Using Spot instead of Epirb

[CarlF]

I also carry an InrRach whenever I'm offshore for the reasons already covered. It's my goto communication system for distress situations after VHF. Besides better water resistance to the SPOt it uses the far superior Iridium satellite network.

Face it, the EPIRB was a wonderful invention but it's 50 year old technology - before GPS, email, messaging, and the internet. It's based on a complex doppler system that takes 20 minutes to get a fix (even if it's a new EPIRB with GPS onboard).

Over 99% of EPIRB activations are false alarms so the CG can spend several hours making phone calls to names in the database to verify the signal before launching a rescue. With the InReach, the distress can be immediately verified by texting back along with the nature of the distress (medical, fire, leak). This lets SAR launch a rescue quicker -- and with the right assets.

Battery isn't a worry as mine is always on and plugged into the charger at the nav station (although the battery lasts 4 days). My family know they can reach me at any time - a huge worry reducer. My InReach also receives and transmits fine from inside through the fiberglass overhead.

Far too much is made about being "in the water". Virtually all distress beacons are activated before the boat sinks. Once SAR has a single lat/lon they can calculate the drift of someone in the water using sophisticated models.

And with the InReach, I don't have to declare a MayDay to tell SAR I'm in a tough situation. The InReach emergency center will initiate a contact schedule and inform SAR of my situation without triggering a full on rescue.

I do carry two PLB's as backup to the InReach. Why not an EPIRB? Unlike commercial vessels who carry their EPIRBS outside to float free, virtually all pleasure boats carry them inside the cabin where they are useless unless someone takes it outside. I can wear the tiny Ocean Signal RescueMe PLB on a lanyard around my neck - so it's going over the side with me.

When the Tiki Rafiki's keel came off two years ago killing all four professional crew - the EPIRB never activated as it was in its bracket in the overturned boat. But two of the crews' PLB signals were received --presumably from them in the water beside the overturned boat. Tragically, in the cold water off Nova Scotia they didn't have a chance.

I also now carry an AIS man-overboard beacon. If I'm abandoning ship, I'm activating it too.

[requiem]

Originally Posted by Capt. Ray

WRONG. I have tested the inReach while swimming for fun. I was able to happily send and receive messages.

I don't doubt this is the case, particularly if you're able to hold it out of the water. What I'd like to know is how well it does once you've lost the use of your hands, which can happen rather soon in cold water (and long before you succumb to hypothermia).

A PLB like the OceanSignal Ocean Signal RescueMe or ACR's ResQLink has a plain metal ribbon antenna, and the manuals note that it must be held clear of the water. Perhaps the inReach functions better when floating, as the antenna is encased in the device? I suppose in either case you could have it fastened to your PFD to be held above the water.

[Group9]

Everybody has their own comfort level with rescue communication. When we go out, we have
1. EPIRB
2. SPOT
3. Iridium Satphone

If all three fail, I guess it just wasn’t our day.

[kmacdonald]

Originally Posted by Group9

Everybody has their own comfort level with rescue communication. When we go out, we have
1. EPIRB
2. SPOT
3. Iridium Satphone

If all three fail, I guess it just wasn’t our day.

If you need any of them it's not your day.

[Wotname]

Originally Posted by Capt. Ray

Sigh all you like. After more miles under the keel in three years than most people sail in their lives and multiple yachts I've tested these units daily and they have been flawless. You never know if an EPIRB is working until you're rescued. Personally I don't trust something I cannot test regularly.

...........

Surely you are aware that you can test an EPIRB regularly.

[davil]

Originally Posted by Group9

Everybody has their own comfort level with rescue communication. When we go out, we have
1. EPIRB
2. SPOT
3. Iridium Satphone

If all three fail, I guess it just wasn’t our day.

=========================================
posted and followed the thread as was undecided if to add a boat mounted EPIRB and after reading all the tech/capabilities of each discussed unit the above quote finally answered my question.
Thank you very much

[zshipley]

I am between boats: last one a Selene 53, next one a Bruckmann 47 on order to be delivered September 2019. I carried, and will carry, an InReach SE and an EPIRB. The last EPIRB was water-activated (and next will be), so it had the advantage of automatic deployment. An InReach, or a SPOT, only works when the operator is present, conscious, and (as one comment observed) able to move his/her fingers--not always true when in distress.

An InReach SE is great, especially if you have an iPhone or Android phone and get the app to control the InReach. Also, you can use it to report problems that are not EPIRB-worthy--say, a mangled prop. Furthermore, an InReach offers automatic tracking; if enabled, it will send your location periodically, as often as every 10 minutes if you choose. Not sure if old SPOT does this. (Never had one). The latest SPOT devices will send text messages. (Don't know about message length, etc., nor auto-sending position.) If your InReach is auto-sending positions, other people with the password you give them can track you on the InReach (now Garmin-owned) website. Even if you are not of the younger generation's here-I-am-now mindset, this can be useful--say, when other people are waiting for you at a rendezvous.

As many have said in other posts, the InReach must be kept charged, and I wouldn't trust its water-proof-ness, especially in salt water. It has a socket for a USB micro connector, for charging; there's a rubber cover, but not one I'd bet my life on.

To send/receive, the InReach has to "see" the satellite, although it will work through a canvas cover or Bimini top. So, if you want automatic position reporting, the InReach is best plugged in where it can see the sky. That said, I positioned mine under a Bimini top on the flybridge, not charging, and only had to recharge it every couple of days. Recharging took a few hours.

A key difference in technology between an EPIRB and an InReach (and maybe the new SPOT X messenger) is that, because an EPIRB is a transmit-only device, it doesn't sense whether there is a satellite in view, but transmits continuously (actually, periodically). Because an InReach has a receiver, it knows when it is in touch with a satellite, and it holds messages to be sent (even if it's only an automatic position update, I believe), and sends the message(s) when a satellite comes into view. This feature of the InReach means that you can position it where it has only a partial view of the sky, and it will wait to send messages until an Iridium satellite moves within the "view" of the InReach. The delay until transmission will be longer if the window of sky that the InReach can see is limited, but when mine was in a place in the forward port corner of the Pilothouse, where it could only "see" thru only the forward and port-side windows, messages seemed to be sent within 20 minutes or so.

[rbrake]

Spot is a toy. Talk to your insurance company about their preference.

[rsn48]

First, I wasn't clear about Spot usage in my original post. It will only be used locally, around the "inside passage" of BC. So coverage is a non-issue. If I was sailing in many parts of the world, I wouldn't rely on Spot.

Even the old Spot could relay your position on a map. The cheaper service fee meant you had to input the location manually (push a button), the more expensive service would relay your position every ten minutes, for 24 hours, at which point you had to push another button to begin the 24 hours relay again. We used this feature frequently when following Army reservists on the Yukon River. We not only had the course they were on available, but we could make educated guesses as to when they would arrive at a location. We were even able to locate one group once via satillite radio, informing them they were off course on a mountain hike.

We would have ten spots with ten different groups and could follow all of them easily from our operations shack. The spots were used on the Yukon river and kept in waterproof kayak mini packs.

With the basic Spot you can send an "I'm okay" message, a "call me" message, and a "mayday" call out. The one negative with Spots in my opinion is it is too easy to activate the Mayday button. One Officer wanted to go on a hike up a mountain on her own, we would only let her go if she carried a Spot. When she got back, she took her day pack off and threw it in the corner of her bedroom. Ten minutes latter we received a call from the local RCMP questioning her condition. When throwing her pack, some how the button was activated.

Once the panic button has been activated, response times have been good. We had one incident were an aircraft rescue was required in a broken femur scenario, Spot response was rapid after the panic button was deployed allowing us to get an aircraft to evacuate the young man. This was carried using only a basic Spot.

[Group9]

Originally Posted by rbrake

Spot is a toy. Talk to your insurance company about their preference.

Just out of curiosity, are you aware of any case where someone activated the SOS feature on a SPOT and wasn’t rescued? One of my best friend’s son is a world class mountain climber who relies on a SPOT when climbing. It’s different from the EPIRB system and uses a different satellite system, but why why is it a toy?

[CaptTom]

Am I recalling correctly that the original Spot technology relied on cell coverage, not satellite? I just want to point this out since the OP mentioned an older unit. Obviously a waterproof case for your cell phone would be far preferable to those older Spots.

For me, the two-way capability of InReach (and some newer competitors) is the selling point.

[Snore]

Originally Posted by Group9

Just out of curiosity, are you aware of any case where someone activated the SOS feature on a SPOT and wasn’t rescued? One of my best friend’s son is a world class mountain climber who relies on a SPOT when climbing. It’s different from the EPIRB system and uses a different satellite system, but why why is it a toy?

I have had a SPOT die on me during a 1500 mile kayak race. That is not the only failure. Feel free to email me


Your best friends son should move to an inReach!!

[westcoastliving]

Hi,

I have some experience using the SPOT.
Used it for 2.5 months while roadtripping all over the islands, BC, the Rockies, etc last summer. Worked like a charm EXCEPT one night it was stormy, pouring rain and no cell service, so I stuck it just out the window to send a “check-in” message and it showed it had sent... a couple days later I find out my parents have been mildly panicking because they never received a message..

Fast forward to last fall and a friend took it all over Southeast Asia for a few months, it only worked about half the time. The SPOT coverage map shows good coverage in the areas she was in and she always followed instructions to the letter. SPOT customer service was less than helpful.

When it works it works great BUT because it’s failed to work, even just once, it kind of lost that trust factor for me, because then there is always the question of will it fail when I most need it??

Also the subscription is kind of a pain, let’s say you only need it for a 3 day sailing trip ever 3 months, you have to pay for the whole year.

I would definitely go with an EPIRB!

[Group9]

I guess I'm just lucky. I've never had any problems with my SPOT or Iridium sat-phone since I bought them both in 2010. Since I've never sunk a boat, I really don't know if my EPIRB works or not.

[belizesailor]

Originally Posted by Group9

Just out of curiosity, are you aware of any case where someone activated the SOS feature on a SPOT and wasn’t rescued? One of my best friend’s son is a world class mountain climber who relies on a SPOT when climbing. It’s different from the EPIRB system and uses a different satellite system, but why why is it a toy?

Yes, at least one case here in the W Carib.

Ive also has many non-emergency messages fail via Spot in areas where they claimed to have coverage, but in fact did not.