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Old 20-02-2016, 15:26   #1306
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Re: Ocpn-Draw and Boundary

Gilletarom,
I know how strong the current is there, I went through it in 1970 on a bit of a rough day (I was only a crew on a 36foot hilliard).

It may not be obvious, but you could use the 'Anchor' alarm for this. It will tell you if you are going outside of the area you have drawn. Or you could draw two exclusion boundaries, one for Alderney and one for the coast and leave a passage between them, then use a boundary distance alarm to say if you are getting too close to one of the boundaries.

Jon

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Originally Posted by Gilletarom View Post
And a fourth case study.

The swinge channel is very dangerous, all along Alderney. The current is very strong. And it is not large. Only 0.5 Nm.

So I place a boundary with grid outside. And, when the boat is inside, I want an alert if the boat go outside of the area.

Yes, there is an alert when I enter in the good area. This is not important. And same, there is an alert when I go out of the area, in front habour. This is not important.
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Old 20-02-2016, 15:44   #1307
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Re: Ocpn-Draw and Boundary

Gilletarom,
I think you can do what you want, you just have to use alarms slightly differently. Remember, an Anchor alarm is used to tell you when you are leaving an identified, by GUID, boundary.

So case 1:
Setup your boundary as shown
Setup a distance alarm with a small distance
Setup an anchor alarm on the boundary using the GUID.

Now activate the distance alarm and it will tell you when you are entering the boundary from the outside. When you get into the boundary, disable the distance alarm and enable the anchor alarm. Now you will be told when you are leaving the boundary.

If you have the alarm only ring once you will need to reset the anchor alarm or enable it when you enter the boundary.

case 2:
Setup as you have it, set the alarm to auto reset and with a short test period, say 10seconds. This will then give you an alarm every 10seconds when you are close to the exclusion boundary.

case 3:
Setup an exclusion boundary around plateau of the "plateau of the Minquiers"
Setup an inclusion boundary to the east of the plateau as you have done
Set up an distance exclusion alarm for the exclusion boundary
Setup an anchor watch alarm for the east side passage
Activate the distance alarm with auto rest and cycle time of 10sec
Activate anchor watch alarm once in side the east side passage with auto reset and cycle time of 10sec

The use of the anchor alarm may be a bit misleading, I think it is the language used rather than the concept. I used 'Anchor' as that was what I was trying to set. But it may be more appropriate to call it an inclusion alarm, i.e. if inside no alarm, if outside alarm.

Jon
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Old 21-02-2016, 01:29   #1308
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Re: Ocpn-Draw and Boundary

Quote:
Originally Posted by jongough View Post
Gilletarom,
....
The use of the anchor alarm may be a bit misleading, I think it is the language used rather than the concept. I used 'Anchor' as that was what I was trying to set. But it may be more appropriate to call it an inclusion alarm, i.e. if inside no alarm, if outside alarm.
Jon
All in all, this is still the word "inclusion" which does not suit me.

It must be replaced by "Intrusion" if you absolutely want something like this. It should be better understood in many languages (if this concept also exists in other languages)

And I want that "exclusion" must replace by a word that is not "negative." In France, "Exclusion" is a "prohibition". Or in our case here, areas with "exclusion" are not prohibited areas. On the contrary. And it is possible that this problem, both linguistic and cultural, are in many languages.

Therefore, long time, I preferred to use "Inside" and "Outside" in OD while trying to use two other words in "WD". But it is because for a long time, I attribute to an OD drawing function areas, and a WD award function role of areas.

Alas, with the same items in both plugins, it's not possible.

Best regards. Gilletarom.
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Old 21-02-2016, 04:29   #1309
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Re: Ocpn-Draw and Boundary

Hope not to muddy the waters further.

Interesting point Jon. It could be an Anchor-Inclusion Alarm, or KEEP IN.
Quote:
The use of the anchor alarm may be a bit misleading, I think it is the language used rather than the concept. I used 'Anchor' as that was what I was trying to set. But it may be more appropriate to call it an inclusion alarm, i.e. if inside no alarm, if outside alarm.
Jon

Yes, Gilletarom, the boundary becomes an Exclusion or Prohibited area, KEEP OUT if you will.
Quote:
In France, "Exclusion" is a "prohibition". Or in our case here, areas with "exclusion" are not prohibited areas. On the contrary. And it is possible that this problem, both linguistic and cultural, are in many languages.
We have a problem with using the same designation in both plugins due to the way the language works.

Perhaps use something like
WD = Prohibit or Keep out [alarm] and Containment or Keep in [alarm]
OD = Exclusion [graphic] and Inclusion [graphic]
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Old 21-02-2016, 12:19   #1310
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Re: Ocpn-Draw and Boundary

Hi,
Just to give you some context around Exclusion Boundaries. Originally boundaries were of only one type, filled, but this changed to be multiple types. So we had shading inside the boundary to start with, then had to show shading outside to make a difference and because that may not suite everyone I made a boundary with no shading. Then I had to name them to help differentiate between them. At this time there was only OD involved.

The following links give some context for naming in English, this 'may' not work in other languages.
Wiki definition:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exclusion_zone
Sydney harbour NYE fireworks:
Boating | Sydney New Year's Eve
http://cdn.sydneynewyearseve.com/med...oating-map.pdf

I have already mentioned that in Australia we get exclusion zones due to military firing practice at certain points on the coast and you MUST NOT go into these.

So based on the antonym (reverse) of Exclusion which is Inclusion, I gave that name to the boundaries that have shading on the outside.

When I did the WD plugin, to avoid confusion (hahaha!) I used the same naming convention as in OD. So if you created and Exclusion Boundary, you would setup an alarm on an Exclusion Boundary. I felt that if I changed that to a 'Keep out zone' I would start to get questions as to what one of those was as the term was not 'used' elsewhere.

Just to confuse, although that was not my intention, the AIS alarm uses the term 'Guard zone', which is really an Exclusion boundary, as a proof of concept. I am waiting to find out the real requirements for the 'Guard zone' before I change OD further (using an Exclusion boundary meant I did not have to change OD at all).

I also carried this across to the Weather Routing plugin to allow exclusion (there is no choice, this is how it is coded) boundaries to be used to help the routing process. So, it may be that this will also cause issues.

Now, that I think I have internationalisation working for text, if the words Exclusion, Inclusion, Boundary, EBL, etc. do not work in a particular language then these can be changed to something that makes sense in that language to the user. Internally OD will still use these terms, as well as in the xml files generated (I have to have a common language and terms to allow export, import, save, etc). But most users will not see that.

Jon
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Old 21-02-2016, 12:42   #1311
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Re: Ocpn-Draw and Boundary

I would like to confirm that Boston has 4th of July "Exclusion Zones" and it is a commonly accepted and understood term. The antonym "inclusion" is a reasonable term, I think.
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Old 21-02-2016, 13:08   #1312
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Re: Ocpn-Draw and Boundary

Looking further into wxTranslations it looks like I can specify the catalog to use for translation. I can create a new macro to replace '_(' such that the translation is called against a specific catalog. Would you like me to try this and see if it will help with the issue of collision between plugins and OCPN?

If so, I will need someone who has had these collisions to check and see if this solves the issue. I would like to restrict the test case to one or two strings (saves changing the whole of OD), so let me know which strings to change.


Jon
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Old 21-02-2016, 20:13   #1313
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Re: Ocpn-Draw and Boundary

Hi,
I have now implemented a macro change in both OD and WD which redefines the '_(X)' macro to use the catalog you want. So for OD it uses the OD catalog and WD uses the WD catalog. I have tried it with French on windows and it seems to work. Can someone give it a go and let me know if it is successful in allowing separate translations in the two plugins? If this works then I will leave OD & WD with the changes but try to get something into the mainline OCPN to help. This does nothing for the numbers, but it does for text.

I have created install files for OD:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/blyv6p38e6...win32.exe?dl=0
and WD:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/u2g31ciu9o...win32.exe?dl=0


Jon
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Old 22-02-2016, 00:40   #1314
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Re: Ocpn-Draw and Boundary

Hello JonGough,

I really bored you, 'it seems on the topic of translations. I will continue to beta test. It's the least I indebted to you. I'm going to prevent Nevermind that it do so.

That said, two days ago, I took my tests on the Weather Routing plugin (WR). I asked a question in the thread of this plugin. This question concerns the boundary. Here's the question:
"Question: There is a checkbox to let the plugin check for a" no trespassing Boundary "or boundary least binding force?" "Aim what kind of boundary Could It Be was boundary type.?"

You may find that another user to ask a similar question in another post.

It is embedded in this post:
Weather Routing - Page 58 - Cruisers & Sailing Forums

Best regards. Gilletarom.
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Old 22-02-2016, 03:10   #1315
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Re: Ocpn-Draw and Boundary

Hello JonGough,

Updating the po file in French version is it necessary for us to OD of language files and WG are really independent?

See screenshot.
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Old 22-02-2016, 04:25   #1316
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Re: Ocpn-Draw and Boundary

Gilletarom,
The weather plugin uses exclusion boundaries only. I cannot make any further changes to the routing plugin as Sean has asked me not to whilst he reworks the plugin.

Jon

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gilletarom View Post
Hello JonGough,

I really bored you, 'it seems on the topic of translations. I will continue to beta test. It's the least I indebted to you. I'm going to prevent Nevermind that it do so.

That said, two days ago, I took my tests on the Weather Routing plugin (WR). I asked a question in the thread of this plugin. This question concerns the boundary. Here's the question:
"Question: There is a checkbox to let the plugin check for a" no trespassing Boundary "or boundary least binding force?" "Aim what kind of boundary Could It Be was boundary type.?"

You may find that another user to ask a similar question in another post.

It is embedded in this post:
Weather Routing - Page 58 - Cruisers & Sailing Forums

Best regards. Gilletarom.
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Old 22-02-2016, 06:46   #1317
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Re: Ocpn-Draw and Boundary

Sounds innovative. Will try later.
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Old 22-02-2016, 07:11   #1318
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Re: Ocpn-Draw and Boundary

It seems that the use of boundary, with "Exclusion", works quite well in the WR.
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Old 22-02-2016, 12:09   #1319
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Re: Ocpn-Draw and Boundary

Gilletarom,
I used the French file of WD and OD and made changes to each for the French translation of the english word 'Exclusion', I think I added 123 to the end of OD and 456 to the end of WD, then tried loading in different sequences WD and OD. In my testing the translation with 123 showed up in OD and 456 showed up in WD. So, I think with the change I have just made the translations are now independent and there should be no conflict with using the same english words and wanting different other language words. If this does prove to be the case the change is very simple to make to any plugin.

There is no change to the po files needed. The Dutch one got included, by mistake, in the commit which had the code changes needed. It should have had its own commit as this was an updated (provided by a user) translation file, I just missed it. It has nothing to do with the change to use independent catalogs.

Jon

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Originally Posted by Gilletarom View Post
Hello JonGough,

Updating the po file in French version is it necessary for us to OD of language files and WG are really independent?

See screenshot.
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Old 23-02-2016, 06:32   #1320
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Re: Ocpn-Draw and Boundary

Hello JonGough,

Quote:
Originally Posted by jongough View Post
Hi,
I have now implemented a macro change in both OD and WD which redefines the '_(X)' macro to use the catalog you want. So for OD it uses the OD catalog and WD uses the WD catalog. ...
for OD:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/blyv6p38e6...exe?dl=0...Jon
I reply to this post which dates back to before yesterday. I tested the language file with the OD ocpn_draw_pi-0.4.666-win32.exe release.

All words are translated, but "exclusion" and "inclusion" should be replaced by "Quadrillage intérieur" and "Quadrillage extérieur".

This is not the case. Therefore, there is a small bug with the two words.

Here join for test : French file (Not final file. Do not send the crowdin or in the guithub.)
Attached Thumbnails
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Name:	2016-02-23-Zone_dite_exclusion_en_Anglais.jpg
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ID:	119456  
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