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Old 31-01-2016, 02:23   #1
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KAP Files Help appreciated

Facing some problems making KAP file. Unfortunately I did not find the exact standard definition for KAP file. There is something at sourceforge and something at OpenCPN but no basic standard description.

My Problem:
I checked the positioning setting waypoints in OpenCPN using the dezimal Lat/Lon's from the KAP File and the xy Pixels and the REF's seem to be correct. Red square.

Furthermore scrolling in the chart is moving southwards.

Here is the KAP file content:
-----------------------
VER/4.0
BSB/NA= TRSCANSKI ZALJEV, NU=HR-MK1
RA=3875,5704,
DU=300
KNP/SC=100000
GD=Bessel 1841,PR=MERCATOR
PP=45.416667
PI=UNKNOWN,SP=UNKNOWN,
SK=0.0,TA=90.0,UN=METERS
SD=LLWS,DX=000,DY=000
CED/SE=2014-12-01,RE=1.0,ED=2016-01-01
OST/1
REF/1,0,0,45.376667,13.403333
REF/2,0,5703,45.816667,13.403333
REF/3,3875,5704,45.816667,13.824167
REF/4,3875,0,45.376667,13.824167
PLY/1,45.376667,13.403333
PLY/2,45.816667,13.403333
PLY/3,45.816667,13.824167
PLY/4,45.376667,13.824167
! - DTM/0.60,16.80
DTM/0.00,0.00
CPH/0.0
-----------------------

AND YES, I tried to rotate the refs. - Nothing changed.

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Old 31-01-2016, 02:37   #2
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Re: KAP Files Help appreciated

You should move this to the OpenCPN forum - which version of OCPN are you using?

At a first glance the Datum might be an issue:
GD=Bessel 1841

Did you try to patch it?
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Old 31-01-2016, 02:41   #3
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Re: KAP Files Help appreciated

Quote:
Originally Posted by bcn View Post
You should move this to the OpenCPN forum - which version of OCPN are you using?

At a first glance the Datum might be an issue:
GD=Bessel 1841

Did you try to patch it?
No patches, Version is 4.0, tool is imgkap. OK I try WGS84 instead.
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Old 31-01-2016, 02:46   #4
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Re: KAP Files Help appreciated

Checked with WGS84. First view position different but chart orientation is the same.

p.s: I think it is not really an OpenCPN issue as KAP files are widely used in other navaids
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Old 31-01-2016, 03:09   #5
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Re: KAP Files Help appreciated

Didn't say that this i san OCPN issue - but you might have more experts in the forum...
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Old 31-01-2016, 03:13   #6
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Re: KAP Files Help appreciated

Well yes thank you but good question for me - how to move?


OK thank you - did find the post to the admin
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Old 31-01-2016, 05:34   #7
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Re: KAP Files Help appreciated

Quote:
Originally Posted by moseriw View Post
Facing some problems making KAP file. Unfortunately I did not find the exact standard definition for KAP file. There is something at sourceforge and something at OpenCPN but no basic standard description.

My Problem:
I checked the positioning setting waypoints in OpenCPN using the dezimal Lat/Lon's from the KAP File and the xy Pixels and the REF's seem to be correct. Red square.

Furthermore scrolling in the chart is moving southwards.

Here is the KAP file content:
-----------------------
VER/4.0
BSB/NA= TRSCANSKI ZALJEV, NU=HR-MK1
RA=3875,5704,
DU=300
KNP/SC=100000
GD=Bessel 1841,PR=MERCATOR
PP=45.416667
PI=UNKNOWN,SP=UNKNOWN,
SK=0.0,TA=90.0,UN=METERS
SD=LLWS,DX=000,DY=000
CED/SE=2014-12-01,RE=1.0,ED=2016-01-01
OST/1
REF/1,0,0,45.376667,13.403333
REF/2,0,5703,45.816667,13.403333
REF/3,3875,5704,45.816667,13.824167
REF/4,3875,0,45.376667,13.824167
PLY/1,45.376667,13.403333
PLY/2,45.816667,13.403333
PLY/3,45.816667,13.824167
PLY/4,45.376667,13.824167
! - DTM/0.60,16.80
DTM/0.00,0.00
CPH/0.0
-----------------------

AND YES, I tried to rotate the refs. - Nothing changed.


If you want the "exact" standard you will have to buy it from Maptech (I think). Nobody involved with OpenCPN has access to it.
On the other hand it's not necessary. See imgkap and the kap file | Official OpenCPN Homepage and the other pages nearby. This describes how OpenCPN handles .kap files, and that is all you need.

If your chart is moving against the background while scrolling, or panning, it indicates a geo-referencing error. There is something wrong with your REF lines. Go back to the original chart picture and double check.
It is also helpful to check the opencpn.log file. Here you will find if OpenCPN finds any errors while loading your chart.

Good Luck!
Thomas
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Old 31-01-2016, 06:30   #8
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Re: KAP Files Help appreciated

If you are using imgkap you don't need 4 points for georeferencing but only top/left and bottom/right corner.

Gerhard
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Old 31-01-2016, 09:46   #9
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Re: KAP Files Help appreciated

BlankchartTest.kap.doc

here, I made a fast blank with your dimensions but wgs84 on imgkap. You can try it -seems to display ok

My first guess:
I note that imgkap re-sized the chart picture.
Code:
Extend widthin 3875 heightin 5704 to widthout 3875 heightout 5771
Proportions are very important for correct display.

I also edited a copy to use your odd datum but it doesn't display the weirdness you describe.... O will load unknown things as WGS84.

Code:
D:\CHARTS_USED\CHARTS_Specials-USED\BlankchartTest-strangedatum.kap
8:35:23 AM:    Default datum (WGS84) substituted.
Tip: a useful tool is "bsbfix". Drag any hex-edited (or text-edited) files onto bsbfix.exe.
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Old 31-01-2016, 09:56   #10
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Re: KAP Files Help appreciated

imgkap_MakeaKap.txt

here's a cmd(or bat) file I use for single kaps on a windows machine (XP or W7)
Change the ".txt" to ".cmd" but read it first as text because it tells you what to do...and, so you'll know I'm not secretly stealing your wife's bra size or something

You can edit it too to suit your own datums and stuff.
To find out more about imgkap, just type imgkap in the command window and help will appear.
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Old 31-01-2016, 10:00   #11
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Re: KAP Files Help appreciated

Happy...

do you know what this is about (the ! - ..)?

PLY/4,45.376667,13.824167
! - DTM/0.60,16.80
DTM/0.00,0.00

Hubert
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Old 31-01-2016, 10:05   #12
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Re: KAP Files Help appreciated

Quote:
Originally Posted by HappySeagull View Post
Attachment 118054

here's a cmd(or bat) file I use for single kaps on a windows machine (XP or W7)
Change the ".txt" to ".cmd" but read it first as text because it tells you what to do...and, so you'll know I'm not secretly stealing your wife's bra size or something

You can edit it too to suit your own datums and stuff.
To find out more about imgkap, just type imgkap in the command window and help will appear.
Thanks a lot - in progress
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Old 31-01-2016, 10:10   #13
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Re: KAP Files Help appreciated

Quote:
Originally Posted by bcn View Post
Happy...

do you know what this is about (the ! - ..)?

PLY/4,45.376667,13.824167
! - DTM/0.60,16.80
DTM/0.00,0.00

Hubert

Yes as the original chart is BESSEL 1841 (which is in the georef.c but gives an error on OpenCPN) the chart has to be corrected 0,01 minutes N and 0,28 min E and one has to insert seconds in DTM. I think this does not effect the graphics but the calculation of the position.
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Old 31-01-2016, 10:59   #14
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Re: KAP Files Help appreciated

An IHO paper with descriptions of the BSB 3.0 / .kap format
https://www.iho.int/iho_pubs/standar...ns_for_RNC.pdf
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Old 31-01-2016, 11:20   #15
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Re: KAP Files Help appreciated

Quote:
Originally Posted by bcn View Post
Happy...

do you know what this is about (the ! - ..)?

PLY/4,45.376667,13.824167
! - DTM/0.60,16.80
DTM/0.00,0.00

Hubert
no I don't! "! - " looks like the progam converting added it?
otherwise as moseriw said except that it is a correction that should be used to make a chart conform to wgs 84 with GD= wgs 84 in the header, not some outlier datum there.
That's confusion. This confusion can be seen in government issued charts too. I have my old CHS (1996) that state GD= NAD27 but are in fact geo-refed to wgs84! so a program like Seaclear, (trying hard to "do it right" and reading the header) puts you in the wrong place!

I never use dtm if I can help it. It is in the end easier to change the georef to WGS84.
KISS

It is just an opinion but any proper kap should be wgs84. Here's why. It's a computer format. Computers generally became real in the 90's after WGS84 (and gps too)... These historical national datums are interesting insights into surveying with a pocket watch and sextant but they are nowadays a confusion to wreck hapless sailors.
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