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18-10-2008, 09:29
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#16
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Senior Cruiser
Join Date: May 2008
Location: near Annapolis
Boat: PDQ 36 & Atlantic 42
Posts: 1,178
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I'm playing with a fixed mount camera that has enough IR leds to see 300 feet. I plan to display it thru my Garmin Chart plotter. I don't have great hopes for it, but its fun to try. I'll post something if it works on pots.
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18-10-2008, 09:47
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#17
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Senior Cruiser
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: California
Boat: 1980 Endeavour 43 (Ketch)
Posts: 2,457
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Sandy - FLIR ?? - The VP of marketing and sales has his boat next to mine. If you have questions - I can get direct answers. He is doing the same as you with his boat.
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18-10-2008, 10:55
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#18
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Ottawa, ON
Posts: 53
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FLIR
I would recommend FLIR over traditional night vision products if you can afford them. Two models that come to mind are the Navigator and Voyager for marine use. I have no idea their cost, anyone?
Check out the demonstration video at flir.com. Quite something. Anyone know how much these units cost?
Scottie
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18-10-2008, 11:03
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#19
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Ottawa, ON
Posts: 53
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FLIR
Quote:
Originally Posted by S/V Elusive
Sandy - FLIR ?? - The VP of marketing and sales has his boat next to mine. If you have questions - I can get direct answers. He is doing the same as you with his boat.
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S/V Elusive:
I would love to know if this system can reasonably used avoid collisions with floating debris at night or by day; specifically, would you be able to see a floating cargo container at night?
Maybe you can ask him to take you out for a spin at night, come back to us with your experience
Cheers.
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18-10-2008, 11:10
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#20
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2008
Boat: Custom cutter, 42'
Posts: 701
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I'm an engineer working in the infra red night vision industry, specifically for FLIR. A true infrared vision system is very different from the night vision Gen 1-3 stuff. The night vision goggles/scopes etc are light amplification devices. They take whatever light is available and amplify it. So long as there is enough light around, ie it's not too dark of a night, you can see with them.
True infrared sees the heat energy emitted by objects. Everything has some degree of heat, therefore in the infrared world everything is glowing. You don't need ANY other source of light.
Using a light source on a boat, infrared or visible, you're limited to the range and spread of the light. With infrared the whole world lights itself, therefore you can see clearly at much greater ranges.
Another nice thing about infrared is that hotter things really stand out. So a man overboard looks like he's painted in bright flourescent paint against the cold water. You can't miss seeing him. Likewise anything with an engine running will have hot spots that will glow brightly. This is one reason the military likes infrared for targeting.
Infrared is the best. It's not cheap. But the price is coming down fast.
Regards, Paul
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18-10-2008, 11:30
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#21
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Ottawa, ON
Posts: 53
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Thanks Paul.
As an engineer or otherwise, have you been able to experience a FLIR on a sailing or motor vessel yet?
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18-10-2008, 11:49
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#22
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Senior Cruiser
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Thunder Bay, Ontario - 48-29N x 89-20W
Boat: (Cruiser Living On Dirt)
Posts: 49,138
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pauls
I'm an engineer working in the infra red night vision industry ... A true infrared vision system is very different from the night vision Gen 1-3 stuff. The night vision goggles/scopes etc are light amplification devices. They take whatever light is available and amplify it. So long as there is enough light around, ie it's not too dark of a night, you can see with them.
True infrared sees the heat energy emitted by objects. Everything has some degree of heat, therefore in the infrared world everything is glowing. You don't need ANY other source of light ... Paul
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Thanks Paul, about as clear & concise explanation as I've seen.
__________________
Gord May
"If you didn't have the time or money to do it right in the first place, when will you get the time/$ to fix it?"
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18-10-2008, 12:19
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#23
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Philippines in the winters
Boat: It’s in French Polynesia now
Posts: 11,368
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One thing to remember is when using night lights it's best to have a red lens over them so that it doesn't ruin your night vision. The moment a white light light goes on you have lost your night vision for a period of time.
I have two high powered beams that I keep on board, a 1 milloin & a 15 Million candle power. Both I have made up red lens for, just for seeking out anchorages at night. You do have to monitor their temperatures. The lens can get too hot after a while.
Sandy D.,
Let us know how the camera idea turns out. It sounds like a great idea for single handing to me. A water proof container would likely be a necessity and mounted to a power operated swivel to swing P/S for a search pattern would add to it's capabilities. Then patient it! I'm sure the commercial ships/boats already have something out there similar.
Night Vision, Night Vision Optics, Night Vision Goggles, Night Vision Scopes, night vision binoculars
__________________
Faithful are the Wounds of a Friend, but the Kisses of the Enemy are Deceitful! ........
The measure of a man is how he navigates to a proper shore in the midst of a storm!
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18-10-2008, 12:35
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#24
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Philippines in the winters
Boat: It’s in French Polynesia now
Posts: 11,368
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scottie2
I would recommend FLIR over traditional night vision products if you can afford them. Two models that come to mind are the Navigator and Voyager for marine use. I have no idea their cost, anyone?
Check out the demonstration video at flir.com. Quite something. Anyone know how much these units cost?
Scottie
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I want it!!!!! How much?
__________________
Faithful are the Wounds of a Friend, but the Kisses of the Enemy are Deceitful! ........
The measure of a man is how he navigates to a proper shore in the midst of a storm!
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18-10-2008, 19:59
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#25
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Obsfucator, Second Class
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Southeast USA.
Boat: 1982 Sea Ray SRV360
Posts: 1,745
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Quote:
Originally Posted by delmarrey
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The FLIRs I have seen start at about $5,000.
A quick search, here, they are from $5,000-$7,000 (I think the two listed at $67,000 are typos)
-dan
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18-10-2008, 20:39
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#26
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Ottawa, ON
Posts: 53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by delmarrey
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Defender Marine Outfitter has the Navigator version with a fixed mount for $4,000 and pan and tilt model for $8,000.
Not actually quite as much as I would have guessed.
.
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19-10-2008, 12:11
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#27
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: on the boat. Gulf Coast
Boat: C&C 38'
Posts: 351
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Forward Looking Infrared Development
Or Other Uses for FLIR
In the early days of the development of infrared radiation imaging we would test this highly secret technology inside the lab building. We would use the long hallway in the office area where we could get far enough away from the test subject. One day somebody noticed that we could tell which of the secretaries were wearing falsies and which were just naturally endowed. Thick padded brassieres acted as insulators and blocked the long wavelength radiation from their body parts whereas thin lacy ones showed up as hot spots, scientifically speaking! Word soon spread among the secretaries that we “could see through clothes with that equipment.” After a while you could not get a secretary to go make a copy or anything else that meant that they would have to walk down that hall while there were any engineers standing around in a group at one end of the hall!
__________________
Jerry and Denver
Happy Old cruisers!
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21-10-2008, 09:34
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#28
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2008
Boat: Custom cutter, 42'
Posts: 701
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Hi Scottie,
I haven't used FLIR systems on the water yet. My boat is still under construction, probably 2 years out. I've asked the marine products manager to have one of the guys with experience with these units post some info on this site.
Regards, Paul
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21-10-2008, 13:09
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#29
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֍֎֍֎֍֎֍֎֍֎
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 15,136
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Thermal IR systems have apparently dropped tenfold in price in recent years, like so many other tech gizmos. The ones used for home energy audits, to show hot/cold spots in walls and windows, literally dropped from $30,000+ to a tenth of that within the last decade.
OTOH if you want one of the big telephoto gyrostabilized balls from the newscopters...I think that's still gonna cost a bit more.[g]
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21-10-2008, 15:31
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#30
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Eastern Seaboard
Boat: Searunner 34 and Searunner Constant Camber 44
Posts: 949
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Quote:
... We would use the long hallway in the office area where we could get far enough away from the test subject.One day somebody noticed that we could tell which of the secretaries were wearing falsies and which were just naturally endowed. Thick padded brassieres acted as insulators and blocked the long wavelength radiation from their body parts whereas thin lacy ones showed up as hot spots, scientifically speaking!
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That's pretty good.
I've used NVGs from Gen II to Gen IV. One issue I've noticed you get fairly significant headaches from eyestrain.
Your mileage may vary.
__________________
Regards,
Maren
The sea is always beautiful, sometimes mysterious and, on occasions, frighteningly powerful.
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