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Old 16-04-2008, 03:11   #1
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Mahe 36 vs Lagoon 380

Live in the US, dollar too weak! Looking for what not only is best, but can afford. Saw the 380 in Annapolis in Oct, priced out at about $330USD. Reading about Mahe 36. Looking for anyone who has sailed both and has comments. Mahe is $400 USD now, is it worth 20% more?

Also, any Cats , new, in this range from NA companies? With $ so weak, I would have thought something would be priced right, looked at Manta, but seems they are out of my league.

Might have to stick with my mono for a few years till the $ strengthens.

Thanks,Scott
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Old 16-04-2008, 03:39   #2
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I cannot compare precisely Mahe Vs. Lagoon 38 but 20% price difference seems to be too much.. Mahe would probably be a bit faster, the quality of finish pretty similar.

However, talking about USD, if you are to wait until USD gets stronger, I don't know how much but you will have to wait.. Moreover, with oil prices hitting 114 USD/barrel, I would have assume that all oil derivates will go up, hence, the boat prices. In other words, althought Euro is still strong, I would expect some price increases to come soon. So you should either hurry up or stick to yr mono for a while, maybe 2-3 years.

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Old 16-04-2008, 05:03   #3
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Jbinbi if you go and look at the willmarusa.com site,you will see that they have 2 Mahe 2007,brand new for $ 260.000.I don't know where you got the 400 USD figure.good luck.
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Old 16-04-2008, 20:18   #4
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jean, thanks. I was on the fp site, and they had a price of 400+ AUD. Is willmar just a brokerage house, or are they a dealer for fp? Can you tell me anything about your boat, it looks like you have one of these? What else did you look at, and how did it compare? Thanks, Scott
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Old 17-04-2008, 05:13   #5
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Scott,Willmar is the FP dealer in Florida.You should go to the Mahe thread,you will find lots of various comments about FP and the Mahe. The price was a major point when I purchased my boat,nothing was even close .Lots of space inside for a 36'cat,same level for cockpit and salon,engine room completly isolated from the rest of the boat,galley up so my wife can interact with everybody,and I can sail the boat by myself from the helm station. This boat is my first sail boat, it is a no brainer,I like that.
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Old 17-04-2008, 08:14   #6
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Unless you have to have a new boat, you might consider a U.S.-made Manta 40 for the same money as the 36 and 38 you are currently considering. In fact, you can get a used 42 for less than US $400. And you will never beat the customer service or the quality of the build for the money with any other sailing cat.
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Old 17-04-2008, 08:45   #7
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Just to give you a little perspective. Lagoon 410s were going for around 325 back in 2002, in 2001 you could get a fully loaded Manta 42 or one of several south African boats in the 42-44 ft range for the same price of about 350k. This means the owners of those boats really can sell them at what they bought them for which is a significant discount vis a vis a new boat. You could get one of these boats 5-7 years old, completely refit the interior (10k), completely redo every piece of electrical instrumentation (15k), completely replace all of the running rigging and sails (around 11k) with the absolute best out there and still save 100k and have a bigger and better boat. Buying a new boat at a 70 -80% mark up from the prices just 5 years ago doesn't seem to make the most financial sense, because when you sell it you will be in the same market as these slightly older boats which will be selling for literally half as much and you will loose 100k in 3 years and 200k in 5 years in boat value. Trust me, I've bought and sold catamarans for 10 years, I'd never look new in this market. Never.
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Old 17-04-2008, 09:00   #8
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Ah, regarding USD and valuation, my formal education is in economics and geography (cost space relationships) and part of the studies I've seen are in the spatial economic transitions through different sectors as an economic slowdown occurs. We are in a global slowdown right now, the US economy was first in line because of over leveraged financial instruments and started to feel the effects two years ago, but this year (2008) britain, new zealand and australia are beginning to feel the same effects. In about a year the EU will feel the effects as airbus plants are shut down and moved abroad. China will probably be about 2 years. As China has never seen a downturn, it's market valuations will implode. As these other economies start to slow their currencies will weaken. In 2011 the US will start a decent recovery as the housing market will then be in recovery (it won't reach the debt/income levels it is now, it will simply even off at a level around 30% lower than it is today). So, it's not all bad, and there's no reason to rush to buy thinking that the USD will continue it's regression indefinitely, by next year we should see USD stability as other economies which are heavily dependent upon exports slow drastically. That is assuming that the debt risk swaps don't completely sink everything, in which case you might as well get as much empty land as possible and become a farmer!
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Old 17-04-2008, 09:12   #9
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And then after hijacking the threads I chime in on your question, lagoon 380 would be a more comfortable boat than the FP, with better storage in the hulls and better laid out cabins. The FP would definitely be a faster boat with synthetic core construction and far better SA/D figures. Lagoon however would probably retain it's value better as it's backed by the worlds largest dealer network. Both boats I'd say are close to equal in terms of construction quality, maybe a slight edge to lagoon.
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Old 17-04-2008, 20:10   #10
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I have a Beneteau now, and am fairly pleased with the quality, so I would expect the Lagoon to be the same, since same parent company. I do not intend ocean crossings in either, but costal cruising, sailing in bahama, carrib, etc. I sailed on a 380 at last year multi hull day, liked the layout on the boat. No wind in the morn when I was on that, so can't really tell how it sails. Sailed on Leapord 40 in afternoon, liked they way it sailed, not so much on how it was laid out, but OK.

I do think that over the next few years the USD will bounce back, life is a like a circle, sometimes you are on top, other times on the bottom, half the time in the middle. I think the next prez will pull back some of the war effort, that alone I think should reduce debt a bit, maybe that's a catalyst to usd recovery.

I am not keen on getting a boat older than 5 years old, and not one from charter. I want to spend my time sailing, not fixing. At 7-10 yrs, it becomes one thing, then the next, etc.

Any idea on how the leapord and manta sail vs. the 2 i asked about?
Scott
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Old 17-04-2008, 23:02   #11
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A Manta 42 should sail better than either you've mentioned. A leapord is a heavier and slower boat. Catana would also be a better sailor than the ones you mentioned, aided by her light weight and sailboards. A shuttleworth, maine cat are open bridgedeck boats that are faster still. If you don't mind the Euros, African cats is a boat that could retain more of it's value as its a best of breed catamaran, lighter, exotic materials, excellent sailor not hindered by having to make compromises for the charter market. Their rarity and demand by those seeking the best possible passage times in a comfortable boat will no doubt translate into high resail value. FP, Lagoon, Leapord all have to contend with a relatively swamped market of after charter boats depressing the prices.

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Originally Posted by jbinbi View Post
I have a Beneteau now, and am fairly pleased with the quality, so I would expect the Lagoon to be the same, since same parent company. I do not intend ocean crossings in either, but costal cruising, sailing in bahama, carrib, etc. I sailed on a 380 at last year multi hull day, liked the layout on the boat. No wind in the morn when I was on that, so can't really tell how it sails. Sailed on Leapord 40 in afternoon, liked they way it sailed, not so much on how it was laid out, but OK.

I do think that over the next few years the USD will bounce back, life is a like a circle, sometimes you are on top, other times on the bottom, half the time in the middle. I think the next prez will pull back some of the war effort, that alone I think should reduce debt a bit, maybe that's a catalyst to usd recovery.

I am not keen on getting a boat older than 5 years old, and not one from charter. I want to spend my time sailing, not fixing. At 7-10 yrs, it becomes one thing, then the next, etc.

Any idea on how the leapord and manta sail vs. the 2 i asked about?
Scott
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Old 18-04-2008, 15:10   #12
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No contest - but I have just taken delivery of my new Mahe so slightly biased in my opinion, you get a lot of boat for your money.

Kev & Jo
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Old 18-04-2008, 16:31   #13
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I would suggest that you speak to the people at Multihull Dynamics. Multihull Dynamics, Inc. - Home

They have an extensive database of published data for alot of cats. Spend a few bucks on getting a comparison of these boats, also compared to others you think are interesting.

Look at the numbers, and get an understanding of what they mean. The numbers aren't necessarily absolutely correct but will give you a good idea of things like performance and stability.

I wouldn't buy a new boat in this segment at this time, for the reasons mentioned above.

I saw a 1997 Athena for sale for 140 k$. For 60 grand you could redo her totally, replace everything and still have a cheap boat.

My personal preference would be a used FP, they also look much nicer than the Lagoons in my opinion.

After all the evaluating, follow your heart.

Regards

Alan
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Old 19-04-2008, 07:59   #14
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Quote:
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I would suggest that you speak to the people at Multihull Dynamics. Multihull Dynamics, Inc. - Home

They have an extensive database of published data for alot of cats. Spend a few bucks on getting a comparison of these boats, also compared to others you think are interesting.

Look at the numbers, and get an understanding of what they mean. The numbers aren't necessarily absolutely correct but will give you a good idea of things like performance and stability.

I wouldn't buy a new boat in this segment at this time, for the reasons mentioned above.

I saw a 1997 Athena for sale for 140 k$. For 60 grand you could redo her totally, replace everything and still have a cheap boat.

My personal preference would be a used FP, they also look much nicer than the Lagoons in my opinion.

After all the evaluating, follow your heart.

Regards

Alan

I'll second that. As an owner of a 95 Athena the price I paid and the money spent to bring her up to my standards was a much better investment than a new base Mahe or Lagoon that I have sailed. No offense but new boat buyers are the best thing that can happen for a used boat buyer.
If you think buying a new boat means taking delivery and sailing off with no additional expense and lots of time with tools in hand, I got this bridge for sale you should take a look at.
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Old 19-04-2008, 17:22   #15
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I was at the miami boat show and you can get it at 280 decked out 320. There was alot of differance between the two that makes the price different. lagoon is new at 335 loaded at 404.
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