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Old 11-09-2017, 20:47   #1
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Irma Knocked Our Dream Off Stands a Week After Purchase

Steadman ("Steady Hand") posted a 1981 Gulfstar Sailmaster 39 in his topic, "Boats Less than $30k..." on May 15th (forever grateful to Steady!!!).

We looked at her online, fell in love, contacted the owner, and toured her over Fathers' Day with our crew (5 kids).

What a boat!!

We spent all summer scrambling to fund a purchase we hadn't planned to make for a few years and finally pulled the seller's price together. The Admiral and I traveled to St. Augustine to close the deal on August 27th.

No, no survey...such a deal, we figured, and character of seller and his neighbor were enough to feel comfortable with a handshake. We were right.

We had the bottom cleaned (Rodney...highly recommended!!! Happy to provide his info!).

On August 30th Captain Bill with BoatUS towed her to Xynides boat yard for a haul out, bottom job, and planned splash so the seller's mechanic could meet us to go over the Perkins 4-108 (I've only had Yanmars).

Nicky and Ellen at the yard took good care of us and we left our new home at the transient dock.

We called BoatUS to obtain insurance for which we earlier received a quote, and confirmed that they wanted a survey.

Great and caring surveyor, Bob with RJE Marine Services, knew we were pressed for time and scheduled, performed, and completed a report for an insurance survey.

What a string of luck we were having with great people!!!

Called BoatUS to provide the survey and get coverage (by then, Irma screamed that she was on the way so we had to escalate getting covered to a BoatUS VP. It was a bit of a PITA, even though we understood the business decision, but they came through justifying our faith in them!).

We went to Tampa to secure our home, spent a night in a shelter to ride the storm out, cleaned up the house, and called Nick to check on when we could splash.

Ready for it? One (ONE!!!) boat in their yard was knocked off her stands. Any guess which one?

We won a lottery we didn't even want to play.

Called BoatUS today, they committed to having an adjuster call us tomorrow.

So, FINALLY, my questions...

1. What damages should we expect/look for resulting from such a fall?

2. Are there "below the surface injuries" that may not be immediately apparent?

3. What should we expect from the claims process?

4. How soon, especially given this relatively minor problem (compared to the devastation other people endured/are enduring from Irma) would one reasonably expect to pass before setting sail around Florida and/or via Okeechobee? i.e., when will ICW/coastal routes be safely navigable?

5. Are there stresses to the rigging, etc., an adjustor may ignore or discount?

Thank you in advance for any wisdom you pass along, including answering questions I don't even know to ask.

Fair Winds,

Eric and Christine
DenverSailors@gmail.com
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Old 11-09-2017, 21:13   #2
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Re: Irma Knocked Our Dream Off Stands a Week After Purchase

Hard to know without some photos. Lots of questions.. was it knocked off by wind or flooding? Did mast/rigging hit things on the way over? Did it fall against another boat or tree or anything to break the fall? With balsa cored hull there could be an issue with that where it struck, cracked or where the stands may have punched the hull in the fall. But I have seen a boat fall of its stands that lived to sail again no problemo (after a lot of work and glass and resin.) If damage is down low, below the balsa coring, that's better of course. I really don't know about the construction of the Gulfstars so I am just shooting in the dark here, but I feel for you and I hope the scrapes are all cosmetic.
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Old 12-09-2017, 07:01   #3
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Re: Irma Knocked Our Dream Off Stands a Week After Purchase

the boat, a union 36, next to me fell off stands in newton.
you will need to check out the hull to deck connection for integrity.
you willl need to check bulkheads and tabs for integrity.
your caprail may be damaged
check hulll for eggshelling
check deck for cracking
if deck stepped mast check step and rig. keel stepped check partners and step.
check motor mounts and engine alignment
that is a start.
neighbor sailed his union 36 to mazatlan from guaymas as he was not going to spend another cane season in uncertainty. hahahahaha. from pot to flame. at least we have mexican high deflecting the canes to cabo.

this is where knowing a GOOD surveyor can help you.
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Old 12-09-2017, 07:23   #4
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Re: Irma Knocked Our Dream Off Stands a Week After Purchase

Reality is, given the questions you're asking, along with the situation. Hire a GOOD surveyor on your own dime, including setting a fee with him in advance to spend some extra time with you. Both going over the boat in detail, & answering your questions. And if you can also scare up a neighbor who's a boat guru, both before & after the survey (or adjuster visit), so much the better. You might be advised to have a detailed, professional, rigging survey done as well.


Sorry to hear about this.
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Old 12-09-2017, 07:45   #5
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Re: Irma Knocked Our Dream Off Stands a Week After Purchase

My previous boat, a Sabre 38 MKII was knocked off her stands. Didn't touch another boat.

Bent mast. Entire interior torn free from the hull including bulkheads. Three foot tear at the hull/deck joint. Tear (I mean tear) from the to rail down below the waterline. Delamination for about 5 feet either side of that tear. Keel sump damage and delamination.

Insurance bought the wreck. A boatyard bought her as salvage and repaired her in the off season. three of four men for three o four months. She is sailing again.

If the insurance company does not total her right off the bat, you need a good surveyor on your side. If the insurance company totals her and offers her to you for salvage value, you need a good surveyor before you buy the wreck.

I'm sorry to be so harsh, but you need to look at the business side. If you choose to spend more money than your business head says it is worth, that's OK, just know you are doing it.

Best of luck
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Old 12-09-2017, 08:01   #6
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Re: Irma Knocked Our Dream Off Stands a Week After Purchase

Sorry to hear about your boat's fall.

As others have already provided good advice, I don't have much more to say.

The suggestion that you get your own surveyor to do another survey is a good one.

Here is my view: IF the same surveyor (the one who did the purchase survey) is used, he may be willing to give you a break in cost, as he is now very familiar with the boat. But, more importantly, since the survey he did was recent, he should be able to notice changes in the boat, especially IF he took lots of photos during his first survey work. I would call him ASAP and negotiate a "Fall Special" second survey from him. Making sure that he makes clear if he sees changes in the boat. His "before and after" documentation may be key.
________

I am an optimist.
So, if the boat does show no significant damage, you can have more confidence in her ability to take a hard knock.

Hope for the best.

Good luck!
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Old 12-09-2017, 08:09   #7
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Re: Irma Knocked Our Dream Off Stands a Week After Purchase

You are lucky that the insurance company bound coverage quickly and you were apparently covered for the loss.
Imagine in they had dragged their feet and waited until after the storm passed.
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Old 12-09-2017, 08:10   #8
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Re: Irma Knocked Our Dream Off Stands a Week After Purchase

I am a fresh water sailor so no experience with this issue. Does insurance actually cover this at all? I've been led to believe that, inside the hurricane box, isn't usually covered during this time of year.
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Old 12-09-2017, 08:11   #9
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Re: Irma Knocked Our Dream Off Stands a Week After Purchase

Someone needs to keep a record of the insurance companies that pay quickly and fairly, and those who do not.
This could be an opportunity to filter for companies worth dealing with in future.
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Old 12-09-2017, 08:21   #10
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Re: Irma Knocked Our Dream Off Stands a Week After Purchase

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Originally Posted by taxwizz View Post
Someone needs to keep a record of the insurance companies that pay quickly and fairly, and those who do not.
This could be an opportunity to filter for companies worth dealing with in future.
How about that "someone" be you? You're hired. Please report back with what you find out.
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Old 12-09-2017, 08:24   #11
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Re: Irma Knocked Our Dream Off Stands a Week After Purchase

A mentioned pics would be good. But If I were you, I would ask the surveyor to check out the boat prior to accepting anything from the insurance company. It could be well worth another few hundred $. I would look closely at all things bonded to the hull, hidden things:
-Engine bed to hull
-Furniture to hull (galley cabinetry, bulkheads, other cabinets, closets etc)
-Rudder, rudder post etc.
-Hull to deck joint.
-Do doors open and close properly?
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Old 12-09-2017, 08:27   #12
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Re: Irma Knocked Our Dream Off Stands a Week After Purchase

I'm sorry for my incomplete reply before.
When my boat was totaled four years ago I was deeply upset. I am sad for you.

I used the event to re-evaluate what kind of boat I wanted.
Two years later I bought a boat that is beyond anything I had ever aspired to own.

Use this distressing event as an opportunity once the dismay passes.

Best wishes
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Old 12-09-2017, 08:27   #13
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Re: Irma Knocked Our Dream Off Stands a Week After Purchase

What a conundrum. The surveyor you first used is like your best bet. I wouldn't count on a fall discount or any discount with what he is likely facing over the next while. He will get full bang an anything he looks at. Having said that, he also may have to look at many vessels a day with underwriters breathing down his neck for results and reports, and may have to skim over some. What you are looking for is an in depth and comprehensive hull, integrity and rigging assessment. Best of luck, sad to see the carnage that has happened to you and others, such a lousy ending to some boat's lives.
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Old 12-09-2017, 08:27   #14
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Re: Irma Knocked Our Dream Off Stands a Week After Purchase

So sorry to hear about your loss.
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Old 12-09-2017, 08:32   #15
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Re: Irma Knocked Our Dream Off Stands a Week After Purchase

Quote:
Originally Posted by CruiseEasy View Post
I am a fresh water sailor so no experience with this issue. Does insurance actually cover this at all? I've been led to believe that, inside the hurricane box, isn't usually covered during this time of year.
Generally, you can get coverage for almost anything, anywhere, if you're willing to pay the price. Boats kept in the well established hurricane zones during the hurricane season simply pay much higher premiums
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