both. Somthing like Blue Sky Energy Inc. | Solar Boost 3024iL DUO

This model is one of the best on the market as of today


That just leaves the amount of solar and the battery bank to be decided.

So what would you recommend is ideal for that scenario?...i.e. 4 /250Ah batteries and 4 /135w solar panels with X controller and Y 2000w charger/inverter.

All Decision are personal, what we did was 2/435W panel the battery we will put three 350AH when time come to change the three we have now that are only 420Ah total

Sample of what we did for the frame
The frame is up. · SV Letitgo
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Old 12-11-2011, 19:12   #7
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Re: A Couple of Questions for L380 Owners

I'm not sure what the factory supplies for batteries. I run 1 group 31 lead acid battery for starting each engine (2 engines = 2 batteries) and six lead acid golf cart batteries for the house. I'm personalally not into all the fancy "hi tech" batteries as I have yet to see the cost justify the difference. Search the forums about batteries and you'll have days of material to read through. Congrats on your new purchase
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Old 13-11-2011, 07:08   #8
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Re: A Couple of Questions for L380 Owners

This is the factory set up
2 x 70 amp for the motors, and 3 x 140 amp for the "Use" bank.(normal is 2 x 140 amp)
this is under the bed in port aft cabin,
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Old 14-11-2011, 22:34   #9
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Re: A Couple of Questions for L380 Owners

Thanks a lot Careka ! nice to see the actual setup and battery type. I read these batteries are pretty cheap. There seems to be room to add a few more there. I wonder if I am best to ditch the stock ones and go 6 better quality ones from the start. Still not sure on my energy demands but id rather have half an idea before I start asking for quotes from the installers.
Who did you use in Les Sables for after factory work and supplies Careka?
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Old 14-11-2011, 22:48   #10
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Re: A Couple of Questions for L380 Owners

Mine are 5 years old and still giving me enough for coastal cruising. Just need equalization once in a while and give you a few years of joy.

Plus now you don't need lots of battery to have high AMP/hours saving weight and that the battle on a Cat if you want to keep some speed.

Plus by then you will know what you really want.

Enjoy trial and error make you a better purchaser LOL
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Old 15-11-2011, 02:38   #11
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Re: A Couple of Questions for L380 Owners

Quote:
Originally Posted by monte View Post
There seems to be room to add a few more there. I wonder if I am best to ditch the stock ones and go 6 better quality ones from the start. Still not sure on my energy demands but id rather have half an idea before I start asking for quotes from the installers.
Who did you use in Les Sables for after factory work and supplies Careka?
Well there is rom for 1 or 2 more of the 140 amps like this,
But from Victron "people" i have been told that, dont make a bank bigger then 4 x 140/165 amp. and i think it is due to how your charger need to do the jobb to fill them bakc up. but you can ask more on the EL forum pages.
The batts are not bad, even if they are cheap. they just need to be looked afther.
i will keep them until there is no life left, and like "letitgo" they work fine.
solar and wind power keeps them full all times, is the best way to go.
The new boats have all LED all over. so you dont use that much as older boats do.
I did not do any work in Sables, i did by some small suff, from Eriks shop due to they had an english speaking . and they had all i needed. and prices where good.ekstra filters, fenders, oil, washing stuff ect,
they are 75meters (go left, not over brige) from gate when you come up from the pontons.
there a good resturants, (go left.) and supermaked go rigth and into town. its not far off. many shops selling boat stuff.
Under the stb bed, there is only the 70 amp batt for the motor, so
plenty of space for a batt bank #2 if you really ned to, but i use it to store other stuff, bags ect. try to keep the KG`S down.
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Old 15-11-2011, 22:35   #12
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Re: A Couple of Questions for L380 Owners

Thanks again guys...
SvL..I prefer make my choices on other peoples trials and errors ! that being said I had another look at your specs and energy budget and also ordered Nigel Calder's Cruising Handbook. ( I was googling who the hell he was after you mentioned his name)

Im thinking I will use 300Ah day as my base requirement for calculations. ( I deducted UHF/heating and half computer from your budget)

Also thinking I will keep the supplied batteries and add a minimum of 2 more similar to total 5/140Ah (700Ah)

I will allow the same solar as you have 2/230W. (460W total) Do you have a picture of yours installed? is the size ok over the dingy?

plus the wind generator with allowance of 60Ah/day

MMSI controller to control both. Blue Sky Energy Inc. | Solar Boost 3024iL DUO

2000w inverter charger - model?

some kind of battery monitor? not sure what comes standard or if its usable.

How does this scenario stack up? Am I missing something or light on with battery storage or charging facility? Im not sure what calculations to do to check. I understand theres no point having X size battery bank if you dont have the means to recharge it.

Careka...re the victron people...is that who makes the charger in the 380? can you tell me what model it is if you have the info at hand? Also..do lagoon supply a manual fro the boat in PDF format or do they just supply separate paper manuals for the individual components. Id like to start preparing and reading as much as I can prior to pickup.

Thanks again , I really appreciate all the help learning !
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Old 15-11-2011, 22:58   #13
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Re: A Couple of Questions for L380 Owners

I will allow the same solar as you have 2/230W. (460W total) Do you have a picture of yours installed? is the size ok over the dingy?

Have a look on your blog do a search and you will find picture of frame and installation.


2000w inverter charger - model?

The mastervolt seem to be a great product a lot more expensive than other again a personal choice we inherited a zantrex 2000 it work nothing else to say about it.

some kind of battery monitor? not sure what comes standard or if its usable.

Normally you will have an optional one coming with the charger inverter you choose.

How does this scenario stack up? Am I missing something or light on with battery storage or charging facility? Im not sure what calculations to do to check. I understand theres no point having X size battery bank if you dont have the means to recharge it.

Energy is very personal, and depend of equipment and style of living.

Yes if you have a 800 Ah bank you need a fair amount a power in so get the specialist to provide the right equipment. The key is a balance system easier say than done LOL

I would not add battery for now if you just do coastal and have access to plug in. For us the solar was enough in not so sunny place this summer with battery that are dying.

My 2cts


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Old 15-11-2011, 23:39   #14
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Re: A Couple of Questions for L380 Owners

Click image for larger version

Name:	DSC00032.jpg
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ID:	33741There is rom for 5 x 140 batts under the port bed.
and the charger that is standard will not be good if you put in 5 x 140 you need a bigger one, orginal is Cristec CPS30EM ,40 amp

And batt monitor, Mastervolt and Victron is top of the line,
And afther Mastervolt, started to make a good deal of its product in China, i do hold Victron as better these days.
i have the battmeter 602S it cost a lot less then Mastervolts,
Marine market
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Old 18-11-2011, 01:26   #15
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Re: A Couple of Questions for L380 Owners

wow, so much I need to change and upgrade before I even pick up the boat ! thanks a lot for all the help and advice. Id love to just live with the factory setup and then decide what I need but I know I would decide in the next week what I Should have had done while I was in les sables. I am thinking of trying to use the supplied items though and working within the constraint of those (40a charger and 3/140Ah wet cell batteries) Id like to add another 140Ah battery to make 4/140Ah if the charger can handle that. Careka you said that it wont handle any more than 3 or 4 batteries? Also isnt there a battery monitor supplied as standard?
Ill add the solar panels and controller and wind gen.
So im thinking I might pick up a honda generator to handle any shortage in capacity for now. Either the eu1000i or eu2000i. At least it will be a good stopgap till I decide what suits me and will supply 240v for tools or heater if necessary.
I notice you have the 2000i SvL.
will the 40amp charger handle 460w solar + windgen 60w max, as well as the generator when needed, or will I need to bite the bullet and replace it imediately? I just hate the thought of ditching a $700 item if I dont need to. Theres always ebay I guess..
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