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Old 20-09-2018, 02:08   #46
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Re: Escape Hatch Failure

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Originally Posted by Buzzman View Post
Ah, OK, was not aware they were required to be openable from outside. Seems counter-intuitive unless lockable, and then you need to be sure to 'unlock' or 'unlatch' as part of unmooring regime.
A common method is a crossbar between the latches on the inside. You can't open the hatch with the crossbar in place. It is a loose fit and will fall out if the boat is inverted, allowing you to open from either side.


As illustrated earlier:


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Old 20-09-2018, 02:16   #47
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Re: Escape Hatch Failure

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Originally Posted by Bean Counter View Post
Some posters on this thread see the elimination of safety hatches as a good thing. All fine in theory. In the real world, if you look at the skippers account of their capsize they used the safety hatches to extract immersion suits, ditch bag etc. It would seem from previous posts that Roberston and Cain have convinced the standard setters that because inversion likelihood is low then there is no need for them. It is not until one does invert and the crew is trapped inside and drowns/suffocates that the thinking will get reversed....
.
What if people lose their lives because their boat sank or flooded due to failure of these "safety " hatches?
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Old 20-09-2018, 20:37   #48
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Re: Escape Hatch Failure

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Originally Posted by StuM View Post
A common method is a crossbar between the latches on the inside. You can't open the hatch with the crossbar in place. It is a loose fit and will fall out if the boat is inverted, allowing you to open from either side.


As illustrated earlier:



Aha! Now I'm impressed. A loose fit that falls out when inverted.

That is clever engineering. KISS principle. Pay that one.
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Old 20-11-2018, 05:51   #49
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Re: Escape Hatch Failure

Here is a pic of the reinforcement that FP just sent me unsolicited.
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Old 20-11-2018, 14:27   #50
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Re: Escape Hatch Failure

I was sailing on a monohull during a Carib 1500 a few years ago and heard a catamaran reporting a failed emergency hatch and working to repair. Four years ago we purchased a Belize model, and I remembered hearing that dramatic problem. I suggest considering an emergency kit:

Before we did any long distance sailing, I prepared some flooding response packages: emergency hatch, hull breach, side portals, and deck hatches. For the each of the emergency hatches, I cut a piece of 3/4" plywood to fit over the inside of the hatch with additional 2" overlap. I drilled 3/4" holes around the outside edge that match the inside bolt pattern on the bulkhead for the hatch - this provides some control of lateral movement. I affixed 6"x6" U-shaped frame in center of the inside face of the board with 1x1 wood pieces. On the outward facing side of the plywood I epoxied 2" foam strip to seal around the outside dimensions of the hatch to provide a water seal. To keep this in place, I have a 2"x4" cut to fit into the U-shaped center frame, and will jam perpendicularly against the corner where the ceiling-bulkhead meet. Adding to this, I also have several 2" SS screws taped to the inside of the patch that can be used to screw then plywood seal in place. There is a set for each hull that is stored in the forward storage compartments.

The design concept follows the concept that is used on many commercial and military ships. I haven't had to use it, but would rather have it than not.
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Old 20-11-2018, 17:25   #51
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Re: Escape Hatch Failure

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Originally Posted by peteatbeach View Post
I was sailing on a monohull during a Carib 1500 a few years ago and heard a catamaran reporting a failed emergency hatch and working to repair. Four years ago we purchased a Belize model, and I remembered hearing that dramatic problem. I suggest considering an emergency kit:

Before we did any long distance sailing, I prepared some flooding response packages: emergency hatch, hull breach, side portals, and deck hatches. For the each of the emergency hatches, I cut a piece of 3/4" plywood to fit over the inside of the hatch with additional 2" overlap. I drilled 3/4" holes around the outside edge that match the inside bolt pattern on the bulkhead for the hatch - this provides some control of lateral movement. I affixed 6"x6" U-shaped frame in center of the inside face of the board with 1x1 wood pieces. On the outward facing side of the plywood I epoxied 2" foam strip to seal around the outside dimensions of the hatch to provide a water seal. To keep this in place, I have a 2"x4" cut to fit into the U-shaped center frame, and will jam perpendicularly against the corner where the ceiling-bulkhead meet. Adding to this, I also have several 2" SS screws taped to the inside of the patch that can be used to screw then plywood seal in place. There is a set for each hull that is stored in the forward storage compartments.

The design concept follows the concept that is used on many commercial and military ships. I haven't had to use it, but would rather have it than not.
Any pics that you can share?
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Old 21-11-2018, 14:39   #52
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Re: Escape Hatch Failure

See attached photos of hatch (boat on the hard for winter), with the emergency patch positioned in place, and use of 2x4 brace to keep in place unless/until screws are needed. Opposite side shows 1/2" rubber to help seal the patch. This compartment is the stbd head, so the surfaces are smooth gelcoat - easy to seal.

Installing it at sea will be difficult for one person, but very easy for two motivated people in an emergency.

We have a similar set for the other hull, but the 2x4 brace is longer. Both have polyurethane coating to ensure no degradation of wood.
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Old 21-11-2018, 14:58   #53
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Re: Escape Hatch Failure

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Originally Posted by peteatbeach View Post
See attached photos of hatch (boat on the hard for winter), with the emergency patch positioned in place, and use of 2x4 brace to keep in place unless/until screws are needed. Opposite side shows 1/2" rubber to help seal the patch. This compartment is the stbd head, so the surfaces are smooth gelcoat - easy to seal.

Installing it at sea will be difficult for one person, but very easy for two motivated people in an emergency.

We have a similar set for the other hull, but the 2x4 brace is longer. Both have polyurethane coating to ensure no degradation of wood.
Thanks peteatbeach!!
I hadn't considered an interior solution, but this looks easier to deploy than an exterior cover.
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Old 21-11-2018, 15:02   #54
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Re: Escape Hatch Failure

Oh, and I like the fool-proof directions, "FACE TO SEA".
Reminded me of another important sign.
The direction can be important...
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Old 26-11-2018, 08:06   #55
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Re: Escape Hatch Failure

BTW, there is a another use of the escape hatches that I didn't see being discussed. When we were at anchor, moored, or were hauled out we commonly opened the escape hatches to aide air flow in the hulls. This airflow made a significant improvement in air temps on warm/hot days and evenings, and especially on rainy days when you can't open topside hatches. We have mosquito netting that also fits over the the escape but never had to use it.

We generally secured them at night or when leaving the boat if we felt the necessity for security reasons. The hatches were always secured before moving the boat - the CAPT (me) was responsible for checking.
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Old 26-11-2018, 09:40   #56
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Re: Escape Hatch Failure

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Originally Posted by peteatbeach View Post
BTW, there is a another use of the escape hatches that I didn't see being discussed. When we were at anchor, moored, or were hauled out we commonly opened the escape hatches to aide air flow in the hulls.
Now that I understand how the Goiot hatches are built, I would be very cautious how you open the hatch. I would never push on the latches when opening, you will be stressing the silicone holding the lens in the frame. Instead only push on the aluminum frame holding the lens.
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Old 02-02-2019, 13:47   #57
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Re: Escape Hatch Failure

Quote:
Originally Posted by peteatbeach View Post
BTW, there is a another use of the escape hatches that I didn't see being discussed. When we were at anchor, moored, or were hauled out we commonly opened the escape hatches to aide air flow in the hulls. This airflow made a significant improvement in air temps on warm/hot days and evenings, and especially on rainy days when you can't open topside hatches. We have mosquito netting that also fits over the the escape but never had to use it.

We generally secured them at night or when leaving the boat if we felt the necessity for security reasons. The hatches were always secured before moving the boat - the CAPT (me) was responsible for checking.
Here is photo of a cat that opened their escape hatch for ventilation and forgot to close it the next day. They ran the boat aground to save it. Flooded one hull to the ceiling and the salon. Suggest you be very careful.
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Old 02-02-2019, 16:09   #58
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Re: Escape Hatch Failure

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Originally Posted by AllenRbrts View Post
Here is photo of a cat that opened their escape hatch for ventilation and forgot to close it the next day. They ran the boat aground to save it. Flooded one hull to the ceiling and the salon. Suggest you be very careful.
Attachment 185009
Have seen that issue several times in Belize. Not a fan of "escape" hatches.
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Old 06-02-2019, 17:21   #59
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Re: Escape Hatch Failure

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Originally Posted by AllenRbrts View Post
Here is photo of a cat that opened their escape hatch for ventilation and forgot to close it the next day. They ran the boat aground to save it. Flooded one hull to the ceiling and the salon. Suggest you be very careful.
Attachment 185009

How is it possible to not notice that the hatch has been left open when under way? From my own experience of having done this (left a hatch open for ventilation and forgot to close before getting under way) there is plenty of splashing noise coming from the hatch, very distinct from the usual sounds of being under way. In our case that was enough to go below and close it before more than just the toilet paper roll got wet. And we quickly added it to our getting under way checklist.

In the case of accidentally leaving a hatch open, once enough water comes into the boat I assume the bilge pump(s) come on. Is it only on our boat that our electric bilge pumps sound an alarm when they are operating? How could you possibly not notice how much water is coming in before the hull sinks enough to submerge the lower edge of the escape hatch and the splashing turns into a flood?
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Old 06-02-2019, 17:37   #60
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Escape Hatch Failure

The checklist was invented after a couple of test pilots took off in the Boeing B-17 prototype with the controls locked. We almost lost the B-17 for the war, Boeing lost the contract. Douglas won, the Air Corp pretty much illegally ordered more B-17ís for testing.
This video is of a Caribou turbine conversion test flight, the elevator control was locked.
https://youtu.be/YydkHy2P0dU
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