Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
  This discussion is proudly sponsored by:
Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about their products on Cruisers Forums. Advertise Here
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 27-04-2019, 04:05   #1
Moderator
 
Dockhead's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Cowes (Winter), Helsinki (Summer); Cruising the Baltic Sea this year!
Boat: Cutter-Rigged Moody 54
Posts: 24,543
Mounting New Wind Instrument

So I have received my new CV7 LJCapteurs wind instrument, and now I'm puzzling a bit how to install it.


The mounting holes are different from those of the legacy Raymarine wand ( ) so new holes will have to be drilled in the top of the mast truck. This will require the driller's getting himself up above the height of the mast truck, which I have decided is a bridge too far for my mast climbing skills, and I've hired someone to do that part.



I can't say I much like the new mounting bracket -- it's fairly thin plastic, not like the nice alu block Raymarine uses. I decided to use 4 No. 8 (4.2mm) self tappers, screwed into 3.5mm holes with Duralac. With washers to spread the load a bit on that plastic. Important not to overtighten those screws.


The bigger puzzle is the cable. One advantage of this device compared to the weather station types of ultrasonic sensors is that they only need a thin four conductor cable; the NMEA2000 adapter ("Windy Plug") can go below. That would be perfect IF the mast were down or if the mast were deck stepped, but it's not and not. I left a spare mouse line up there the last time the mast was out, but I'm not sure I can pull even that thin cable.


So that leaves two backup options:


1. Clip the native cable and connect to the old Raymarine cable, which is 18 years old, but I would expect to have plenty of life left.


2. Clip the native cable and put the Windy Plug at the top of the mast, and connect to the NMEA2000 cable which I used with the WSO100. The Windy Plug is not supposed to be outdoors, but I think I can put it inside the mast, and with some extra weather protection. It looks pretty waterproof as it is, and DeviceNet Micro connections are IP67, and inside the mast I don't think it will get more than the odd splash.




If anyone has been through something similar, I would be grateful for any tips or relevant experience.
__________________

__________________
"Parce que je suis heureux en mer, et peut-ętre pour sauver mon ame. . . "
Dockhead is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27-04-2019, 04:16   #2
Moderator
 
a64pilot's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Albany Ga.
Boat: Island Packet 38
Posts: 25,573
Re: Mounting New Wind Instrument

Just from the mount perspective, you could build yourself an adapter that attaches to the new mount and the other side retains the Raymarine hole pattern.
__________________

a64pilot is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 27-04-2019, 04:29   #3
Moderator
 
Dockhead's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Cowes (Winter), Helsinki (Summer); Cruising the Baltic Sea this year!
Boat: Cutter-Rigged Moody 54
Posts: 24,543
Re: Mounting New Wind Instrument

Quote:
Originally Posted by a64pilot View Post
Just from the mount perspective, you could build yourself an adapter that attaches to the new mount and the other side retains the Raymarine hole pattern.

Yes, I thought about that, but I think that just drilling new holes in the mast truck is simpler. Either way, one must haul oneself up above the top of the mast. You can rig stirrups I guess which you sling over the top, and pull yourself up, but then how do you stabilize yourself from falling backwards? My mast is 23 meters high! Its like the roof of a 7 story building.



I think discretion is the better part of valour here, considering I am still in Cowes with legions of fleet young men who shimmy up masts in a twinkle under their own power, and do whatever is needed to do up there, for a few banknotes. If I were in the middle of the Baltic somewhere it would be a different story, and I guess I'd have to figure out how to get up there and get it done myself.
__________________
"Parce que je suis heureux en mer, et peut-ętre pour sauver mon ame. . . "
Dockhead is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27-04-2019, 05:53   #4
Senior Cruiser
 
skipmac's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: 29° 49.16’ N 82° 25.82’ W
Boat: Pearson 422
Posts: 13,896
Re: Mounting New Wind Instrument

Just did a similar project, removed the old Raymarine radar dome from the mast and installed a new. Of course only spreader height not masthead but same issues.

I cut the Raymarine cable and used it for pulling the new cables (power and data) through the mast channel. Taped the new cables (cut the connectors so I had just bare wires) with a nice taper and long overlap to the old Raymarine cables and it pulled through without a hitch.

Not sure why your concern with using the mouse line you left but if you are sure that will work why not use one of the old cables at the mast to pull the new wires through. Sounds like the new wires will be smaller and should slide through easily behind the old cables.
__________________
The water is always bluer on the other side of the ocean.

Sometimes it's necessary to state the obvious for the benefit of the oblivious.

Rust is the poor man's Loctite.
skipmac is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 27-04-2019, 06:08   #5
Registered User
 
funjohnson's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Out cruising again (Currently Norway)
Boat: 37' aluminum pilothouse "Elements"
Posts: 2,281
Re: Mounting New Wind Instrument

Instead of using the old Seatalk cable, clip the NMEA2k cable and splice to that. It's a newer cable and 4 wire (ignore the shield wire).

Matt
__________________
Youtube MJ sailing - Vlog
MJSailing.com - Written Blog
Rebuilt Aluminum Boat Over 2 Years... Now Back Cruising!
funjohnson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27-04-2019, 06:18   #6
Moderator
 
Dockhead's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Cowes (Winter), Helsinki (Summer); Cruising the Baltic Sea this year!
Boat: Cutter-Rigged Moody 54
Posts: 24,543
Re: Mounting New Wind Instrument

Quote:
Originally Posted by funjohnson View Post
Instead of using the old Seatalk cable, clip the NMEA2k cable and splice to that. It's a newer cable and 4 wire.

Matt

I thought of that. It's appealing to reuse that expensive piece of really good shielded cable instead of just leaving it dead inside the mast (I will never be able to pull it out with the mast up; I barely got it in with the mast down).


My concern is the complicated splice and weatherproofing it and strain relieving it, and doing all that while hanging at the top of the mast.



But maybe I should keep thinking about that. I would have to:


1. Slice off the end of the N2K cable


2. Circumcise it (I have a tool for that) and remove the shielding for a piece.


3. Strip and splice the 4 conductors to each other.



** First issue: how do I do the heat sealing? Normally I use a heat gun.


4. Then somehow weather proof this whole mess, with an awkward transition between one thicker and one thinner cable. Rescue tape? I have some. Maybe heat shrink tubing, a few layers, then rescue tape? But then I have the heat gun issue again.




It's challenging, but maybe worth thinking about -- thanks for prompting!!
__________________
"Parce que je suis heureux en mer, et peut-ętre pour sauver mon ame. . . "
Dockhead is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27-04-2019, 06:28   #7
Moderator
 
Dockhead's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Cowes (Winter), Helsinki (Summer); Cruising the Baltic Sea this year!
Boat: Cutter-Rigged Moody 54
Posts: 24,543
Re: Mounting New Wind Instrument

Quote:
Originally Posted by skipmac View Post
. . . Not sure why your concern with using the mouse line you left but if you are sure that will work why not use one of the old cables at the mast to pull the new wires through. Sounds like the new wires will be smaller and should slide through easily behind the old cables.

The problem is that the mast is keel stepped, and I don't have good access to the mouseline. I can pull it with some friction, but cannot manipulate it in any other way in case I need to coax the cable around an obstacle.


I guess I can try it keeping splicing on to one of the other cables as Plan "B".
__________________
"Parce que je suis heureux en mer, et peut-ętre pour sauver mon ame. . . "
Dockhead is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27-04-2019, 06:47   #8
Moderator
 
Dockhead's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Cowes (Winter), Helsinki (Summer); Cruising the Baltic Sea this year!
Boat: Cutter-Rigged Moody 54
Posts: 24,543
Re: Mounting New Wind Instrument

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dockhead View Post
I thought of that. It's appealing to reuse that expensive piece of really good shielded cable instead of just leaving it dead inside the mast (I will never be able to pull it out with the mast up; I barely got it in with the mast down).


My concern is the complicated splice and weatherproofing it and strain relieving it, and doing all that while hanging at the top of the mast.



But maybe I should keep thinking about that. I would have to:


1. Slice off the end of the N2K cable


2. Circumcise it (I have a tool for that) and remove the shielding for a piece.


3. Strip and splice the 4 conductors to each other.



** First issue: how do I do the heat sealing? Normally I use a heat gun.


4. Then somehow weather proof this whole mess, with an awkward transition between one thicker and one thinner cable. Rescue tape? I have some. Maybe heat shrink tubing, a few layers, then rescue tape? But then I have the heat gun issue again.




It's challenging, but maybe worth thinking about -- thanks for prompting!!



Ha, the lightbulb just went off!!




I'll just splice on a male Device Net connector to the CV7 -- before it goes up the mast!!


The weatherproofing etc. will be no problem down here.



The Device Net connector is IP67 and no problem inside the mast.


Damn, what a good idea.


FunJohnson -- I owe you a beer


And that is why I started this thread!
__________________
"Parce que je suis heureux en mer, et peut-ętre pour sauver mon ame. . . "
Dockhead is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27-04-2019, 08:24   #9
Registered User
 
thereefgeek's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: The Delta
Boat: Tayana 37
Posts: 37
Re: Mounting New Wind Instrument

We just installed a new Raymarine wind transducer at our masthead to replace an dead Standard Horizon and had to drill and tap 1 new screw hole (one of the holes thankfully lined up). We used the old wire to pull the 90 feet of new wire down the mast through the existing internal conduit, through the bilge hole in the compression post, and up to the transducer converter (one continuous run of wire). I don't recommend splices at the masthead or in the bilge, as corrosion will certainly ensue.

It took less than an hour in a climbing harness with my wife running tools and what-not up to me on a spare halyard, and then she pulled the old wire out as i fed the new wire in from aloft. I use mountaineering gear to solo-climb and have foot loops attached to the ascender, and standing in the loops I can just get my chin above the top of the mast. I also added what I call a "Zip-tie Mohawk" to the transducer arm as a bit of a bird deterrent.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	image1.jpg
Views:	50
Size:	412.6 KB
ID:	190871  
__________________
-Rich VanDusen
1977 Tayana 37 Ramble On

www.svrambleon.com
thereefgeek is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27-04-2019, 08:34   #10
Moderator
 
Dockhead's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Cowes (Winter), Helsinki (Summer); Cruising the Baltic Sea this year!
Boat: Cutter-Rigged Moody 54
Posts: 24,543
Re: Mounting New Wind Instrument

Quote:
Originally Posted by thereefgeek View Post
We just installed a new Raymarine wind transducer at our masthead to replace an dead Standard Horizon and had to drill and tap 1 new screw hole (one of the holes thankfully lined up). We used the old wire to pull the 90 feet of new wire down the mast through the existing internal conduit, through the bilge hole in the compression post, and up to the transducer converter (one continuous run of wire). I don't recommend splices at the masthead or in the bilge, as corrosion will certainly ensue.

It took less than an hour in a climbing harness with my wife running tools and what-not up to me on a spare halyard, and then she pulled the old wire out as i fed the new wire in from aloft. I use mountaineering gear to solo-climb and have foot loops attached to the ascender, and standing in the loops I can just get my chin above the top of the mast. I also added what I call a "Zip-tie Mohawk" to the transducer arm as a bit of a bird deterrent.

The Mohawk is a great idea -- I may copy it.


But the difference between your situation and mine, is that you have a deck stepped mast.



I would have done just the same as you, if I had a deck stepped mast, but as it is, it will be really hard to pull the cable.



Well done weatherproof connections last well at the top of the mast. I have one connecting my VHF antenna which is still going strong.


I think this will work ok. The last bit of it will be to rescue tape the Device Net plug connection, and then hang it inside the mast. The Device Net connection is already IP67, and with rescue tape should be pretty much bulletproof, I would think. And if it goes bad, it's not the end of the world to go up the mast and redo it.
__________________
"Parce que je suis heureux en mer, et peut-ętre pour sauver mon ame. . . "
Dockhead is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27-04-2019, 11:09   #11
Registered User
 
AndyEss's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Sea of Cortez/northern Utah/ Wisconsin/ La Paz, BCS
Boat: Hans Christian 38 Mk II
Posts: 330
Images: 1
Re: Mounting New Wind Instrument

Glad you came up with the good solution to the connector/communications cable issue.
Let us know how the new LJ Capteurs wind instrument works.
Instead of just washers, can you beef up the mount with some thin aluminum plate?
Anyone want to buy a NIB, never mounted Maretron WSO100?
AndyEss is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 27-04-2019, 15:15   #12
Registered User
 
thereefgeek's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: The Delta
Boat: Tayana 37
Posts: 37
Re: Mounting New Wind Instrument

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dockhead View Post
The Mohawk is a great idea -- I may copy it.

But the difference between your situation and mine, is that you have a deck stepped mast.

I would have done just the same as you, if I had a deck stepped mast, but as it is, it will be really hard to pull the cable.
Glad you like the Mohawk. If I recall I stole the idea from someone else...

With regards to keel vs. deck-stepped masts, I have to disagree. We have a sizable conduit running down the forward side of the mast. At the deck penetration we have another conduit stub glassed into the deck at the middle of the compression post that sticks up about 2" above deck level, so it's NOT one continuous pull of wire, but rather a pull to the tiny little access plate on the side of the mast, with an additional pull from the mast base through the compression post and into the bilge. In one way this is a good thing as it creates a drip-loop and keeps water dribbling down the mast and wiring from entering the bilge through the compression post, but on the other hand it sure makes pulling wire a real S.O.B.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Screen Shot 2019-04-27 at 3.06.35 PM.jpg
Views:	42
Size:	154.6 KB
ID:	190879  
__________________
-Rich VanDusen
1977 Tayana 37 Ramble On

www.svrambleon.com
thereefgeek is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27-04-2019, 15:19   #13
Registered User
 
thereefgeek's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: The Delta
Boat: Tayana 37
Posts: 37
Re: Mounting New Wind Instrument

We're going to have a new video out on our YouTube channel tomorrow morning (Electronics Pt. 2) showing exactly what we did to install the wind gauge and repeaters. Just search for SV Ramble On on YouTube and you'll see all the ugly details.
__________________
-Rich VanDusen
1977 Tayana 37 Ramble On

www.svrambleon.com
thereefgeek is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27-04-2019, 16:00   #14
Registered User
 
Painted Skies's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Australia
Boat: Tartan 412
Posts: 73
Re: Mounting New Wind Instrument

For the benefit of others who may be reading this thread in the future and are wondering how to work at the very top of the mast - here was our solution:

A couple months back we replaced our old Datamarine wind instrument with a Raymarine one. As the OP mentioned, no two manufacturers of these instruments use the same mounting plate so modifications were required. We hired a crane with a bucket for an hour - and managed to get the cable snaked down the mast, plate modified and the instrument installed quickly and easily.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_9228.JPG
Views:	33
Size:	73.3 KB
ID:	190880   Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_9240.JPG
Views:	37
Size:	63.3 KB
ID:	190881  

Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_9243.JPG
Views:	39
Size:	63.1 KB
ID:	190882  
__________________
Accidental Circumnavigation - It's what happens when you get halfway around the world and decide to go home.
Painted Skies is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27-04-2019, 16:16   #15
Registered User
 
thereefgeek's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: The Delta
Boat: Tayana 37
Posts: 37
Re: Mounting New Wind Instrument

Quote:
Originally Posted by Painted Skies View Post
For the benefit of others who may be reading this thread in the future and are wondering how to work at the very top of the mast - here was our solution:
Nice. Beats the heck outa' hanging in a climbing harness for hours on end.

I need to get a new climbing harness; after an hour or two I can feel my feet...
__________________

__________________
-Rich VanDusen
1977 Tayana 37 Ramble On

www.svrambleon.com
thereefgeek is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
men, rum, wind

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Tacktick mn30 Wireless Wind Instrument - Wind transmtter details jono63812 Marine Electronics 0 06-07-2016 13:10
Want To Buy: Raymarine ST60 Wind & Close Hauled Wind instrument jphillips48 Classifieds Archive 4 20-09-2013 03:07
Mounting Ultrasonic Wind Instrument Dockhead Marine Electronics 5 12-01-2013 07:15



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 19:32.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.