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Old 23-02-2016, 09:58   #1321
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Re: Ocpn-Draw and Boundary

Hello JonGough,

Looking more closely, it is always the WD language file that replaces OD items. So it seems to me that your change has not solved the problem

Gilletarom.
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Old 23-02-2016, 10:58   #1322
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Re: Ocpn-Draw and Boundary

Jon,

I'm presently carrying out simple testing of the Anchor Watch Alarm. Is the following correct:
1. When a New Anchor Watch Alarm is set, the alarm indicates the distance from vessel to the set reference position (e.g. the anchor position).
2. When a New Boundary Alarm is set, indicating 'Anchor' in the configuration window and also the GUID of a straight lined area, the alarm indicates whether you are inside or outside this area. The display window for the alarm shows the following text: "Anchor Inside [or Outside] boundary [GUID].

For the second point above I don't see why it is called "Anchor ..." when the only indication is that you are inside or outside an area.

Am I missing something?
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Old 23-02-2016, 11:28   #1323
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Re: Ocpn-Draw and Boundary

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gilletarom View Post
Hello JonGough,

Looking more closely, it is always the WD language file that replaces OD items. So it seems to me that your change has not solved the problem

Gilletarom.
It cannot work the way Jon thinks. The only way is to avoid double english strings in the source code. Some days ago one of the Netherland users has published a spread sheet here with all the strings used in main opencpn code and some plugins. If there will be once a spread sheet with all used strings in all plugins and also the generic wxWidgets language file wxstd.po/mo then the developers are able to avoid double strings.

Gerhard
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Old 23-02-2016, 14:48   #1324
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Re: Ocpn-Draw and Boundary

Gilletarom,
I had not converted the forms to use the new definition, so they would have been using the old method. I have now changed the generation process and all the forms to use the new macro definition for translation. I have also created a French po file with your translations in it, then created an install package and installed it. When I run it the forms now appear correct. Please note, I have not change WD yet. You will notice in the screen shot that OD is showing your translation and WD is showing my 'test' translation.

This change is in patch 667.

Jon

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Originally Posted by Gilletarom View Post
Hello JonGough,

Looking more closely, it is always the WD language file that replaces OD items. So it seems to me that your change has not solved the problem

Gilletarom.
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Old 23-02-2016, 15:33   #1325
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Re: Ocpn-Draw and Boundary

Gilletarom,
I have now changed WD, 1.9.35, to use the same method as OD. You should now find that the forms for WD and OD use different translation catalogs. The previous version only did not do translations for forms generated in wxFormBuilder, now it does.

Jon
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Old 23-02-2016, 15:45   #1326
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Re: Ocpn-Draw and Boundary

NAV,
In WD there are two ways to set an Anchor Alarm. The original method which used a lat/lon and measured your distance away from that. I have not touched this original method. The second way is to use a boundary alarm. In there you will find an Anchor alarm which uses the GUID of a boundary to identify the safe area. In a boundary anchor alarm the alarm will sound if you move outside the boundary. This should enable you to set an irregular shaped area that you want to stay inside and be warned if you go outside the area.

I put his alarm type in as a 'proof of concept' to show that a boundary could be used from another plugin. It was the first time I modified another plugin to use OD and it was the easiest test to do. Since then the I have updated the WD plugin to include other types of boundary alarm including guard zones. I am not saying that the alarms are correct, the names are correct or even that they are useful, I was just trying to demonstrate capability.

When I anchor I normally have more room on one side than the other (prevailing winds, currents, etc.) so the standard anchor alarm was no use to me. The boundary anchor alarm lets me set a longer distance front and back (tidal flow) and a lesser distance side to side (wind effect), which I find better, not perfect, but better.

It would be possible to rename this alarm and make it an "Inclusion" alarm, but would that make it any more clear? Gilletarom wants an alarm when going around islands and shoals and this alarm would do that. It may be that the language (words) used to describe the alarm is more of an issue than the alarm itself. I just need users to suggest other wording, and if possible, wording that will work in other languages.

Jon

Quote:
Originally Posted by NAV View Post
Jon,

I'm presently carrying out simple testing of the Anchor Watch Alarm. Is the following correct:
1. When a New Anchor Watch Alarm is set, the alarm indicates the distance from vessel to the set reference position (e.g. the anchor position).
2. When a New Boundary Alarm is set, indicating 'Anchor' in the configuration window and also the GUID of a straight lined area, the alarm indicates whether you are inside or outside this area. The display window for the alarm shows the following text: "Anchor Inside [or Outside] boundary [GUID].

For the second point above I don't see why it is called "Anchor ..." when the only indication is that you are inside or outside an area.

Am I missing something?
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Old 23-02-2016, 15:56   #1327
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Re: Ocpn-Draw and Boundary

Gerhard,
My original change was a test to see if I could use different catalogs (wxWidgets supports it) for different plugins. I only changed the user written code not the generated code that came out of wxFormBuilder. I have now generalised the change and put it into both OD and WD, so they should use their own language files for translations for both user written and generated code. I may have missed some files, but hopefully testing will find them.

The change is simple and redefines the standard '_()' macro to include the catalog to use. I just 'may' not have modified all files that need to use this. But it is still a 'proof of concept' and I cannot say it will always work, but I am hoping it will make life easier for all.

Jon

Quote:
Originally Posted by CarCode View Post
It cannot work the way Jon thinks. The only way is to avoid double english strings in the source code. Some days ago one of the Netherland users has published a spread sheet here with all the strings used in main opencpn code and some plugins. If there will be once a spread sheet with all used strings in all plugins and also the generic wxWidgets language file wxstd.po/mo then the developers are able to avoid double strings.

Gerhard
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Old 24-02-2016, 00:37   #1328
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Re: Ocpn-Draw and Boundary

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Originally Posted by CarCode View Post
Some days ago one of the Netherland users has published a spread sheet here with all the strings used in main opencpn code and some plugins. If there will be once a spread sheet with all used strings in all plugins and also the generic wxWidgets language file wxstd.po/mo then the developers are able to avoid double strings.
Attached is the last version (original English, Dutch and French only; opencpn and 9 plugins; in each column double values are indicated in red). Translators can extend this using the explanation on opencpn.org.
.
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Old 24-02-2016, 01:20   #1329
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Re: Ocpn-Draw and Boundary

Hello All,

I think we are making progress, though slowly, but surely.

In particular, the problem of translations.

There is another issue that we lack attention. The number of click that must be implemented to operate O and its plugins. Less must click generally better.

For example :
For a anchor alarm, what is important is his name, and to have fewer clicks to do to implement it. When I enter an anchorage area, after a day of rather rough sea, I must have less to think about. Everything to be easy to implement. So the less adjustment to do at that moment, the better.

Best regards. Gilletarom.
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Old 24-02-2016, 01:26   #1330
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Re: Ocpn-Draw and Boundary

Quote:
Originally Posted by NAV View Post
Attached is the last version (original English, Dutch and French only; opencpn and 9 plugins; in each column double values are indicated in red). Translators can extend this using the explanation on opencpn.org.
.
Thank you NAV.
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Old 24-02-2016, 03:25   #1331
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Re: Ocpn-Draw and Boundary

Bonjour, je travaille sur un tutoriel pour O-Draw
-----------------
inclusion/exclusion
-------------------
We're trying to qualify a name for an area, it may be a mistake. We have to qualify an action... more simpler, is less complicated

-
"no enter" area = ne pas entrer en zone
"no quit" area = ne pas quitter la zone
-
Michel
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Old 24-02-2016, 04:28   #1332
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Re: Ocpn-Draw and Boundary

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Originally Posted by jongough View Post
In WD there are two ways to set an Anchor Alarm. The original method which used a lat/lon and measured your distance away from that. I have not touched this original method.
I'm happy with this method. In Dutch I choose to translate the string "Anchor Alarm" as "Distance to reference position", to make it more general and to prevent confusion with the anchor functionality of OpenCPN core.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jongough View Post
The second way is to use a boundary alarm. In there you will find an Anchor alarm which uses the GUID of a boundary to identify the safe area. In a boundary anchor alarm the alarm will sound if you move outside the boundary. ..... It would be possible to rename this alarm and make it an "Inclusion" alarm, but would that make it any more clear?
This Boundary Anchor Alarm I renamed in Dutch to "Inside/Outside area" (more or less the same suggestion you mentioned, which, in my opinion makes things clearer). However, in the alarm window, it now indicates "Anchor Inside [or Outside] boundary [GUID]". So it seems to me that this alarm message uses a string from the standard Anchor Alarm.

I suggest not to use the part "Anchor" of the message string at all, or to use a different string.
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Old 24-02-2016, 06:56   #1333
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Re: Ocpn-Draw and Boundary

Hello Yoruk,
Quote:
Originally Posted by yoruk View Post
Bonjour, je travaille sur un tutoriel pour O-Draw
-----------------
inclusion/exclusion
-------------------
We're trying to qualify a name for an area, it may be a mistake. We have to qualify an action... more simpler, is less complicated
-
"no enter" area = ne pas entrer en zone
"no quit" area = ne pas quitter la zone
-
Michel
Sorry all, I know that Yoruk is French and that it do not speak very well English (like me). So, first I write in french and below I put an English version.

OD n'est pas le lieu ou on décide de l'effet de l'action qui devra être effectuer à l'aide de cette zone. OD est juste un outil où on créé des objets de nature d'ailleurs différentes les uns des autres.
Et en particulier où on peut créer ce que JouGough appelle des "Boundary". (Je laisse de côté les boundary constituées d'un segment de droite défini par deux points)

C'est un objet avec une limite, et deux zones. Chaque zone peut être dotée d'une propriété importante "Quadrillée", Non quadrillée" sachant que :
- soit une zone est quadrillée, mais l'autre n'y sera pas
- soit aucune des deux zones ne sera quadrillée.

La décision, concernant la façon dont on emploiera une zone sera prise dans les autres plugins qui utiliseront peut être, cette zone.

Dire, dés OD "On entre" ou "On n'entre pas" bloque toute liberté de d'imagination dans les autres plugins. Et qu'est ce qu'on fait des objets où aucune zone n'est quadrillée ?

C'est pourquoi j'aime bien "Intérieur quadrillé", "Extérieur quadrillé" et "Pas de quadrillage".

Et je milite pour que dés la version Anglaise, celle de Jongough, on abandonne "Exclusion" et "Inclusion" et qu'on y mette "Grid inside", "Grid outside" et "No grid".
---------
"OCPN Draw" is not the place where we decide the effect of the action to be performed with an object. OD is just a tool that we created objects, besides different kind each other.
Especially where one can create what JouGough called "Boundary". (I leave aside the boundary consisting of a line segment defined by two points)

It is an object with a boundary, and two zones. Each zone can be equipped with an important property "Grid squared" (Grid ON"), "Grid not squared" (Grid OFF) where:
- An area is checkered, but the other will not be there
- Or any of the two areas will not be squared.

The decision on how we will use an area will be taken in the other plugins that can be use this area.

Say, dice OD "is between" or "is not between" blocks any freedom of imagination in other plugins. And what do we do objects where no area is grid?

That's why I like "Grid Inside squared", "Grid outside squared" and "No grid". (or "Grid inside ON", "Grid outside ON" and "No grid"

I dice campaigning for the English version, that of Jongough, we abandon "exclusion" and "inclusion" and that he put "Grid inside", "Grid outside" and "No grid".
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Old 24-02-2016, 07:17   #1334
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Re: Ocpn-Draw and Boundary

Hello All,

For Yoruk :
Dans Weather Routing, l'essai actuel, des boundary, donne à la zone quadrillée, un rôle très précis, à savoir : "On n'entre pas". C'est parce que le développeur de WD a fait ce choix. Mais il aurait pu faire le choix inverse.

Dans WatchDog, les alarmes ne peuvent se déclencher que si on entre dans la zone intérieur d'une "Boundary", qu'elle soit quadrillée ou pas. En l'état actuel des choses, c'est un choix du développeur.

Ce qui montre bien qu'il ne faut pas utiliser d'item "à connotation figée" dans OCPN Draw.

----
Weather Routing in the current trial, boundary, gives the grid area, a very specific role, namely: "You can not come." This is because the WD developer made this choice. But he could have made the opposite choice.

In WatchDog, alarms can be triggered if one enters the interior area of a "Boundary", with grid, or not with grid. In the current state of things, it is a choice of the developer.

Which shows that we must not use item "to fixed connotation" in OCPN Draw.
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Old 24-02-2016, 07:34   #1335
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Re: Ocpn-Draw and Boundary

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Originally Posted by jongough View Post
Hi,
I have now implemented a macro change in both OD and WD which redefines the '_(X)' macro to use the catalog you want. So for OD it uses the OD catalog and WD uses the WD catalog. I have tried it with French on windows and it seems to work. Can someone give it a go and let me know if it is successful in allowing separate translations in the two plugins? If this works then I will leave OD & WD with the changes but try to get something into the mainline OCPN to help. This does nothing for the numbers, but it does for text.

I have created install files for OD:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/blyv6p38e6...win32.exe?dl=0
and WD:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/u2g31ciu9o...win32.exe?dl=0


Jon
I confirm that it seems to work. Attached are the last version of the Dutch language files. But I still have this request (see a previous message):


However, in the alarm window, it now indicates "Anchor Inside [or Outside] boundary [GUID]". So it seems to me that this alarm message uses a string from the standard Anchor Alarm. I suggest not to use the part "Anchor" of the message string at all, or to use a different string.
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File Type: doc watchdognl_20160224.po.doc (15.0 KB, 6 views)
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