Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 07-01-2013, 14:55   #1
Registered User

Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 242
Portable execution - please unbundle the install

It's great news that OpenCPN will now have a portable execution option. In the free world, programs are not "lashed" to their OS, but I won't digress...

Can OpenCPN be delivered to us in a .zip file, instead of the "bundled" .exe file which enforces the Microsoft application installation limitations upon us?

Great open source programs that include MS Windows platforms, such as Gimp, allow users just this sort of freedom and flexibility.
__________________

__________________
dave777 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-01-2013, 15:00   #2
Registered User
 
Target9000's Avatar

Join Date: May 2009
Location: New Orleans LA
Boat: 74 Westsail 32
Posts: 1,379
Re: Portable execution - please unbundle the install

I'm pretty sure you can just download the source code and do whatever you want with it from there.
__________________

__________________
Let your heart tell you where to go, but let your brain tell you how to get there.

Sundowner Sails Again
Target9000 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-01-2013, 17:08   #3
Registered User

Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 242
Re: Portable execution - please unbundle the install

Quote:
Originally Posted by Target9000 View Post
I'm pretty sure you can just download the source code and do whatever you want with it from there.
Well, it's good that OpenCPN is open source, and to be reminded of that. But my understanding is that you'd have to have a PC configured with lots of other software in order to build your own version of OpenCPN on Windows, in there is a lot of time, money, and expertise to set up a PC just for that. (Linux is a different story.)

My point is, if portable execution is an option. Shouldn't we be able to download a portable .exe file?
__________________
dave777 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-01-2013, 17:20   #4
Marine Service Provider
 
bdbcat's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 4,884
Re: Portable execution - please unbundle the install

dave777...

Simple solution:
Install the windows setup as normal, find and save safely the files you want (e.g. opencpn.exe, data directories, etc, etc), and then un-install opencpn..

Just curious...
What is it about a standard Windows install that you don't like?

Dave
__________________
bdbcat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-01-2013, 21:19   #5
Registered User

Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: St. Petersburg, Florida
Boat: Gemini 3200
Posts: 702
Re: Portable execution - please unbundle the install

Quote:
Originally Posted by bdbcat View Post
Just curious...
What is it about a standard Windows install that you don't like?

Dave
I can't speak for dave777. Here's why I don't like the Windows install program.

It makes entries in the Registry. You never know what it's going to do. Lots of times uninstalling fails to remove everything that was installed. Why do we have an install program at all? Why not just drop the executable where you want it and run it?

Some applications require a complicated installation procedure because of they way they interact with other resources in the system, but OpenCPN doesn't seem to require it.

Fabbian
__________________
fgd3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-01-2013, 21:35   #6
Registered User

Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,062
Re: Portable execution - please unbundle the install

The reason for an operating system is to provide foundation services that application programs can use. The applications need resources, and they need a "traffic cop" to allocate/release and share resources if they're going to run on the same machine with other functions/applications running.

Applications can be run in a sandbox but if they need to share information and resources and access to comm ports etc. then it gets a little more complicated. If they need to share UI and other components supplied by the OS then they need to know how to get along with it.
__________________
SailFastTri is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-01-2013, 04:28   #7
Registered User

Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Rome
Posts: 320
Re: Portable execution - please unbundle the install

Hello,

I do like this:

download OpenCPN installer and open it in 7-zip (open archive). 7-zip can be installed or can be portable...

In 7-zip open $_OUTDIR\ and drag and drop the content (the whole directory structure) in the destination folder of the portable installation.

In 7-zip open $COMMONFILES\$[45]\NS_LANG_CODE\ and drag and drop the content (all the files) in the destination folder of the portable installation.

Now create a windows link to the file "opencpn.exe" adding -p after the name.

Double click the link and enjoy OpenCPN portable.

Ciao, Marco.
__________________
GPS-Marco is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-01-2013, 08:31   #8
Registered User
 
HappySeagull's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: B.C.,Canada
Boat: 29'
Posts: 2,395
Re: Portable execution - please unbundle the install

I use 7-zip as above, and drop a new beta "exe" into my existing opencpn Portable folder. ... but I still need be careful that I have checked for updated dependencies as well.
Also, the portable requires msvcp100.dll and msvcr100.dll...which O supplies as "vcredist_x86.exe" in the VC10 folder, in the install package. ...This also may be updated from time to time. It is not plain to me if Opencpn is allowed to supply these simply as plain files....or if they need to be "registered" in the OS to function. (IE: a test I mean to do is to go back to XP_SP1 and see if the portable goes! as it is , Port-O functions fine on SP2 for me...)

So, there are good reasons for "install" as SailFastTri has said but additionally, recall that the Full Install keeps your personal settings while updating itself and adding new components from outside sources. This is easy for a new user.
__________________
HappySeagull is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-01-2013, 13:47   #9
Registered User

Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 242
Re: Portable execution - please unbundle the install

Quote:
Originally Posted by bdbcat View Post

Just curious...
What is it about a standard Windows install that you don't like?

Dave
Hi Dave,

There are a couple of negatives with the latter versions of Microsoft's app installation management tools. From Microsoft's perspective, I'm sure all of the "features" have a purpose. From the user's perspective, it seems that the decline of stability and performance (and perhaps security) is quickened with each new app install under these newer tools.

By avoiding MS apps (due to high life cycle costs), and other applications employing SP3 type registry methods, I've found it easier to maintain greater longevity for PC, and practically eliminate Windows reinstallation issues.

In the "old days", executable images were placed in their own directories and run from there. Since OpenCPN does not have the copy protection/enforcement features of the OS as an issue, avoiding the package deal of MS installation features seems to me like the easiest, lowest risk alternative. (And I'm focusing hard to stay on topic)

Another example would be the ability to install/test the current O version on XP SP2. My experience with SP3 is that it is only required by certain applications for the "installation" feature expected by the setup.exe installer. And who can blame MS for releasing installation tools which futher their business model.

It's been my experience that portable installations work better than "embedded installations" in general, including on SP2. (plus any security updates as wanted). This has been my experience with open programs like Gimp.

I've had good success with Linux version of O under Ubuntu, which is what I use on the boat in order to maximize reliability, and greatly reduce boot time. But I'd still like to run the windows version for access to the additional tools at home.

Hope that helps.
__________________
dave777 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-01-2013, 13:53   #10
Registered User

Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 242
Re: Portable execution - please unbundle the install

Quote:
Originally Posted by GPS-Marco View Post
Hello,

I do like this:

download OpenCPN installer and open it in 7-zip (open archive). 7-zip can be installed or can be portable...

In 7-zip open $_OUTDIR\ and drag and drop the content (the whole directory structure) in the destination folder of the portable installation.

In 7-zip open $COMMONFILES\$[45]\NS_LANG_CODE\ and drag and drop the content (all the files) in the destination folder of the portable installation.

Now create a windows link to the file "opencpn.exe" adding -p after the name.

Double click the link and enjoy OpenCPN portable.

Ciao, Marco.
Didn't know of an app that could open an install .exe as if it was a .zip file. Cool!

thanks for sharing
__________________
dave777 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2013, 17:58   #11
Registered User

Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: On the go. Not in Prague.
Posts: 4,020
Re: Portable execution - please unbundle the install

Guys...
we build with VC++ 2010, and as such we have to bundle the corresponding version of vcredist_x86.exe with OpenCPN. The reason for using the 2010 toolchain is (amongst others) that the older version of the MSVC redistributable failed for a lot of people without any chance for us to fix it and follow the MS licensing policy, which explicitly forbids to distribute the runtime libraries in any other form than vcredist_x86.exe, at the same time.
The same reason prevents us from distributing a .zip with the portable version that "just runs" for everybody - we can't bundle the MS DLLs with it and as such it would not run for people without the redistributable installed previously.
I know this sucks, but I was not there when they wrote that license in Redmond...
OpenCPN can still be built with the older MS toolchain and run on pre-XPSP3 machines, but the demand is simply too low to invest the time to do it. If there's someone who wishes to do the builds for the legacy platforms, I will gladly assist in setting the environment up and prepare the patches needed for the installer creation process, but I don't have time and energy to do the builds myself. BTW, we use NSIS, not the MS tools to create the installer and it's not as evil to your registry as some other software...

Pavel
__________________
nohal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2013, 18:04   #12
Registered User

Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: St. Petersburg, Florida
Boat: Gemini 3200
Posts: 702
Re: Portable execution - please unbundle the install

Pavel,

Thanks for the explanation. It makes sense.

Fabbian
__________________
fgd3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2013, 20:06   #13
Registered User

Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 242
Re: Portable execution - please unbundle the install

Quote:
Originally Posted by nohal View Post
I know this sucks, but I was not there when they wrote that license in Redmond...


Quote:
Originally Posted by nohal View Post
OpenCPN can still be built with the older MS toolchain and run on pre-XPSP3 machines
Wouldn't a portable update .zip file be useful for all Windows platforms, not just XP?

Sure, the .dll files would be missing, but I must have done over half a dozen updates - but only one first time installation.

I commend you for implementing a portable version. Like when the boat PC is down, or you are on another's boat. Being able to stick in a USB drive and run is superb - perhaps with a USB gps.

It took me a while to use the 7zip program to find what I needed, copy and paste, tweak, lather rinse repeat. It would be nice to have a separate easier download just for updating. It gives a clear error message as to which .dll is missing so at least that is a plus.

Anyway, 3.x so far is looking pretty cool.
__________________
dave777 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-01-2013, 06:19   #14
Registered User

Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: On the go. Not in Prague.
Posts: 4,020
Re: Portable execution - please unbundle the install

dave...
this is a community project, anybody is welcome to package the zip from his install and make it available. Anybody is also welcome to write a batch file to run it in portable mode, create the documentation and support it. And all of it for all the versions to come Same as with the legacy build - we are not superhumans with 25 hour days...

Pavel
__________________
nohal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14-01-2013, 20:48   #15
Registered User

Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 242
Re: Portable execution - please unbundle the install

Quote:
Originally Posted by nohal View Post
dave...
this is a community project, anybody is welcome to package the zip from his install and make it available. Anybody is also welcome to write a batch file to run it in portable mode, create the documentation and support it. And all of it for all the versions to come Same as with the legacy build - we are not superhumans with 25 hour days...

Pavel
I understand with open source that we can suggest, but should not expect any given request is implemented. Sorry if my request seems too much work or pesky.

I've gotten the new version to boot but have had some issues. I tried following the instructions by GPS-Marco but things weren't running smoothly. I'm not sure what other directories' contents need to be put where. Also, not sure if the map position errors have to do with my map downloads because I had the same problem with an earlier version. When scrolling the map causes the boat location as well as waypoints to move relative to the map.

Hopefully someone with sufficient Windows knowledge does repackage it. My Linux PC runs O without a problem.
__________________

__________________
dave777 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off




Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 00:58.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.