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Old 09-10-2014, 09:16   #346
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Re: 12vdc Marine Computers

Lulle, ...Intel NUC with Atom, 8GB memory, 256GB SSD and Win7. What version number?
How fast is it with opencpn 3.3.2118? ..Amps or Watts used by NUC?

..I am considering configuring it with a WP Sun Monitor for primary navigation tool with Radar, AIS and Seatalk Instruments.

Neptune's Gear - The 15" at $1658 would be ideal but is more than a Garmin 740 + Garmin HD Radar would cost. Is the 8" a practical size and how much do you use the touch screen? Does touchscreen work ok with Opencpn?

Thanks.
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Old 09-10-2014, 09:53   #347
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Re: 12vdc Marine Computers

The NUC I used is DE3815TYKHE. Its both the board and case. Then I completed it with a mini PCI with bluetooth and wifi. The antennas are already mounted in the kit. According to spec it draws 20-30 W at close to 100% load. But if you start using the USB ports u will typically see a raise. The specs say that if all is used to nearly 100% u might expect 80W.

Performance wise I am very satisfied. On a regatta we had ~150 AIS targets visible. Completely smooth. CM93 charts at max res and details. 22" monitor at high def res.

I would not like 8". But then again. For the cockpit you need something like that. I have no experience with touch and OCPN. Others do know.

Cheers

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Old 09-10-2014, 10:20   #348
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Re: 12vdc Marine Computers

That is very helpful Lulle, thank you. Do you happen to know how many amps this NUC draws when asleep with Opencpn loaded and how many amps when you are running opencpn with charts panning/ zooming etc (it will bounce around, just need rough average). Are you using 3.2.2? Are you using Opengl?
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Old 09-10-2014, 11:16   #349
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Re: 12vdc Marine Computers

I used a beta from June / July. If I remember correctly it took between 0.5 and 0.7A when running and less than 0.1 when asleep. That is Windows sleep.

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Old 09-10-2014, 13:39   #350
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Re: 12vdc Marine Computers

Quote:
Originally Posted by seglar-lulle View Post
Hi,

I built a system recently around the smallest Intel NUC with an Atom processor, 8GB memory, 256GB SSD and Win7. Runs directly on 12V, no adapters. That HW came in under 300 euros. Size of the box is like a paperback.
The screen I chose was a 22" high resolution camping LED-TV. Also 12V native. Came in under 150 euros.
Then a Bluetooth keyboard with a trackpad built in (I think they referred to it as a Media keyboard).
For connecting to the on-board Garmin plotter and Garmin AIS I got a Shipmodul Miniplex (150 euros). Only thing remaining now is connecting the Autohelm ST50 instruments. I am still considering options to convert the SeaTalk stream to NMEA0183.

Anyway, for roughly 600 euros I have a very nice fan-less, low power 12V system in the cabin.

/Lulle


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Sounds great except for the atom. The atom has a built in bottleneck. Internal data bus limits actual speed. win 7 good choice
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Old 09-10-2014, 13:45   #351
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Re: 12vdc Marine Computers

I agree it's a comparatively slow cpu. But for a hazzlefree build that is small and silent and that doesn't require too much power I am quite pleased. And it doesn't get warm.

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Old 09-10-2014, 14:10   #352
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Re: 12vdc Marine Computers

I'll just post this again.. In case it got missed.. No I absolutely don't work for MS!

These days you can get a used original Surface Pro for around $200 - $250 on craigslist or careful ebaying. With searching, that would even include the "Type" keyboard.

The Original Surface Pro (I5 processor) will beat any Atom built PC in pretty much any test you throw at it. Changing the power settings will also allow it to run at very similar wattage draw. I have gotten mine down to 10W just sitting at the start screen, and 18W with OpenCPN running. Max wattage draw is 48W (maximum the power supply can supply).

So for $200 - 250 you get a touchscreen 10" PC with a keyboard that runs OpenCPN very well (I have no problems with OpenCPN on Windows 8.1). If you want, you can even hook up an external monitor to the expansion port using an optional cable. No specing, building or configuring.

For me, I couldn't find a better value. So cheap, that I have and extra one as a backup.
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Old 10-10-2014, 00:10   #353
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Re: 12vdc Marine Computers

For $50 you can get an arm board that uses 2-3 watts of power. For $30 you can get a 7 inch lcd display with high brightness backlight. Another $25 for a usb gps (much better than a tablet gps because it can be strategically placed) and and for $3 a 12 volt to 5 volt high efficiency converter.

For a total cost of $108, you have a complete chart plotter with hardware accelerated graphics which runs opencpn at 30 frames per second smooth and responsive, with power consumption at 4 watts with maximum brightness.

All of the components can be reused in future systems as this is a modular setup.

My setup also allows me to serve gps data over wifi. It also can drive the speakers so any other computer can play music without having to plug into them or need a separate bluetooth adaptor.

Finally, it can rebroadcast over wifi the wifi or 3g signals which it received from a usb extension cable to the strategically placed (can automatically track with directional antennas) adaptor.
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Old 10-10-2014, 07:38   #354
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Re: 12vdc Marine Computers

Quote:
Originally Posted by boat_alexandra View Post
For $50 you can get an arm board that uses 2-3 watts of power. For $30 you can get a 7 inch lcd display with high brightness backlight. Another $25 for a usb gps (much better than a tablet gps because it can be strategically placed) and and for $3 a 12 volt to 5 volt high efficiency converter.

For a total cost of $108, you have a complete chart plotter with hardware accelerated graphics which runs opencpn at 30 frames per second smooth and responsive, with power consumption at 4 watts with maximum brightness.

All of the components can be reused in future systems as this is a modular setup.

My setup also allows me to serve gps data over wifi. It also can drive the speakers so any other computer can play music without having to plug into them or need a separate bluetooth adaptor.

Finally, it can rebroadcast over wifi the wifi or 3g signals which it received from a usb extension cable to the strategically placed (can automatically track with directional antennas) adaptor.
I cant even find the Cubbie Truck board, that I think you are refering to, for less than $100 in North America !
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Old 10-10-2014, 08:20   #355
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Re: 12vdc Marine Computers

I like your Tupperware box and the low power Cortex A7 (same architecture as A15 & A17) used in Samsung Tablets too. I assume this is a Cubietruck or Cubieboard3 Allwinner A20. Here it is more like $100. Sean, is this powerful enough in your judgement? Really like the power use compared to NUC and Intel. Appears Intel has a long way to go re power use, even with the Broadwell Core M that is just coming out.

There are lots of ARM Cortex 7 Boards out there. Is Cubietruck the most easily configured along with having the best features? See below. What do you think of the new Allwinner A33 Quad below? (does not support HDMI) Would it be a reasonable chipset for our purpose? What do you think of the Odroids?

How difficult to load Linux and drivers? -- are these the instructions for ARM? Building on Motorola Xoom | Official OpenCPN Homepage Which Linux do you use?

Your display is like Adafruit 7" Display 1280x800 (720p) IPS + Speakers - HDMI/VGA/NTSC/PAL $170 How visible in sunlight? Need a shade on 3 sides, or in cabin?

Thanks Rick

============================

Cubietruck

Cubieboard3 allwinner A20 Dual-core ARM Cortex-A7 2G DDR 8G Flash open hardware Single-board Computer mini pc linux andriod with sata The Cortex-A7 processor most power-efficient application processor ARM has ever developed, led the multicore revolution for devices based on the popular quad- and octa- core configurations. Cortex-A7 are identical to the Cortex-A15 and A17 processors, with differences in the Cortex-A7 processor's microarchitecture focused on providing optimum energy efficiency. This enables pairing in a big.LITTLE configuration to provide the ultimate combination of high-performance with ultra-low power consumption. (See config below.)

Black Ewell Case
for CubieTruck compatible with a 2.5 -inch hard disk and the lithium battery, can remove the assembly yourself.
------

Allwinner A33 is a $4 chipset with quad-core Cortex-A7 processor July 29,2014
"Targets 7" to 8" tablets in the $30-$60 range, so we can't expect the A33 to be a speed demon.
Still, the Allwinner A33 has quad-core Cortex-A7 processor and a dual-core Mali-400 MP2 GPU, supports displays up to 1,280 x 800 and can play back 1080p @ 60fps video, integrates SmartColor, and "ultra-low power consumption."
Allwinner claims their design is more power efficient than competitor Cortex-A7 quad-cores and on a 4,000mAh battery can last 300 hours in standby more or 6 and a half hours of 1080p video playback, 6 hours of 3D gaming (Fishing Joy) and 8 hours of music playback. The A33 is pin-compatible with the A23 (based on a dual-core Cortex-A7), so tablet manufacturers can easily upgrade to the new design

Allwinner A33 Quad Core


AllWinner A33 Quad Core SoC is Pin-to-Pin Compatible with AllWinner A23
Read more: AllWinner A33 Quad Core SoC is Pin-to-Pin Compatible with AllWinner A23
Below is Reference Price whatever that is, (we never see it)
Quad-core A33 SoC+ PMIC AXP223 ≈4.99USD
7″ Tablets powered by A33 ≈40USD ( A33, 7″,800*480, 1GB DDR3,8GB Flash)
7.85″ Tablets powered by A33≈ 45USD ( A33, 7.85″, 1024*768, 1GB DDR3, 8GB Flash)
8″ Tablets powered by A33 ≈ 50USD ( A33, 8″, 1280*800, 1GB DDR3, 8GB Flash)”
Read more: AllWinner A33 Quad Core SoC is Pin-to-Pin Compatible with AllWinner A23

------

Odroid U3 $65 Arm A7 Not as fully featured.
Odroid XU3 $179 Samsung Exynos5422 Cortex™-A15 2.0Ghz quad core and Cortex™-A7 quad core CPUs
--overkill?
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Old 10-10-2014, 08:29   #356
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Re: 12vdc Marine Computers

Also possible for display

Pixel Qi 10" Display with Controller- 1024x600 HDMI/VGA/NTSC/PAL PRODUCT ID: 1303 $179.95
- 1000 nits
  • Resolution: 1024 x 600 (color RGB) and 3072x600 (backlight off, grayscale)
  • Visible area: 222mm x 125mm (10.06" diagonal)
  • Brightness: 165 Nits (dark room), 235 Nits (office lighting), 1000+ (daylight)
  • Pixel Qi PQ 3Qi-01 Datasheet has lots more details
Not as good a mount.


Sean you must use a keyboard....mouse? Your thoughts on touch screen please?
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Old 10-10-2014, 09:56   #357
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Re: 12vdc Marine Computers

Quote:
Originally Posted by rgleason View Post
I like your Tupperware box and the low power Cortex A7 (same architecture as A15 & A17) used in Samsung Tablets too. I assume this is a Cubietruck or Cubieboard3 Allwinner A20. Here it is more like $100. Sean, is this powerful enough in your judgement? Really like the power use compared to NUC and Intel. Appears Intel has a long way to go re power use, even with the Broadwell Core M that is just coming out.

There are lots of ARM Cortex 7 Boards out there. Is Cubietruck the most easily configured along with having the best features? See below. What do you think of the new Allwinner A33 Quad below? (does not support HDMI) Would it be a reasonable chipset for our purpose? What do you think of the Odroids?

How difficult to load Linux and drivers? -- are these the instructions for ARM? Building on Motorola Xoom | Official OpenCPN Homepage Which Linux do you use?

Your display is like Adafruit 7" Display 1280x800 (720p) IPS + Speakers - HDMI/VGA/NTSC/PAL $170 How visible in sunlight? Need a shade on 3 sides, or in cabin?

Thanks Rick

============================

Cubietruck

Cubieboard3 allwinner A20 Dual-core ARM Cortex-A7 2G DDR 8G Flash open hardware Single-board Computer mini pc linux andriod with sata The Cortex-A7 processor most power-efficient application processor ARM has ever developed, led the multicore revolution for devices based on the popular quad- and octa- core configurations. Cortex-A7 are identical to the Cortex-A15 and A17 processors, with differences in the Cortex-A7 processor's microarchitecture focused on providing optimum energy efficiency. This enables pairing in a big.LITTLE configuration to provide the ultimate combination of high-performance with ultra-low power consumption. (See config below.)

Black Ewell Case
for CubieTruck compatible with a 2.5 -inch hard disk and the lithium battery, can remove the assembly yourself.
------

Allwinner A33 is a $4 chipset with quad-core Cortex-A7 processor July 29,2014
"Targets 7" to 8" tablets in the $30-$60 range, so we can't expect the A33 to be a speed demon.
Still, the Allwinner A33 has quad-core Cortex-A7 processor and a dual-core Mali-400 MP2 GPU, supports displays up to 1,280 x 800 and can play back 1080p @ 60fps video, integrates SmartColor, and "ultra-low power consumption."
Allwinner claims their design is more power efficient than competitor Cortex-A7 quad-cores and on a 4,000mAh battery can last 300 hours in standby more or 6 and a half hours of 1080p video playback, 6 hours of 3D gaming (Fishing Joy) and 8 hours of music playback. The A33 is pin-compatible with the A23 (based on a dual-core Cortex-A7), so tablet manufacturers can easily upgrade to the new design

Allwinner A33 Quad Core


AllWinner A33 Quad Core SoC is Pin-to-Pin Compatible with AllWinner A23
Read more: AllWinner A33 Quad Core SoC is Pin-to-Pin Compatible with AllWinner A23
Below is Reference Price whatever that is, (we never see it)
Quad-core A33 SoC+ PMIC AXP223 ≈4.99USD
7″ Tablets powered by A33 ≈40USD ( A33, 7″,800*480, 1GB DDR3,8GB Flash)
7.85″ Tablets powered by A33≈ 45USD ( A33, 7.85″, 1024*768, 1GB DDR3, 8GB Flash)
8″ Tablets powered by A33 ≈ 50USD ( A33, 8″, 1280*800, 1GB DDR3, 8GB Flash)”
Read more: AllWinner A33 Quad Core SoC is Pin-to-Pin Compatible with AllWinner A23

------

Odroid U3 $65 Arm A7 Not as fully featured.
Odroid XU3 $179 Samsung Exynos5422 Cortex™-A15 2.0Ghz quad core and Cortex™-A7 quad core CPUs
--overkill?
Rick:
Yes, That is a CubieTruck. I gave it to him for development. I also have two just like it here, and it is plenty fast for use as a chart plotter. When I run the Sean's plugin for AIS via RTLSDR it only is using about 25% of it total capacity.
Its really the easiest of all the ARM's I have to configure.

Thanks,
Freddie
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Old 10-10-2014, 12:22   #358
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Re: 12vdc Marine Computers

Thanks Freddie. That's helpful info. I found there were Quad Cortex A9 (Low Power) boards for linux too. Wandboard Quad has SATA, 2GB ram, etc
Wandboard Dual Freescale i.MX6 Cortex-A9 Development Board | Mouser
WANDBOARD - Future Electronics
Wandboard | Arch Linux ARM
Top 10 Open Source Linux Boards Under $200 | Linux.com
Wandboard - Freescale i.MX6 ARM Cortex-A9 Opensource Community Development Board - BUY
Wandboard - Freescale i.MX6 ARM Cortex-A9 Opensource Community Development Board - DOWNLOADS Has Linux download.

VAR-SOM-MX6 CPU: Freescale iMX6

Do you know anything about Wandboard and the Quad Cortex A9? Sounds like that might be overkill.
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Old 10-10-2014, 16:29   #359
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Re: 12vdc Marine Computers

Quote:
Originally Posted by rgleason View Post
Thanks Freddie. That's helpful info. I found there were Quad Cortex A9 (Low Power) boards for linux too. Wandboard Quad has SATA, 2GB ram, etc
Wandboard Dual Freescale i.MX6 Cortex-A9 Development Board | Mouser
WANDBOARD - Future Electronics
Wandboard | Arch Linux ARM
Top 10 Open Source Linux Boards Under $200 | Linux.com
Wandboard - Freescale i.MX6 ARM Cortex-A9 Opensource Community Development Board - BUY
Wandboard - Freescale i.MX6 ARM Cortex-A9 Opensource Community Development Board - DOWNLOADS Has Linux download.

VAR-SOM-MX6 CPU: Freescale iMX6

Do you know anything about Wandboard and the Quad Cortex A9? Sounds like that might be overkill.
Rick:
I have a Quad core Wandboard, and a two UDOO's, and although they are very nice because of the extra HP neither of them have usable Open GL. They use Vivante instead of MALI graphics processors (GP) and there is no usable open source code to make use of the Vivante GP available for them just yet.

They are nice on power, about 4 - 10 watts, depending on what its doing.

thanks,

Freddie
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Old 10-10-2014, 16:46   #360
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Re: 12vdc Marine Computers

Freddie, you are a wealth of knowledge on this. What do you use all of these for? Would they run Opencpn at all? (You would not have shading for Grib and Climatology etc). They draw a bit more power because of the quad cores don't they? What is the potential of someone building the drivers for Opengl and are these decent graphics processors?
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