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Old 08-02-2017, 14:47   #1
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Missouri Lake Maps

I have compiled OpenCPN and like how it runs on the PI 3. Now I'm looking for maps for my state where I do my sailing. Specifically, Long Branch Lake, Thomas Hill, Mark Twain, Lake of the Ozarks, and Table Rock Lake.

I know I can create my own maps, and I have done so. However, I would like maps that are more than a picture from GE. A vector map of Missouri lakes would be nice, something that shows me depths would be awesome.

For some reason, it appears that Missouri doesn't have nautical lake charts available, or I have not found them if they are.

Does anybody know of a place I can buy, or download them from if they're free?

Thanks
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Old 08-02-2017, 17:17   #2
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Re: Missouri Lake Maps

Don't know about "FREE" nor whether or not it will work with OpenCPN, but I've always used Navionics charts for Missouri lakes. Have it running on a Android tablet right now with Stockton Lake pulled up.

Android is basically a Linux OS. Like Open CPN.
So there is a chance OpenCPN might be able to use it.

The charts look and feel like other marine charts.

Don't know about the cost. It's been years since I installed and updated it.

P.S. You actually sail on Lake of the Ozarks?
You are a lot braver than I!
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Old 08-02-2017, 17:49   #3
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Re: Missouri Lake Maps

I have Navionics and Insite charts on my B&G plotter that I use up here on Smithville Lake. I do not really "need" maps up here but it's useful to keep using whatever tools you can when at home so when you get out to someplace unfamiliar you can seamlessly use the tools at hand.

I would love to figure out some useful Missouri maps for OpenCpn since it's much easier to talk and teach nav on a handful of tablets and laptops than it is to try to gather a whole bunch of folks up into the cockpit of my boat and try to teach there.
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Old 09-02-2017, 03:39   #4
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Re: Missouri Lake Maps

Greetings and welcome aboard the CF, cummings.
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Old 09-02-2017, 03:43   #5
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Re: Missouri Lake Maps

Look under CHART SOURCES on opencpn.org Books
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Old 09-02-2017, 05:24   #6
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Re: Missouri Lake Maps

I've thought about Navionics, but I haven't seen any real solid information on how I can get the charts. Their website seems to indicate some free software can use their charts, but I haven't seen how that works. They're pretty expensive as well, so I don't want to buy it and discover it doesn't work.

I'll sail anywhere. LOL. The only thing I've noticed is that few people on the local lakes seem to understand the concept of who has the right away. Then again, I was sailing a 50' sailboat in the Gulf last year and noticed the same problem there.

Quote:
Originally Posted by missourisailor View Post
Don't know about "FREE" nor whether or not it will work with OpenCPN, but I've always used Navionics charts for Missouri lakes. Have it running on a Android tablet right now with Stockton Lake pulled up.


P.S. You actually sail on Lake of the Ozarks?
You are a lot braver than I!
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Old 09-02-2017, 05:30   #7
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Re: Missouri Lake Maps

Quote:
Originally Posted by rgleason View Post
Look under CHART SOURCES on opencpn.org Books
Missouri does not have anything available under there. NOAA and the COE do not publish anything other than the Missouri River charts. Not a single lake in Missouri is charted by them.

I've seen several android or iPhone charts in apps, but not something I can download and use outside of the app it belongs to.

I'm very curious why Missouri lakes aren't charted by NOAA or the COE? Does anybody know?
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Old 09-02-2017, 06:05   #8
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Re: Missouri Lake Maps

Lake of the Ozarks is an Ameren lake rather than the Corps of Engineers. Most of the rest of them, the Corps probably has something rolled up and stacked in the corner but it costs money and time to convert that data into useful electronic format.
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Old 09-02-2017, 07:41   #9
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Re: Missouri Lake Maps

USGS has topographic maps in 1:24000 scale which can be downloaded in GeoTIFF (or TIF) format. The downloads are free. OpenCPN does not read this format. However, it is possible to convert these maps into raster charts in the KAP format which OpenCPN can read and display. There are instructions for converting image formats to KAP charts in the BOOKS on the OpenCPN.org website. Avoid maps in the Lambert Conformal Conic projection because OpenCPN cannot display them.

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Old 09-02-2017, 08:02   #10
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Re: Missouri Lake Maps

Quote:
Originally Posted by cummings66 View Post
I've thought about Navionics, but I haven't seen any real solid information on how I can get the charts. Their website seems to indicate some free software can use their charts, but I haven't seen how that works. They're pretty expensive as well, so I don't want to buy it and discover it doesn't work..
For tablets, visit the Navionics page:
Navionics Boating (US) | Navionics
to see the chart in action. The online chart is near the bottom of the page.

I thought that I read somewhere that OpenCPN can use Navionic charts. But some other expert will have to chime in on that.

As far as price, it looks like you can get a chart package for around $100 that will include all of MO.


Quote:
Originally Posted by cummings66 View Post
I'll sail anywhere. LOL. The only thing I've noticed is that few people on the local lakes seem to understand the concept of who has the right away. .
This and that some use their boats as penius extensions, proving that they have more horsepower than brains.
I have seen a 1500hp cigarette boat going full bore up the main channel with zero regards about his wake or what is around the bend.
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Old 10-02-2017, 05:41   #11
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Re: Missouri Lake Maps

Quote:
Originally Posted by .Paul. View Post
USGS has topographic maps in 1:24000 scale which can be downloaded in GeoTIFF (or TIF) format. The downloads are free. OpenCPN does not read this format. However, it is possible to convert these maps into raster charts in the KAP format which OpenCPN can read and display. There are instructions for converting image formats to KAP charts in the BOOKS on the OpenCPN.org website. Avoid maps in the Lambert Conformal Conic projection because OpenCPN cannot display them.

Paul
Do you have the link to the topographical maps?

Which chart did not work with lambert conformal conic?? It should be supported.

How do you convert geotiff to kap?

Quote:
Originally Posted by missourisailor View Post
For tablets, visit the Navionics page:
Navionics Boating (US) | Navionics
to see the chart in action. The online chart is near the bottom of the page.

I thought that I read somewhere that OpenCPN can use Navionic charts. But some other expert will have to chime in on that.
Yes, it's possible.
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Old 10-02-2017, 07:41   #12
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Re: Missouri Lake Maps

Quote:
Originally Posted by boat_alexandra View Post
Do you have the link to the topographical maps?

Which chart did not work with lambert conformal conic?? It should be supported.

How do you convert geotiff to kap?


Yes, it's possible.
Sean,

Here is the link to the topo maps
https://www.topoquest.com/map-detail..._cell_id=24602

I used this site because Google found it for me. topoquest.com also has a quick and easy menu to find a lake map by entry of lat and lon. I have used the official USGS web site before, but it took longer to find the quadrangles I wanted to download.

I converted one quadrangle for Lake of the Ozarks into a kap chart using kapgen.cmd, a Windows CMD file that gps-marco used to convert the New Zealand tif chart images to kap charts before LINZ made their bsb-kap files downloadable. Kapgen uses MapCal2 as a GUI calibration tool. I did not take the time to dig into the GeoRef information from the GeoTiff. I just used it as a tif, and I calibrated it in MapCal2 using the lat and lon for each corner of the quadrangle.

Screenshot--Lake of the Ozarks in OpenCPN:
Click image for larger version

Name:	Lake of the Ozarks.jpg
Views:	32
Size:	421.8 KB
ID:	140985

These topo quadrangles appear to be the source for some of the lake charts that are sold by boat equipment and clothing stores.

Lambert Conformal Conic charts are available in BSB/KAP format. The Chart Downloader downloads them from NOAA, but OpenCPN can't use them (opencpn.log notes the problem).

Code:
14982_1.KAP	KNP/SC=42240	PR=LAMBERT CONFORMAL CONIC	NA="NORTH LAKE"
14983_1.KAP	KNP/SC=42240	PR=LAMBERT CONFORMAL CONIC	NA="NORTHERN LIGHT LAKE"
14984_1.KAP	KNP/SC=42240	PR=LAMBERT CONFORMAL CONIC	NA="SEA GULL LAKE"
14985_1.KAP	KNP/SC=42240	PR=LAMBERT CONFORMAL CONIC	NA="SAGANAGA LAKE"
14986_1.KAP	KNP/SC=42240	PR=LAMBERT CONFORMAL CONIC	NA="KNIFE LAKE"
14987_1.KAP	KNP/SC=42240	PR=LAMBERT CONFORMAL CONIC	NA="BASSWOOD LAKE EASTERN PART"
14987_2.KAP	KNP/SC=42240	PR=LAMBERT CONFORMAL CONIC	NA="BASSWOOD LAKE EASTERN PART EXTENSION  A"
14988_1.KAP	KNP/SC=42240	PR=LAMBERT CONFORMAL CONIC	NA="BASSWOOD LAKE WESTERN PART"
14988_2.KAP	KNP/SC=42240	PR=LAMBERT CONFORMAL CONIC	NA="BASSWOOD LAKE EASTERN PART EXTENSION  A"
14989_1.KAP	KNP/SC=42240	PR=LAMBERT CONFORMAL CONIC	NA="CROOKED LAKE"
14989_2.KAP	KNP/SC=42240	PR=LAMBERT CONFORMAL CONIC	NA="CROOKED LAKE EXTENSION"
14990_1.KAP	KNP/SC=10000	PR=LAMBERT CONFORMAL CONIC	NA="BASSWOOD RIVER"
14991_1.KAP	KNP/SC=42240	PR=LAMBERT CONFORMAL CONIC	NA="LAC LA CROIX"
14991_2.KAP	KNP/SC=42240	PR=LAMBERT CONFORMAL CONIC	NA="LAC LA CROIX EXTENSION"
14992_1.KAP	KNP/SC=42240	PR=LAMBERT CONFORMAL CONIC	NA="SAND POINT LAKE TO LAC LA CROIX"
14993_1.KAP	KNP/SC=42240	PR=LAMBERT CONFORMAL CONIC	NA="NAMAKAN LAKE"
14994_1.KAP	KNP/SC=42240	PR=LAMBERT CONFORMAL CONIC	NA="EAST PART KABETOGAMA LAKE WEST PART NAMAKAN LAKE"
14995_1.KAP	KNP/SC=42240	PR=LAMBERT CONFORMAL CONIC	NA="WESTERN PART KABETOGAMA LAKE"
I reproject the Lambert Conformal Conic charts to Mercator to display them in O, but that is a different story.

Paul
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Old 10-02-2017, 07:43   #13
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Re: Missouri Lake Maps

Quote:
Originally Posted by boat_alexandra View Post
Do you have the link to the topographical maps?

Which chart did not work with lambert conformal conic?? It should be supported.

How do you convert geotiff to kap?


Yes, it's possible.
Lamberts conformal conical does not work with the core OpenCPN. Perhaps it's possible using your "Projections" plugin, which I haven't tested.

Geotiffs comes in a few flavours. I have only seen those which only contains a .tif picture, and those that also contains a text file with essential data, but there are more...... All seems to contain a .tiff picture so conversion to a kap should be straight forward.

The only way to display Navionics charts that I know of, is to buy Navionics charts in a S63 version from Chartworld and use OpenCPNs S63 plugin. I could not find any chart for Missouri lakes however doing quick scan of Chartworld charts.

Thomas
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Old 10-02-2017, 13:47   #14
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Re: Missouri Lake Maps

Quote:
Originally Posted by cagney View Post
Lamberts conformal conical does not work with the core OpenCPN. Perhaps it's possible using your "Projections" plugin, which I haven't tested.
The great lakes charts use this projection and the have always worked.

With the recent projections improvement, you can even quilt them with charts of different projections.

If it doesn't work it should be fixed...

Quote:
Geotiffs comes in a few flavours. I have only seen those which only contains a .tif picture, and those that also contains a text file with essential data, but there are more...... All seems to contain a .tiff picture so conversion to a kap should be straight forward.
Ok... there should be an automatic way to convert them to kap. After all, kap is already tif.
Quote:
The only way to display Navionics charts that I know of, is to buy Navionics charts in a S63 version from Chartworld and use OpenCPNs S63 plugin. I could not find any chart for Missouri lakes however doing quick scan of Chartworld charts.

Thomas
Actually, many sailors now have complete KAP navionics charts covering entire world except denmark. It's only 1.5gb and cost nothing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by .Paul. View Post
Sean,

Here is the link to the topo maps
https://www.topoquest.com/map-detail..._cell_id=24602

I used this site because Google found it for me. topoquest.com also has a quick and easy menu to find a lake map by entry of lat and lon. I have used the official USGS web site before, but it took longer to find the quadrangles I wanted to download.

I converted one quadrangle for Lake of the Ozarks into a kap chart using kapgen.cmd, a Windows CMD file that gps-marco used to convert the New Zealand tif chart images to kap charts before LINZ made their bsb-kap files downloadable. Kapgen uses MapCal2 as a GUI calibration tool. I did not take the time to dig into the GeoRef information from the GeoTiff. I just used it as a tif, and I calibrated it in MapCal2 using the lat and lon for each corner of the quadrangle.
Manually?? I thought it could be automatic.

Quote:
Lambert Conformal Conic charts are available in BSB/KAP format. The Chart Downloader downloads them from NOAA, but OpenCPN can't use them (opencpn.log notes the problem).

Code:
.....
CONIC    NA="EAST PART KABETOGAMA LAKE WEST PART NAMAKAN LAKE"
14995_1.KAP    KNP/SC=42240    PR=LAMBERT CONFORMAL CONIC    NA="WESTERN PART KABETOGAMA LAKE"
I reproject the Lambert Conformal Conic charts to Mercator to display them in O, but that is a different story.

Paul
I don't see what the problem is from your log.

OpenCPN should be able to display these charts. I think the problem is you need the polynomial coefficients. Did you include them?

Sure you can also convert them to mercator, but this will either lose data, or you must use an output image dimensions much larger than the original image and in this case, the resulting file will be much larger. Furthermore, because of the simplistic compression scheme used by kap, once you convert projections, the compression will be terrible, so I imagine the resulting file 3-4 times larger for the same quality. It would be better to keep them in the native projection.
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Old 10-02-2017, 14:10   #15
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Re: Missouri Lake Maps

I use Navionics on Mark Twain Lake in Missouri. Works fine.

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