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Old 02-11-2009, 09:23   #121
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Asymmetric chute in sock using a bridal for the tack point

The cheapest and easiest would be an asymmetric chute in sock using a bridal for the tack point. I use this setup on a 44 foot cat and it works great. Used chutes can be found on Ebay or from several used sailmakers for very low cost. You can fix up a bridal on the bow quite cheaply. Then you only need a snatch block for the sheet. You can even use only one sheet and simply jibe the chute by snuffing it and move the snatch block and sheet around to the other side.

These shots should give you a good idea of how I do it. Its a very simply method. You lose a bit by not having the chute further out in front of the boat with a sprite but I feel the issues with a bow sprite are not worth dealing with. With the bridal you can center the tack and sheet it down low to sail close hauled or you can move it over to one side of the boat or the other and let the tack rise up for sailing more downwind.
Your one issue might be how to run your sheets to get them on winches.
e-mail George at sailvi767@aol.com if you have any questions

From these pictures you will see a few different methods.

Cheapest method. Tacked with a dock line!!!

Reaching-bridal

Bridal again, running

Tacked with a adjustable bridal

George
This is Georges post I just uploaded his pictures for him, Mark
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Old 02-11-2009, 10:33   #122
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You guys are so helpfull. Now how big of a chute can I handle safely? do you need an extra winch or can it be raise by hand,I am sure it is pretty light. I have only been sailing for 3 years,that is why I am asking those stupid questions,though I am having a blast,one thing I have learned the hard way is to go with the wind,don't fight it,it much better on the boat and crew and much faster.
Thanks to you all.
JC.
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Old 02-11-2009, 12:55   #123
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The chute I am using in the picture is a 1200 sq ft 1.5 ounce chute. The boats basic main and jib rig is 1160 sq ft so you can estimate the size of the chute for your boat from those numbers. I was advised by everyone to get a 3/4 ounce chute which would be easier to handle but of course less durable. I am guessing the Mahe chute would be around 850 sq ft. In a 3/4 ounce weight that should be very manageable and easy to store. Even in a 1.5 ounce it should be fine. I hoist the chute in the sock without using a winch with no problems. You will need as mentioned a snatch block and some place on each side to clip in the snatch block to manage the sheets. Spinnaker winches are nice but not needed if you can route the sheet to your jib winches or any available winch. The boat should have been built with attach points for the snatch block. Loads on the sheets can be quite high and a winch is a must. For dead down wind sailing on a cat with this rig its best to drop the main and only use the chute. Even being a assymetric it will naturally want to fly up and in front of the boat. You can let the down wind side of the bridal almost loose and the chute will rotate out front and up. If you are reaching you pully both sides of the bridal in tight and fly the chute as a big jib with the tack centered between the hulls and as low as you can get it for a tight leach. I can point to 50 to 55 degrees apparent without a sprite using this method and the mainsail up. My rule of thumb is to drop the main anytime the wind is within 30 degrees of the stern. You don't gain anything with the main and it will cause the chute to collapse and you can hour glass it easily. I have had that happen twice with the main up but never with the main down.
I was advised to go the 3/4 ounce chute because it would fly better in light winds however the 1.5 ounce flies just fine in 5 knots of wind.

George
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Old 03-11-2009, 18:29   #124
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Asymmetric chute in sock using a bridal for the tack point

George was nice enough to send us a close up of his asymmetric chute in sock using a bridal for the tack point.
He uses two pulleys at 4 to 1. On a smaller chute you could get by with less. Here is a closeup picture of the blocks. Since the photo was taken I added a strop to the tack and clip the blocks to the strop. This solved an issue with getting a twist in the sail sometimes when it was hoisted because the two blocks did not allow the tack to rotate if that makes sense. I don't have pics of the strop but any decent line can be spliced into about a 6 inch diameter hook to thread into the tack and clip the blocks on. The bridal line itself I have rigged as one continuous line. Works great and helps keep lines from falling into the water and or fouling a prop. Takes George about 5 minutes to take it on or off. The lower blocks that I don't have a picture of, have Cam cleats however in winds over 15 knots he ties them off the lines to the crossbar cleats. The cams have not slipped but I suspect they would. You want to keep the blocks that attach to the tack as light as you can stand it to help the sail fly in drifting conditions. In fact in very very light conditions I will simply run a single line and tack it with that. With the bridal setup however and the 1.5 ounce sail it still flies well in 5 knots of wind.

George
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Old 05-11-2009, 05:54   #125
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Hi all,
I need a quick answer and am hoping that somebody is on his/her boat.
I want to purchase a new Harken winch for the spinnaker. One option is to purchase a bigger winch (Harken 44.2ST) and use this for the jib winch (the port one), and use the present jib winch for the spinnaker.
Problem could be that this winch is 2 cm higher, and the winch handle would hit it when in the starboard winch.
I would be very happy if someone could measure the height between winch handle and adjacent winch.
Thanks!
Jef
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Old 07-11-2009, 07:08   #126
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Hi all, the question about the winch is obsolete. I purchased the standard winch yesterday in Harken's special clearance sale (Netherlands -35%). Harken is introducing a new model, that's why.

I have a question:
The saloon-roof Harken winches have Stainless steel discs below deck, above the kitchen.
On our ship, there is also a winch on the rear port cabin for the spifurl. This one does not have the steel disc below deck, although the hull material is sandwich, and not single like above the kitchen. I would expect a disk to be useful, to spread the load and prevent compression of the sandwich.
Below this winch a disc could not be mounted, since the holes are too much to the back. There's not enough room.
For those that have an extra winch mounted by Fountaine Pajot: do you have this disc on your ship?
Thanks!
Kind regards,
Jef
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Old 07-11-2009, 15:47   #127
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Whinch base

Hi Jef

On my Mahe the discs under the Sheet winches are glass fibre and not stainless but I guess do the job as well. My gennaker winch (port side aft does not have a disc underneath. I would hope that they put plugs in the sandwich to stop compression but I did not check when I serviced the winch. Now that you mention it I will put a disc on it and plug the holes if they are not done. The winch is a 36 and there is not as much load as the Jib sheet winch but it does get quite high.

Cheers
Martin
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Old 08-11-2009, 05:02   #128
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winch on sandwich

Martin,
When I serviced the port winch I noticed no plugs. I was not aware of the use of plugs for this purpose. What kind of plugs would you use, and what length? Equal to hull thickness or half a mm shorter?
On our boat the 5 bolts only have small rings for M6 nuts under them, straight on the gelcoat. I think this is not a good construction, and I want to find discs for both sides.
Rgds, Jef
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Old 08-11-2009, 13:45   #129
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winch

I will check ours on Thursday when we are next on board.

The jib and main sheet winches have a stainless plate on ours and it seems to me like maybe the sandwich is removed since it is recessed into the ceiling on a smooth area.

The gennaker winch will still have a reasonable load so small washers are not enough.

d
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Old 08-11-2009, 21:26   #130
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Jef
What I would do is hollow out the sandwich around each hole and then fill it with Epoxy resin so there is a hard core that spans the gap between the two glass layers. Some people drill it oversize before filling. After the "Plug" is hard you redrill the holes to the correct size for the bolt.

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Old 15-11-2009, 09:41   #131
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Scott,
About goig up the mast: with your 230 pounds you are probably very strong. Maybe it would be easy for you to hoist somebody else? (-;P
Jef
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Old 31-12-2009, 06:02   #132
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Asymmetrical Spinnaker on a Mahe

What are the measurements of a Mahe Asymmetrical Spinnakerchute?
I would like to purchase one, but do not know what size our boats are using.

Need to know how many ounces ?
Need to know the Luff ? Leech ? & Foot ?

I am guessing the Mahe chute would be around 850 sq ft. I believe you get that size by adding the Main Sail area 505.92 sq. ft. and the Roller Furling Genoa area 322.93 sq. ft. = 829 sq. ft

I am guessing that a 3/4 ounce weight would be very manageable and easy to store.

Mark
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Old 16-02-2010, 13:57   #133
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Guys

Can someone provide the sail plan for the mainsail, eg what is the P & E?

Cheers!

JohnC
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Old 16-02-2010, 14:21   #134
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Mahe Main Sail Plan

JohnC,

The Mahe Main Sail Plan is:
P= 13460 mm or 44.16 feet
E= 5312 mm or 17.43 feet

Also see attached PDF of Mahe Sail Plan.

Mark
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Old 08-05-2010, 18:26   #135
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Were trying to figure out what size spinniker or MPS to get for a FP Mahe? Ive read through the thread, and it seems that I need the dimensions for a quote. Ive read 850 sq feet seems good. How do I determine the measurements? Im thinking about looking for a used one to try out before getting something brand new. Can anyone help me with this? Can any Mahe owners send their dimensions? We do not have a bowsprit.
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