New GPS issues - does the boat needs to move to in order to get the first fix?

[meirriba]

Nonsense. You do not need to move for a fix. A fix is by definition a report of your position...
You do need to move though for a GPS to report speed or direction of sailing as that is done by the computer of the GPS by comparing two fixes and calxulating resulting direction of move ans resultant speed (using time between the two fixes).

[thomm225]

Originally Posted by ScubaTyke

Interesting assumption with your "limited to no technical experience" there don't you think

I am a tech and when troubleshooting always do the easiest steps first.
In this case, move the boat.

Is it fixed? Stop

If not, continue troubleshooting.

[dfelsent]

Or move the gps antenna.
It’s always possible Garmin is truly odd.
But my gut says it doesn’t seem right.
Communications setup likely.

[skipmac]

Originally Posted by thomm225

So you don't believe the tech you talked to on the phone but do believe a few folks on an internet form with limited to no technical experience?

And now you are thinking the unit might be faulty?

You might want to move the boat before going too much further. Just sayin.....

Based on the incorrect information I've gotten from Garmin tech support I would take advise from CF over Garmin in a New York minute. I would however consider the source of the information on CF and exactly who is offering the advice. Some is better than others.

[thomm225]

Originally Posted by skipmac

Based on the incorrect information I've gotten from Garmin tech support I would take advise from CF over Garmin in a New York minute. I would however consider the source of the information on CF and exactly who is offering the advice. Some is better than others.

The sad thing is he could have already moved the boat in the time it took to post back and forth

My old Garmin GPS showed all types of misinformation before the boat was moved.

Easiest steps first.

Some of us have made our living as techs for many years and repairs are daily or you don't keep your job long

Some would rather sit and discuss for days though without actually taking a single step that could fix the problem even though the step could have been taken while the discussion was going on. I've seen this phenomenon also

I've actually fixed problems back in the day when I was a full time tech while others discussed what they thought might fix it

That's the cool thing about logical troubleshooting. It's not about who agrees with whom, it's not a popularity contest, it's not about who uses the best grammar, it's about what fixes the problem.

[Chuck Hawley]

I will toss something out that is a longshot, but perhaps the following is true:

The Garmin rep interpreted the question as whether the GPS was sending an accurate course and/or speed to other items on the network, as opposed to an accurate fix. I think we'd agree that a stationary GPS received can show some inaccurate SOG and COG readings unless it's underway. If there vessel were underway, it would transmit more reasonable data.

Just a thought.

Happy New Year,

Chuck

[thomm225]

Originally Posted by Chuck Hawley

I will toss something out that is a longshot, but perhaps the following is true:

The Garmin rep interpreted the question as whether the GPS was sending an accurate course and/or speed to other items on the network, as opposed to an accurate fix. I think we'd agree that a stationary GPS received can show some inaccurate SOG and COG readings unless it's underway. If there vessel were underway, it would transmit more reasonable data.

Just a thought.

Happy New Year,

Chuck

Bingo!

The COG and I believe the BRG were both off on my old Garmin GPS before the boat moved but once moving everything was A OK.

Simplest steps first.

Move boat.

Problem fixed? Yes. Stop.

No. Continue troubleshooting

[Jim Cate]

The sad thing is he could have already moved the boat in the time it took to post back and forth

Another sad thing is that some folks respond without reading the question and its ancillary facts first.

The boat is on the hard, and hiring the travel lift to move it might not appeal, even though that is what you think he should do.

And I agree with Chuck's thought, too.

Jim

[Dsanduril]

Originally Posted by sgel

... since I am on the hard it will take me a while until I could test this theory...

Maybe you missed this part of the OP's post? Moving the antenna instead has been suggested a couple of times. And the OP has already stated that it is not just SOG/COG (which would be expected to be nonsensical in this condition) but also position (lat/long) that is showing up empty.

From two different Garmin GPS manuals about getting a first fix:

First Time Fix
The first time you power up your new GPS 17, the receiver must be given an opportunity to collect satellite data and establish its present position. To
ensure proper initialization, the GPS 17 is shipped from the factory in AutoLocate mode, which will allow the receiver to “find itself” anywhere
in the world.
Once the GPS17 is installed and powered on, it will begin to search for satellites.The GPS 17 will output navigation data once it has calculated an initial position fix.

Acquiring GPS Satellite Signals
The device may need a clear view of the sky to acquire satellite signals. The time and date are set automatically based on the GPS position.
1 Turn on the device.
2 Wait while the device locates satellites.
It may take 30 to 60 seconds to acquire satellite signals. When the device acquires satellite signals, [signal bars] appears at the top of the Home screen.
If the device loses satellite signals, [signal bars] disappears and a flashing question mark appears over the chart.

In neither of these manuals does Garmin suggest moving the unit in order to get a fix.

[Cadence]

Originally Posted by Jim Cate

Another sad thing is that some folks respond without reading the question and its ancillary facts first.

The boat is on the hard, and hiring the travel lift to move it might not appeal, even though that is what you think he should do.

And I agree with Chuck's thought, too.

Jim

Jim, I agree with not reading he was on the hard. Now would anyone expect an SOG without the boat moving? I might not expect a chart without a couple of positions.

[Dsanduril]

Originally Posted by sgel

... It doesn't show the location / I don't get a fix.

RIF - The OP is looking for location, not SOG, and location exists whether or not you are moving.

[Cadence]

Originally Posted by Dsanduril

RIF - The OP is looking for location, not SOG, and location exists whether or not you are moving.

I don't think the OP was looking for a SOG, that was someone else. I can see a chart plotter needing more than one location?

[tanglewood]

It would be really helpful to see the actual PGNs being sent from the GPS. Do they include a valid position fix, or not. That would tell you conclusively whether there is a GPS issue, or if the Garmin is just confused over what it's receiving. Maybe the Garmin has some funky thing where it won't accept data from a device and consider it valid until it has seen all of position, SOG, and COG. That's essentially what the Garmin person said, right?

[CarinaPDX]

I think you guys are off on the wrong track - the problem appears to not be the Simrad GPS module, but the Garmin chartplotter. Apparently the chartplotter shows that it sees the GPS on the N2K device list, so it is very unlikely that the GPS is the problem. If we were talking about 0183 then it would be possible that the GPS would be putting out a sentence that the chartplotter wouldn't recognize, but this is N2K and the PGNs are not at all likely to be a problem.

In the chartplotter check that there is a screen that allows the user to select which PGNs to accept from the GPS device. Also check that that device is the selected device for source of position information. It may be that the position input is set to the old Garmin unit and needs to be updated. Chartplotters often have these two abilities: 1) to filter out the inputs, and 2) to select the device for each type of data. I don't know if the Garmin chartplotter has these - my Furuno does - but I would be looking there.

The idea that the location would not be output from a GPS module until it is moved is just nonsense. If it were to happen then it sounds like a Garmin GPS problem, not a Simrad one. It is a distraction: ignore.

Greg

[thomm225]

Originally Posted by sgel

Hi All,
I removed an old 0183 Garmin GPS and connected a new Simrad GS25 GPS to my existing NMEA 2000 network (I have Garmin 5212 chart plotter and two Gramin GMI 10 instruments). Although I can see the new GPS in the device list and on the sky view I can see at least 10 satellites with green bars (in all 3 devices), It doesn't show the location / I don't get a fix.
I called Garmin support, and the guy told me the that I didn't get a fix since I haven't moved yet, and only after ill move the boat it will start updating and ill get the first fix.(he was very confidence). Does it make sense?, since I am on the hard it will take me a while until I could test this theory...
I would appreciate your insights,
Thanks
Sgel

Maybe you should chill out and test the theory once the boat is back in the water then continue with your troubleshooting unless you can think of an urgent need for a GPS while on the hard

Also don't look at your depth finder it might have "failed" also!