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Old 10-12-2014, 16:47   #61
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Re: Hunter 356 Bluewater Capable?

The OP point of departure is Delaware, so i guess is going to found the true before he reach Panama..

My point? is doable, with care with the weather and some skills its posible,, i mean its a 35 footer, if is in sound and good condition and fitted for offshore passages , why not?

My only advice could be , dont put your boat and your crew in the wrong spot in bad conditions, those long lee shores are a trap, i dont have personal experience with that piece of Mexi Coast, but it happen to me sailing along the Morocco coast with a strong Levante, local wind.. no way to reach shelter because there is no shelter , far away and with the only option to gain sea room and leave the coast as soon as posible...

Cheers.
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Old 10-12-2014, 17:48   #62
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Re: Hunter 356 Bluewater Capable?

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Originally Posted by Dockhead View Post
You guys should all relax. This is an endless and ultimately stupid argument.

Naturally you will much prefer to be in Kenomac's million dollar plus heavyweight Oyster. Much prefer! In a storm, than in a Hunter. It's much stronger and much more seaworthy and much easier to deal with in a blow. Incomparably more so. Ken is right so far. Of course -- if you can afford it, and you are setting out on long distance blue water adventures, by all means, buy a big Oyster. The key words, however, are "if you can afford it".

But you WILL NOT DIE in your Hunter, either, with reasonable seamanship and preparation. It will just be somewhat harder, less comfortable, and somewhat riskier -- all things only you can decide whether or not to accept.

Ken is also right about that rocky, 2000 mile long lee shore between Panama and San Francisco. But guess what? You don't want to be in Ken's Oyster there, either! The difference is only the degree of misery

Peace, my brothers!
+1 Again, not a question of whether you "can" do it in the Hunter, but rather would you "want to." It also supports the trend in this extreme buyer's market of those not able to afford the Oyster to buy an older well-respected brand that was specifically designed for the OP's desired journey. But check the rudder . . . .
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Old 10-12-2014, 18:12   #63
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Re: Hunter 356 Bluewater Capable?

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Originally Posted by neilpride View Post
The OP point of departure is Delaware, so i guess is going to found the true before he reach Panama..
Zactly...
Spring 2010. Notice that you rarely see video when the storm actually hits? Videoing seems to be not so important at those times.

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Old 10-12-2014, 18:21   #64
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Re: Hunter 356 Bluewater Capable?

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Zactly...
Spring 2010. Notice that you rarely see video when the storm actually hits? Videoing seems to be not so important at those times.

About what storm are you talking about? what has the video to do with that?or is that a storm on the East coast?
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Old 10-12-2014, 18:52   #65
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Re: Hunter 356 Bluewater Capable?

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About what storm are you talking about? what has the video to do with that?or is that a storm on the East coast?
That was during our crossing from the Windward Passage heading to Panama. What do you think the OP has to deal with before even seeing the Pacific? Not uncommon to see 50 knots during these squalls. I'm just letting the OP know to expect some "sporty" conditions on the Caribbean. To me, this isn't about Hunters, but more about sailing experience. The OP really hasn't mentioned anything about that, and after reading his 42 posts, there isn't much talk of his sailing experiences. Maybe he's got plenty of miles offshore, who knows?

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Old 10-12-2014, 20:42   #66
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Re: Hunter 356 Bluewater Capable?

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Thanks for the reality check.

+1. Some people should only speak of which they know.
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Old 11-12-2014, 07:29   #67
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Re: Hunter 356 Bluewater Capable?

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Naturally you will much prefer to be in Kenomac's million dollar plus heavyweight Oyster. Much prefer! In a storm, than in a Hunter. It's much stronger and much more seaworthy and much easier to deal with in a blow. Incomparably more so. Ken is right so far. Of course -- if you can afford it, and you are setting out on long distance blue water adventures, by all means, buy a big Oyster. The key words, however, are "if you can afford it".
I see this kind of assumption a lot. And there is some truth to it for sure if you're only comparing it to a small Hunter "in a storm".

BUT, all told, there's honestly no way I would prefer Keno's Oyster over a modern production boat, including a Hunter. And I actually mean that.

Not my kind of boat.
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Old 11-12-2014, 08:24   #68
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Re: Hunter 356 Bluewater Capable?

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I see this kind of assumption a lot. And there is some truth to it for sure if you're only comparing it to a small Hunter "in a storm".

BUT, all told, there's honestly no way I would prefer Keno's Oyster over a modern production boat, including a Hunter. And I actually mean that.

Not my kind of boat.
Well, I agree, but with the value of that boat (at least new) it would be possible to buy a better boat that you possibly like...and I would find odd if it was a Hunter. I say Hunter like I could say Bavaria or Oceanis. They are great in what regards what they offer for the price but if you have the money and are not interested in buying the bigger boat that money could buy, there are better offers in what regards quality in smaller production manufacturers, for instance X yachts, Solaris, Grand Soleil, Italia yachts, Allures just to name a few.

Of course i am not talking in what regards quality/price. In what regards that mass production manufacturers are unbeatable and that why they mass manufacture boats: they sell a lot. Sailors are not always rich enough and generally buy the best quality/price product.
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Old 11-12-2014, 09:06   #69
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Re: Hunter 356 Bluewater Capable?

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Well, I agree, but with the value of that boat (at least new) it would be possible to buy a better boat that you possibly like...and I would find odd if it was a Hunter. I say Hunter like I could say Bavaria or Oceanis. They are great in what regards what they offer for the price but if you have the money and are not interested in buying the bigger boat that money could buy, there are better offers in what regards quality in smaller production manufacturers, for instance X yachts, Solaris, Grand Soleil, Italia yachts, Allures just to name a few.

Of course i am not talking in what regards quality/price. In what regards that mass production manufacturers are unbeatable and that why they mass manufacture boats: they sell a lot. Sailors are not always rich enough and generally buy the best quality/price product.
That's a good point. First, though I could swing it with financing, there is no way I'd put $1M of my money into a sailboat. I sail for fun. And that defines the calculus of how much money I want to put into it (i.e. - only disposable income). I don't want to live aboard full-time, therefore, I don't look at the purchase of a boat through the lens of the "value of a home". Again, for me, it's all about disposable income - cash.

We all have different math on these things - but that's mine.

Therefore, even buying new right now, I would be in the BeneJeneHunterLina range of yachts. I might able to stretch to an X-Yacht (which I like) - but based on what I see out there right now, I would probably end up with something like the Jeanneau 44 DS. Actually, truth be told, I'd likely end up with a performance cruising cat. But, I'm not ready to dump that much cash into a boat right now. Maybe someday. I'm not old yet.

My point above is, there is no way I'd ever end up with an Oyster. That assumption just isn't right. First, they are just not my kind of boat. Second, way too much money. And third, I'll never buy a boat JUST to "feel safe in a storm". That's what bunkers are for. I buy boats to have fun sailing them.
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Old 11-12-2014, 11:58   #70
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Re: Hunter 356 Bluewater Capable?

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That's a good point. First, though I could swing it with financing, there is no way I'd put $1M of my money into a sailboat. I sail for fun. And that defines the calculus of how much money I want to put into it (i.e. - only disposable income). I don't want to live aboard full-time, therefore, I don't look at the purchase of a boat through the lens of the "value of a home". Again, for me, it's all about disposable income - cash.

We all have different math on these things - but that's mine.

Therefore, even buying new right now, I would be in the BeneJeneHunterLina range of yachts. I might able to stretch to an X-Yacht (which I like) - but based on what I see out there right now, I would probably end up with something like the Jeanneau 44 DS. Actually, truth be told, I'd likely end up with a performance cruising cat. But, I'm not ready to dump that much cash into a boat right now. Maybe someday. I'm not old yet.

My point above is, there is no way I'd ever end up with an Oyster. That assumption just isn't right. First, they are just not my kind of boat. Second, way too much money. And third, I'll never buy a boat JUST to "feel safe in a storm". That's what bunkers are for. I buy boats to have fun sailing them.
I would never argue your point about not wanting an Oyster or any other particular type or brand of boat, but you do realize that there are boats out there these days that you could afford, that would be as fun to sail as your Hunter, and might provide you more security during a storm? Speaking of, exactly how many "storms" have you sailed through?
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Old 11-12-2014, 12:11   #71
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Re: Hunter 356 Bluewater Capable?

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I would never argue your point about not wanting an Oyster or any other particular type or brand of boat, but you do realize that there are boats out there these days that you could afford, that would be as fun to sail as your Hunter, and might provide you more security during a storm? Speaking of, exactly how many "storms" have you sailed through?
Good. There are lots of boats out there. And I bought the exact one I wanted.

Though I've been in some challenging conditions in my various off-shore races and deliveries, I try very hard to avoid actual storms. I've done pretty well thus far.

Hal Roth seems to have it just right.
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Old 11-12-2014, 12:22   #72
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Re: Hunter 356 Bluewater Capable?

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...

Therefore, even buying new right now, I would be in the BeneJeneHunterLina range of yachts. I might able to stretch to an X-Yacht (which I like) - but based on what I see out there right now, I would probably end up with something like the Jeanneau 44 DS. ...

My point above is, there is no way I'd ever end up with an Oyster. That assumption just isn't right. First, they are just not my kind of boat. Second, way too much money. And third, I'll never buy a boat JUST to "feel safe in a storm". That's what bunkers are for. I buy boats to have fun sailing them.
OK, I get you but between a X yachat and a Jeanneau 44DS goes a long distance in quality and type of boat.

I would say that someone that was interested on a Xyacht but had no money for it, would buy the poor's men correspondent that is the Salona, on this case the 44. Lots of common things in what regards building and type of boat. That's not by accident that Salona sells a lot on the North of Europe and those are difficult and demanding clients.

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Old 11-12-2014, 12:26   #73
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Re: Hunter 356 Bluewater Capable?

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I've also noticed on your thread, that most of the Hunter owner folks offering you encouragement.... haven't done ANY offshore cruising themselves. Most are just dreamers and cheerleaders.

For most of your planned voyage, your boat will be just fine, but when you start saying that you also plan to cross the Pacific and/or head north along the Mexican coastline etc., you need to take a much closer look at the boat and it's capabilities.
I just checked back on this thread... What are some of you talking about??

I thought this was supposed to be a thread where the owner of a Hunter 356 was asking for advice from another Hunter owner about the seaworthiness of his vessel related to crossing oceans and heading up the coast of Mexico? Which is what I think I offered him as one who's actually owned a Hunter and sailed along the West coast. My points were made towards tankage and the ability of his Hunter to head back into a strong headwind and current along a lee shore and possibly encounter foul weather at some point.... nothing more.


Why is it, that every time the word Hunter is mentioned on a legitimate thread, two or three Hunter fanboys feel the need to change the subject, then dominate the discussion? It gets really..... tiresome.
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Old 11-12-2014, 12:39   #74
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Re: Hunter 356 Bluewater Capable?

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.......................
Therefore, even buying new right now, I would be in the BeneJeneHunterLina range of yachts. I might able to stretch to an X-Yacht (which I like) - but based on what I see out there right now, I would probably end up with something like the Jeanneau 44 DS. Actually, truth be told, I'd likely end up with a performance cruising cat. But, I'm not ready to dump that much cash into a boat right now. Maybe someday. I'm not old yet......
I've sailed the Jeanneau 44DS. In coastal conditions.

It had a LOT of nice features, and of course I liked it. One thing it had that caused more then a few minutes of concern was furling main. It got stuck as the wind picked up, and we had about 10 minutes of 'fun' getting it unstuck before we could reef in. I was at the helm at the time, and was contemplating what the heck that would be like if one was in a situation where it was a lee shore, the wind was higher, and it could not get unstuck.

But I certainly can see its appeal, and for many, it would be a great boat.
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Old 11-12-2014, 12:51   #75
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Re: Hunter 356 Bluewater Capable?

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I've sailed the Jeanneau 44DS. In coastal conditions.

It had a LOT of nice features, and of course I liked it. One thing it had that caused more then a few minutes of concern was furling main. It got stuck as the wind picked up, and we had about 10 minutes of 'fun' getting it unstuck before we could reef in. I was at the helm at the time, and was contemplating what the heck that would be like if one was in a situation where it was a lee shore, the wind was higher, and it could not get unstuck.

But I certainly can see its appeal, and for many, it would be a great boat.
The boat can have a furling main or an automatic reefing system as an option with a traditional sail as almost all mass production boats. It is not even more expensive with that option.
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