420: 2007 420 Advice Requested

[ArtM]

Well, as mentioned before I am interested in getting a Lagoon 410 or 420.

Right now, I'm trying to get a grip on the 420's, and hoping to get some advice from those of you who have been tracking them closely.

I know there have been lots of changes in these boats - drivetrain conversions, variations in the hull shape affecting performance, options on mast height, and I don't even know what else.

What should I be looking for, or avoiding, or asking questions about on this 420?

Are there any versions or subversions or variations that would substantially change the liveability, or the size or weight or performance of this model?

2007 I believe was the first model year for the 420, which I am not getting super excited about - however, it is in my preferred age/price range for the 420. What significant "first year" issues should I be looking for? What are the deal-breakers/deal-makers?

Thanks ,
Rich

[timbenner]

Rich,

Obviously you could find a 410 for a much better used price, since they've been making them for so long. A big issue I would like to point out to you is that the 410 weighs 16,000 lbs when the 420 weighs 27,000 lbs. Is that 2% more length for 68% more weight? Wow, what happened? I know that they didn't put a lead keel in the 420. I would suspect that there is a big difference in speed, but don't have any first hand experience.

Both have a little bit more of a haul - out problem than the 380. That 22'+ beam cancels out a lot of travel lifts.

Another big difference is engine location. I'm pretty sure that the 420 engines are in the transom steps, like the 380. Having the engines under the bunks, like the 410, gives you side walking ability, with the saildrive forward of the rudders. The 420 and 380 have the rudders forward of the sail drives, so side walking doesn't happen. By side walking, I mean that you can turn the rudders and blast them with the sail drives to walk the boat sideways. Not a big deal, but nice.

Engines under the bunks versus under the transom stairs? Better weight distribution under the bunks. You can fool with them in heavy seas or rain without getting wet, but how often are you going to do that? I vote for the engines under the transom steps; not as much noise, less smell, vibration, but MOST important to me, easy to check the engines without rousting the bed and it's inhabitants. I like to leave the dock early while wife and child are sleeping. Must check the engines first, so doing that on my 380 bothers no one. If I had to remove wife and child from bed early, I would pay for that all day!

For me, I loath the cheap laminate, photo paper, fake wood finish that Lagoon went to with the newer boats. I think that you can get the real wood veneer as an option, but I would assume that few of the 420's have the real wood veneer and that most of the 410's have real wood. I think that the cheap laminate veneer really trashes the interior of the boats. Maybe not a big deal to most people, could just be my problem.

[Sand crab]

Lots of 420s were hybrids but most have now been converted. I think they were trying to develop the 420 as a multi use boat with either sail or as a powercat. It sucked at the powercat so it never was put in production that way. The 421 is the new version. I think it has a new hull shape. There was some info on this in a Multihulls World article.
Btw, all of the modern Lagoons are heavy but they have put up a fair amount of sail as compensation.

[cwyckham]

Oops, sorry thought this was a pot thread

[POH]

SandCrab - can you send me info re: hull change. I've been looking at 420s and saw a 421 on the hard and was told (by a disinterested broker who was actually trying to talk me OUT of a 420 in favour of one of his boats) that it was the same hull.

[Sand crab]

Someone just posted a pic of the old hull here somewhere but I can't find it now. It had this weird dip down at the aft end. I thought I read that Lagoon was trying to design a power/sail cat with one size fits all hull configuration. It didn't work well for power but was OK for sail. I remember something else in the article about the 420 gurgling underway. This was in MultihullsWorld mag, I think. I'll see if I can find it. I apologize in advance if I got any of this wrong to all the 420 owners but I suffer from CRS syndrome.

[rebel heart]

Originally Posted by cwyckham

Oops, sorry thought this was a pot thread

Yeah, I can help with 420 advice but I don't know crap about the boats

[POH]

Yes, I saw that picture too. I'm thinking it was photo-shopped - I dove a 420 yesterday to have a look at the hull and it looked the same as the hull for the 421 (i.e. no weird flattening) ... but that was in the water and I have to say the other photo scarred me and I really WANT to believe it doesn't look like that, so maybe my perception was distorted.

(And no, not in the OTHER 420 way).

[jostalli]

read here: http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...ml#post1018976

[POH]

Originally Posted by POH

Yes, I saw that picture too. I'm thinking it was photo-shopped - I dove a 420 yesterday to have a look at the hull and it looked the same as the hull for the 421 (i.e. no weird flattening) ... but that was in the water and I have to say the other photo scarred me and I really WANT to believe it doesn't look like that, so maybe my perception was distorted.

(And no, not in the OTHER 420 way).

Nope - picture was correct, the 420 and 421 have different hull shapes.

[ArtM]

Originally Posted by timbenner

For me, I loath the cheap laminate, photo paper, fake wood finish that Lagoon went to with the newer boats. I think that you can get the real wood veneer as an option, but I would assume that few of the 420's have the real wood veneer and that most of the 410's have real wood. I think that the cheap laminate veneer really trashes the interior of the boats. Maybe not a big deal to most people, could just be my problem.

I just saw the new Lagoons. The old ones were bad, but the new ones are horrible. I won't be buying a recent Lagoon for this reason, now that the Leopards are available in similar plans.

[careka]

goog luck

[Sand crab]

That 421 review is in the May/June 2010 issue of Multihulls World mag. It mentions the 420 hull designed for power instead of sail and the gurgling underway. It goes on to mention the 421 revisions which include the hull mods, slightly lowered hull height, and a 5% increase in sail area. You can download it from their website for a small fee.