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Old 15-03-2013, 06:26   #31
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Re: Project Boat: Engineless 35'ish blue water cruiser project

Mike, yep, I read your going electric posts a month or so ago. Couldn't agree more. I'd like to own a boat, but I don't want to own a diesel. I definitely prefer the EP benefits and hassles to the diesel benefits and hassles.. Although will still have a generator in the mix.
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Old 15-03-2013, 07:06   #32
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Re: Project Boat: Engineless 35'ish blue water cruiser project

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Having had converted to electric propulsion in 2008 I have to shake my head at all the negativity about it's use in a cruising sailboat. I would encourage the OP to go for it. I cruise the same places I did when I had the Westerbeke 27 diesel on board. Only the boat is and smells a lot cleaner. Have not had to clean the exhaust off the stern in six years. Maintenance is minimal. So are the spare parts I need to carry. Best of all it operates so very quietly. So even after 10 hours of motoring one is not as fatigued as listening and feeling the vibration from a diesel.
I agree if one wants a pure electric play you will need time and a lot of solar for charging. I prefer a three legged stool approach using solar, wind and a Honda 2000 generator. Of course dock power is also another option. But, I'm usually on a mooring or at anchor. It works well on so many levels. Another thing is there are so many ways to use electric propulsion. For example if the winds are light I just add a touch of propulsion to negate any prop drag and get a nice bump in speed without the noise of starting a diesel or expense of a folding prop. Doldrums? You could charge during the day and motor at night or with a Honda or other generator in the mix you could motor when ever you wanted. With EP you've got a lot more options for moving the boat in all kinds of winds. There's more benefits but, I'll stop here.
Hi Mike,

Not saying that you are referring to my comments in regard to negativity but regardless, I want to make it clear that I would love to go electric, for all the reasons you give and more. However, it just isn't practical for all boats.

My reasons.

1. Available power.

You have a 30' boat, I have a 42'. The current power is 58 HP and I wouldn't mind a bit more. I have looked at every commercially available electric drive and converting KW to HP the closest I could come was more or less half that. Yes, I know all the issues about electric low rpm full torque, parasitic losses with the diesel, how much power is actually used to run at a conservative cruising speed in a calm, etc. But there is that occasional situation like I encountered in Charleston with a 3 kt current running through the marina where it took ever bit of power I had to avoid being pushed down the fuel dock into the side of a 90' goldplater. If I had been running a lower powered electric at the time I would have been filing an insurance claim.

2. Range.

For the next couple of years, due to family and work circumstances I will be spending a bit of time in the ICW. To be able to motor 60-80 miles per day, day after day I would have to install a ton of batteries or a large generator. The batteries add cost, weight and negate a lot of the "green" advantages of electric. Add a big generator and you are back to engine maintenance and repair.

3. Price

I have priced every commercially available electric system I could find, and even without a generator the costs are well above the price of a new engine and transmission. Add the generator and the cost can be triple.

If you can find me a solution that addresses these issues I will rip the diesel out and go electric as fast as I can get the parts delivered.
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Old 15-03-2013, 07:12   #33
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Re: Project Boat: Engineless 35'ish blue water cruiser project

Whatever happened to the original poster that was looking for a bluewater project boat?
Is he still in this game?
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Old 15-03-2013, 07:15   #34
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Re: Project Boat: Engineless 35'ish blue water cruiser project

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Whatever happened to the original poster that was looking for a bluewater project boat?
Is he still in this game?
Well yes. Look two posts up........... Max Sail.
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Old 15-03-2013, 07:24   #35
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Re: Project Boat: Engineless 35'ish blue water cruiser project

Sorry,

Max sail, what about the boat available here in key west?
Is it for you?
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Old 15-03-2013, 07:37   #36
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Re: Project Boat: Engineless 35'ish blue water cruiser project

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Sorry,
Well your profile says Key West so you have a good excuse for being a little fuzzy in the am.

So, late night? Missed your morning cup of coffee? Maybe need a second?

Speaking of which, think I could use another cup this morning.
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Old 15-03-2013, 07:45   #37
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Re: Project Boat: Engineless 35'ish blue water cruiser project

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Max sail, what about the boat available here in key west?
Is it for you?

Is that the Westsail? Based on Max's comments I think it would be a great idea. Any idea what they might take for it?

Problem is, Max wants to pay 0-$10K and he's in Michigan. Based on what I pay for shipping goods around the US I'm estimating KW to MI for a Westsail could be at least $5-$6K just for the trucking.

I think Max needs to move to FL.
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Old 15-03-2013, 07:45   #38
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Re: Project Boat: Engineless 35'ish blue water cruiser project

there is a decent boat here in zihuatenejo -- is a mariner 31, engine spozedly works...mizzen not failing, so the deck is more or less intact and not rotted---looks like a pelican lives on board--boat is intact and the owner is usa citizen with proper documentation ...... would be a cool lil cruiser. owner is a charter cpt here in zihuatenejo and is serious about selling. under 10,000 usdollars.
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Old 15-03-2013, 07:55   #39
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Re: Project Boat: Engineless 35'ish blue water cruiser project

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Is that the Westsail? Based on Max's comments I think it would be a great idea. Any idea what they might take for it?

Problem is, Max wants to pay 0-$10K and he's in Michigan. Based on what I pay for shipping goods around the US I'm estimating KW to MI for a Westsail could be at least $5-$6K just for the trucking.

I think Max needs to move to FL.
There is no email on their blog, but I did end her a tweet... No response yet. Sounds like the boat could be in horrible shape... But maybe for the price. Dont like that is has some sort of 'custom' layout. I may actually be in Florida late this month.

I'm not sue I'd love a west sail though. Might be a bit too much of a brick... But it's all compromise.
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Old 15-03-2013, 08:06   #40
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Re: Project Boat: Engineless 35'ish blue water cruiser project

It should go cheap, besides they are paying $300 per month for a couple years and I think they have been here once for a couple hours since.

I could go over on my dink and take a few cell phone pics and upload them here but not after your "brick" comment.

Anyway, in loyalty to my fellow cruisers I'll buzz over there now, stay tuned for pics.

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Old 15-03-2013, 08:07   #41
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Re: Project Boat: Engineless 35'ish blue water cruiser project

DOJ, we are mostly on the same page. I think that EP has a useable place in sailing, and If I was day sailing out of Marina Del Ray I think it would be nice to have the silence and clean motoring of a battery powered boat, but for long distance cruising I think the downside of limitations are still too great. Of course that is an opinion, and as I said in my original post, I think that in 10 or 20 years EP may be the norm, or maybe even required by law. Both solar panels and batteries are getting better and better, but at this point I wonder how many square feet of solar panel would be needed to move a heavy displacement 35 foot cruising boat at a reasonable speed(no where near hull speed) and build your battery bank back up at the same time? I have never done calculations on that sort of thing, but I suspect you would be ducking under and crawling over solar panels all over your boat. The future will slowly change things toward EP, but not yet prime time for it.____Just another opinion.____Grant.
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Old 15-03-2013, 08:17   #42
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In the meantime, look at how much room you could have for the electrical motor stuff.
You can stand in a Westsail 32's engine room.
But serioussly. the cockpit sole is removable making it a pleasure for working on the systems or Niagara Mohawk if you so desire.
These are pics of my "brick" not the "brick" that I'm going over to now.
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Old 15-03-2013, 08:29   #43
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I would suggest cold calling some boat yards to see if there are any boats in their yard they want to get rid of. We bought our last boat in Haddam, CT. The day we were leaving, the yard owner gave us a printout of about 15 boats that he was selling for next-to-nothing or were free (these were boats left behind with unpaid yard fees).
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Old 15-03-2013, 08:38   #44
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Re: Project Boat: Engineless 35'ish blue water cruiser project

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Whereabouts?
My neighborhood on Whidbey Island WA.

Steve
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Old 15-03-2013, 08:46   #45
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Re: Project Boat: Engineless 35'ish blue water cruiser project

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Hi Mike,

Not saying that you are referring to my comments in regard to negativity but regardless, I want to make it clear that I would love to go electric, for all the reasons you give and more. However, it just isn't practical for all boats.
Skipmac

I hear ya. I agree electric propulsion may not be for everyone or every boat. I certainly had a lot of qualms and questions before I made the leap over five years ago. But, I've since found have EP has also enhanced the sailing experience. For me the install costs were way less than a new diesel and even the five years of pretty much zero maintenance has only added to cost savings. Five years of no oil changes, antifreeze and filters have added up. I can only speak from my experience but, it has improved my time spent on board. Improvements in battery technology will only make it better though my 210 amp 48 volt AGM bank is holding up really well after five years. So I see no need to change it. But, it will be rather easy to do when/if I want to. When I see comments that EP is not there yet and won't work I just have to smile. I know it works for me and there is no where I would not take my boat with it's EP system.
I would not advise anybody to take out a perfectly working diesel to put in EP but, as the OP said he's looking for a boat without and engine or a dead one. IMO it is a perfect time to consider an EP install. I am very happy I made the switch and have never longed to have the diesel back on board.
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