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Old 20-03-2008, 14:18   #1
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Question Fidji, Antigua or Athena ?

Hi

Have the above mentioned boats in my sights (and price range) so any information or experience with these boats would be useful.

The Story;
Same as 1,000,000 other people I guess looking to get away for a few years before we are too old to enjoy the cruising life and growing plus becoming vegetables becomes our only alternative.

Route;
Atlantic Crossing then the Caribbean, US East Coast for a few years then who knows maybe the Panama Canal will beckon.

Reasoning;
After years of dreaming/saving the cheque book is hot to trot and I figure these boats are the smallest we would consider for long term liveaboard with ocean crossings a possibility. Plus the vintage I'm looking at they are affordable.

Any help would be welcome including other cats to consider.

Thanks in advance of your help.

Richard & Gill
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Old 20-03-2008, 14:35   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fluffflinger View Post
Hi

Have the above mentioned boats in my sights (and price range) so any information or experience with these boats would be useful.

The Story;
Same as 1,000,000 other people I guess looking to get away for a few years before we are too old to enjoy the cruising life and growing plus becoming vegetables becomes our only alternative.

Route;
Atlantic Crossing then the Caribbean, US East Coast for a few years then who knows maybe the Panama Canal will beckon.

Reasoning;
After years of dreaming/saving the cheque book is hot to trot and I figure these boats are the smallest we would consider for long term liveaboard with ocean crossings a possibility. Plus the vintage I'm looking at they are affordable.

Any help would be welcome including other cats to consider.

Thanks in advance of your help.

Richard & Gill
I've sailed both the Fidji and the Athena ONCE. I'm guessing you are from the UK, if so, I chartered both from Portsmouth while I was graduating from being a mono sailor to sailing proper boats.

Both boats are perhaps a little lighter build than is ideal but they will probably get you where you want to go. Personally, if I was on a tight budget, I'd sacrifice some space and go for a similar vintage Prout. It'll last for ever and will get you there albeit at a slightly slower pace and with a little less space.

Just my humble opinion.
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Old 20-03-2008, 17:27   #3
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Of those 3, i would opt for the markll Athena ( it has a higher mast and more sail area) It has a more modern interior design and layout, and acess to servicing most things is slightly better than on the Fidjis. But all 3 would do the job for you, just make sure the rigging is in good order.

You could also look at the Privileges, and some of the other 1990's vintage cats out there. Check out some of the French websites, as they offer a wider choice than the UK or US sites.

Regards

Alan
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Old 20-03-2008, 18:58   #4
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Richard & Gill,
I own an Athena and I think this boat makes a great cruising cat and it is very easy to sail. It's well constructed, high bridge deck, built strong and well laid out and very sea worthy. I would suggest you have a good look at them all, check for saloon head room, bed length etc and all the things you cant change and find out which one suits you best. You can always add things like a bigger head latter. I personally like the galley up configuration. We can chat offline if you have any further Athena questions. Check out this link for a FP circumnavigation Ladybug Adventures
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Old 21-03-2008, 04:02   #5
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Useful stuff, more please!

Guys

Thanks for the little nuggets.

Jeannius, you are correct we are in the UK. I have sailed on a couple of Prouts and althought they are remarkably tough and have held their value better than almost anything on the market they all suffer with poor bridgedeck clearence don't you think? Not that we tend to spend five years going to windward but sometimes it can't be avoided!

Nordic Cat, MarkII Athena would be what vintage? I am not that familiar with any French Sites other than xboat.fr, any specific sites you know of? A Privilege 39 would suit, guess I am only looking at whatI could buy today and didn't want to start a thread called "find me a well found cheap cruising cat for under ????" as then I would have ended up with a million suggestions and the above mentioned yachts are available today.

Crak I have previously looked at the Ladybug site and yes an offline chat would be great, sure you should be able to email of PM me with some contact details.

Thanks from us both and keep it coming!

Regards

Richard and Gill
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Old 21-03-2008, 04:26   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fluffflinger View Post
Guys

Thanks for the little nuggets.

Nordic Cat, MarkII Athena would be what vintage? I am not that familiar with any French Sites other than xboat.fr, any specific sites you know of? A Privilege 39 would suit, guess I am only looking at whatI could buy today and didn't want to start a thread called "find me a well found cheap cruising cat for under ????" as then I would have ended up with a million suggestions and the above mentioned yachts are available today.
Regards
Richard and Gill

Try googling "Multicoque a vendre" remember that boats in France often sell at 10-20% lower than asking price.
The cheapest at the moment are the USD based boats, if you are not going to be keeping the boat in the EU, this might be cheaper solution.

I don't remember at what build number they changed the rig on the Athena, ask the local FP rep, or the factory directly. They never made a big issue of it, in fact there was practically no marketing buzz, just a sentence on the website, as far as I remember. Probably late 90'S.

There is a german website: Mehrrumpfboote - Katamaran - Trimaran - Proa - Multihulls that has lots of links to boats for sale in northern europe.

regards

Alan
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Old 21-03-2008, 04:30   #7
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Alan

Thanks, that should keep us amused for bit!

Kind regards

Richard and Gill
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Old 21-03-2008, 05:46   #8
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Alan

German website Mehrrumpfboote - Katamaran - Trimaran - Proa - Multihulls has a couple of boats that are worth a look. However my German is non existant so I am probably missing something (thank heaven for Google Translate) as I can't find any contact details for any of the boats advertised, if you are familiar with this site maybe you can help?

Thanks

Richard
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Old 21-03-2008, 06:32   #9
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Originally Posted by Fluffflinger View Post
Alan

German website Mehrrumpfboote - Katamaran - Trimaran - Proa - Multihulls has a couple of boats that are worth a look. However my German is non existant so I am probably missing something (thank heaven for Google Translate) as I can't find any contact details for any of the boats advertised, if you are familiar with this site maybe you can help?

Thanks

Richard

Go to the bottom left text "Aktueller Bootsmarkt" (Boat market)
17 Kats bis 10m (17 cats for sale up to 10 m)
22 Kats ab 10m (22 cats over 10m)

Follow the links on each advertisement. Otherwise let me know and I will translate them. (Or use Alta Vista or Google translation)


For searching other german sites google "Katamaran verkaufen"


Hope this helps

Regards

Alan
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Old 21-03-2008, 09:17   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fluffflinger View Post
Guys

Thanks for the little nuggets.

Jeannius, you are correct we are in the UK. I have sailed on a couple of Prouts and althought they are remarkably tough and have held their value better than almost anything on the market they all suffer with poor bridgedeck clearence don't you think? Not that we tend to spend five years going to windward but sometimes it can't be avoided!

Nordic Cat, MarkII Athena would be what vintage? I am not that familiar with any French Sites other than xboat.fr, any specific sites you know of? A Privilege 39 would suit, guess I am only looking at whatI could buy today and didn't want to start a thread called "find me a well found cheap cruising cat for under ????" as then I would have ended up with a million suggestions and the above mentioned yachts are available today.

Crak I have previously looked at the Ladybug site and yes an offline chat would be great, sure you should be able to email of PM me with some contact details.

Thanks from us both and keep it coming!

Regards

Richard and Gill
Richard

If your budget will run to a Privilege then that is the way to go ( I would say that wouldn't I?) There's a nice Priv 37 been on the market in Ireland for a little while. Talk to Bill Bullimore - UK Privilege agent - at info@multihulls.co.uk Catamarans for Sale. Trimarans for Sale. Multihulls For Sale. Used Catamarans. Multihull Brokerage. New Catamarans: Privilege, Gemini and Telstar. From PBM Ltd.
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Old 21-03-2008, 09:29   #11
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Mike

Ys the Privilege is still there around 80k I think. I know Bill quite well as I was very interested in buying the Ocean Cheetah he has, unfortunately that foundered on some problems with the construction that are a bit too scary for me to deal with.

I guess in life you always will find the perfect boat the day after you bought something else, it is just a question of looking at what is available when you have the cash to spend and not looking after you've bought it!

With cats of this age money is always needed to refit and replace. From all the boats I've looked over it would seem that I would end up spending nearly the same amount on all of them to make ready for our trip, regardless of their advertised condition. Therefore the better price in the first place the more money stays in the cruising kitty!

Thanks

Richard
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Old 21-03-2008, 11:02   #12
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I would go with the Ocean Cheetah if you have the time, unless the construction is critically defect. I heard that it is a bit heavier than John S. specified, but speak to him, not only is he a great designer, he is very approachable.
Get a couple of engines installed, and sail it to Poland, where the rest of the fitout can be done at maybe 10-15/hr. For about 100-120 k you will have a much better boat. (maybe less if you don't go too fancy on internal finish)
I see that they have now dropped the price to 50k from 70. Offer them 60 k with 2 18 hp Volvos with saildrives and steering installed. Its costing them 3-4 k/year in interest, and has been for sale for more than 3 years.

Otherwise, I heard that the Ocean Cheetah moulds are now in South Africa. (Ask John S.) I can reccomend a yard down there, and you could get one built from scratch, and customised to your requirements.

Get in touch if I can be of assistance.

Regards

Alan
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Old 21-03-2008, 12:12   #13
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Interesting to hear the comments on the Ocean Cheetah, anybody sailed one, or know anybody who owns one, it would be interesting to know what the performance is like.
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Old 21-03-2008, 13:06   #14
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Interesting to hear the comments on the Ocean Cheetah, anybody sailed one, or know anybody who owns one, it would be interesting to know what the performance is like.

I'm sure John Shuttleworth has a very good idea of what performance to expect if built to his specs. My guess, based on a sail on one of his 47 footers (that was overloaded), would be about 50% faster than the other cats mentioned. i.e. around 75% of windspeed on a reach compared to around 50% for the other boats.

If one compares it using "performance index"

Definition: "Performance Index (0.5*(Lwl*SA/D)1/2) – This index gives an estimate of the relative boat speed to wind speed on a reach, i.e., a figure of .8 says a boat will do 8 knots in a 10 knot wind."



At 3.5 tons displacement the PI for the Ocean Cheetah is around 0.95. In reality it will probably be a bit lower, as 3,5 tons sounds like lightship. So my estimate should be about right. The comparable figure for an Atlatic 42 weighing 7 tons is around 0.8.

N.B. The formula above is not based on SI units but US units.
Hope this helps

Regards

Alan

P.S. Mutihull Dynamics can help with these figures for the other boats mentioned, or else one can do the calculations. Just remember to add the uncertainty of the "marketing weights" instead of true cruising weights.
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Old 21-03-2008, 13:27   #15
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"Performance Index (0.5*(Lwl*SA/D)1/2)
Alan - in the formula, what function is performed by the 1/2 on (Lwl*SA/D)?

Is D in pounds or tons?

Thanks,
Dave
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