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Bash · 14-11-2012, 11:38

Radar is the only thing on your list that I consider mandatory. Much more essential than AIS.

propellanttech · 14-11-2012, 12:19

I appreciate everyone's opinions so far, keep them coming.

I guess I'm going to do Radar with a aft pole or arch, depending on the specific boat I find. I just can't bring myself to drilling holes in a mast. If the boat already has holes, they may be utilized to facilitate the existing radar, or possibly an upgrade (depends on unit age).

I have considered the HAM/SSB receiver issue, and the jury is still out on that. I really need more information about specific of use, equipment, etc.

The AIS maybe a future item, but is not going on the required list at this present time.

It's remarkable the list of materials to do a outfitting of a cruising boat. The boat itself is really the minor part. Most important for sea worthy, but least important due to other items really necessary to be considered safe.

I haven't even decided on a model of dingy yet. Or outboard.

Oh well....it will all come together after the magical acquirement of the vessel I guess.

James L

landonshaw · 14-11-2012, 12:27

I have found that radar is not essential in the Caribbean. Been here 5 years and would like it, but for me it is optional. No fog so visibility is good. We do some night sailing to skip around islands, but mostly day sails. At night we keep a good look out.
I love my auto pilot. Have 2 used ones on the boat so if one fails, switch to the other. Not a necessity though.
GPS hooked up to my computer charts. Great to see a town and know exactly which one it is. Sailed a few years with only paper charts and that was no problem though. I would have the computer as not a necessity, but a nice convenience. Definitely buy a hand held GPS with current charts. Coming in to shore it is an added set of eyes. Especially at night.
I would add a 2 million watt lamp on an extension cord that will reach the bow hooked directly to your battery bank. That has helped me on many occasions to miss nets lying across a bay while coming in at night.

**Jim Cate** · 14-11-2012, 12:31

G'Day James,

Don't get obsessive about drilling holes in an aluminium mast, for it is less damaging than one thinks intuitively. You might have a word with a rigger or better, a naval architect about these matters just to reduce anxiety.

At any rate, if you look about you will see thousands of boats with mast-mounted radars, and very few whose masts have failed at that position.

From personal experience, having the radar on the mast offers better performance than a pole or arch mount. Further, if you are considering solar panels on the putative arch, it is hard to organize a radar that both has a clear horizon and does not shade the panels at times.

Cheers,

Jim

propellanttech · 14-11-2012, 12:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim Cate

G'Day James,

Don't get obsessive about drilling holes in an aluminium mast, for it is less damaging than one thinks intuitively. You might have a word with a rigger or better, a naval architect about these matters just to reduce anxiety.

At any rate, if you look about you will see thousands of boats with mast-mounted radars, and very few whose masts have failed at that position.

From personal experience, having the radar on the mast offers better performance than a pole or arch mount. Further, if you are considering solar panels on the putative arch, it is hard to organize a radar that both has a clear horizon and does not shade the panels at times.

Cheers,

Jim

Jim,

The boat I'm looking for has a free standing mast, which isn't necessarily very conducive to having holes in the mast. The holes would be a point to which a crack could form, causing the mast to fail at that point. It would be much more critical in the free standing mast situation. There are ways to overcome the possibility of a running crack, but it's not my idea to tempt fate.

There is no doubt that a mast mounted radome has much better performance.

If I'm not able to purchase my boat of choice, a mast mounted radar is not a problem. The stays of a normal mast are more than adequate, and usually take most of the working load anyhow(if in good shape, and tuned correctly).

I know someone is going to point out the detriments to the freestanding mast. Please don't, I've already done the research.

This current conversation is based on my ability to find my boat of choice.

James L

sailorboy1 · 14-11-2012, 12:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cheechako

I guess I forgot about your real question; All those you mention are just optional, especially for doing the Caribbean.

I agree that they are really are all optional items. people have been sailing longer than any of that stuff!

Now I'll all for these toys and have my share. But it really is up to you to decide which are worth buying for peace of mind.

But I would think that other than nav stuff in the Caribbean you can easily do without radar, AIS, SSB. All you need to know is where you are and where you want to go (GPS chartpotter) and how deep the water is (depth gage).

sailorboy1 · 14-11-2012, 12:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cheechako

Paper charts and a GPS. forget the sex thing....

I sure hope you met to say sextant! Otherwise some of us have way different needs!

**Hudson Force** · 14-11-2012, 13:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by propellanttech

........................I know someone is going to point out the detriments to the freestanding mast. Please don't, I've already done the research...................James L

'must have been easy research. I don't think they've put stays on airplane wings since the thirties!

propellanttech · 14-11-2012, 13:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Don Lucas

I sure hope you met to say sextant! Otherwise some of us have way different needs!

I was going to say something, but I figured one of you "saltys" would have some comment that was much better.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Don Lucas

I agree that they are really are all optional items. people have been sailing longer than any of that stuff!

Now I'll all for these toys and have my share. But it really is up to you to decide which are worth buying for peace of mind.

But I would think that other than nav stuff in the Caribbean you can easily do without radar, AIS, SSB. All you need to know is where you are and where you want to go (GPS chartpotter) and how deep the water is (depth gage).

Everything you say is true. But since I have limited off shore experience, I want to have some base line to start. I will of course weigh the situation with my own judgement, but as with any new, I like to have some kind of starting point information.

James L

landonshaw · 14-11-2012, 13:12

oh yes, a depth gauge. don't leave home without it!!

propellanttech · 14-11-2012, 13:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaptForce

'must have been easy research. I don't think they've put stays on airplane wings since the thirties!

Actually, I didn't use aircraft research, due to the structural differences.

I did find however, that all of the failures that I found (on this particular model), were due to forces that a regular mast probably wouldn't have survived either (severe weather knockdowns, hurricane, tornado, etc.)

James L

propellanttech · 14-11-2012, 13:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by landonshaw

oh yes, a depth gauge. don't leave home without it!!

That is almost required more than clothing on my vessel.

A depth gauge will be on the must have necessity list.

James L

**Jim Cate** · 14-11-2012, 13:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by propellanttech

Jim,

The boat I'm looking for has a free standing mast, which isn't necessarily very conducive to having holes in the mast. The holes would be a point to which a crack could form, causing the mast to fail at that point. It would be much more critical in the free standing mast situation. There are ways to overcome the possibility of a running crack, but it's not my idea to tempt fate.

There is no doubt that a mast mounted radome has much better performance.

If I'm not able to purchase my boat of choice, a mast mounted radar is not a problem. The stays of a normal mast are more than adequate, and usually take most of the working load anyhow(if in good shape, and tuned correctly).

I know someone is going to point out the detriments to the freestanding mast. Please don't, I've already done the research.

This current conversation is based on my ability to find my boat of choice.

James L

Roger that, mate. Didn't know about the free standing choice...

Out of curiosity, carbon, f/g, alloy???

Cheers,

Jim

witzgall · 14-11-2012, 13:25

You won't induce any structural issues drilling holes to mount a radar that I know of. Have you ever heard of an issue with this?

I just mounted one two weeks ago, it really is an easy exercise. Running the cable, however, was a bit more problematic. It was a mast issue, not the cable, as it is Ethernet, thin, and you can cut it without issues.

We mounted it about 9.5 feet from the deck, after much consideration including a consult with the yard rigger. His opinion was that many many boats have the radar mounted too high. This was a BR-24 Simrad scanner.

Chris