How much Electronics? How many $? - Page 4

Charlie · 31-07-2006, 09:27

This Thread came back alive at a perfect time. We expect to take possesion of the boat in about three weeks. I keep thinking that I need this or that and had narrowed it down to 1) GPS Chart Plotter/sounder, 2) auto pilot, 3) wind vane. There are already a depth sounder, wind speed & angle, radar and a few other things on board. But your commets are making me rethink this. The auto pilot and windvane seem like must haves for cruising. I don't want to handsteer for days at a time. The GPS plotter on the other hand I might just go for the portable. That way I can wait till the price drops or get last years model since we aren't leaving tommorrow. Thanks for the replies. You've saved me a few thousand bucks.

jimbim · 31-07-2006, 11:06

Charlie,

You really don't need both a windvane and autopilot. Windvane is enough. If you spend a lot of time motoring where there is no wind, hook a little auto-pilot to the windvane. As this page describes: http://www.selfsteer.com/products/monitor/autoPilot.php
I know a few people with similar set ups and they work like a dream.

Just go sailing. Have fun. And don't spend a dime that you don't absolutely have to spend for at least a year. (And paper charts work fine!)

Good luck.

defjef · 31-07-2006, 15:20

You definitely want some sort of self steering. I installed an Alpha 3000 with a mosfet. It is a hydraulic ram and has steered the boat 99% of the time since it was installed. I even anchor and pick up a mooring with it!

For long offshore passages a wind vane would certainly be the way to go.. but some autopilots can interface with wind instruments and steer to wind and not to course.

I am happy with the auto pilot and not the vane... and have never found it a power hog. The Alpha 3000 does not interface with position fixers so it requires that YOU set the course with a dial which is like a compass rose. To tack you turn it 90-100°. When you hand steer you mechanically disengage the ram with a teleflex cable. There is no drag or effect on the helm whatsoever. You can also control how much correction you want.. which WILL use more or less power as it can respond to every motion of the boat and try to correct with the rudder.

I have used this pilot for 17 yrs and love it. I would give it a very strong recommendation. I did a delivery on a boat that had another pilot and it would occasionally go off duty and sound a faint alarm. To get it back on.. you had to re program your heading before it would "latch on". I thought this was much less effective than the system I use.

I love the auto pilot.

Jef
sv Shiva
Contest 36s

hellosailor · 31-07-2006, 15:29

I must confess, that the more I meet and hear of autopilots, the more respect I have for the few boats I have been on that really can hold almost any course on their own after being trimmed for it. I think I would be willing to forgive a boat of almost any sin (bunk too short, cabin too low, no jacuzzi in the heads<G>) as long as it had that all too rare quality of being able to sail without any crew on the helm.

Strygaldwir · 31-07-2006, 20:14

So, you're sold on catamarans?

Charlie · 31-07-2006, 21:46

The boat that I have under contract has an Alpha 3000. I'm thinking that I would like to get something as a back up since the autopilots are notoriously unreliable. Maybe I'll back up the pilot with a windvane. thanks for all the comments they are driving me towards spending less money.

btrayfors · 01-08-2006, 05:03

Charlie,

The Alpha 3000 is one of the most reliable autopilots you can have. It's simple and rugged. They have steered flawlessly around the world in various singlehanded races, and have proven their reliability over several decades. So, don't give up on it quite yet.

I was always intending to fit one aboard my 42' sloop when my Autohelm 5000 gave out, but when the time came I wasn't sure about the future of the company, spare parts, etc. Can't remember exactly what put me off.

Bought a W-H P3C instead, arguably the best autopilot available. Love it.

Bill

GordMay · 01-08-2006, 05:22

”The inner life of an autopilot” ~ by Sven Donaldson
From Ocean Navigator #120, Mar/Apr 2002
http://www.oceannavigator.com/article.php?a=1183

For other Self Steering articles, see also: http://www.oceannavigator.com/browse/subject.php?s=37

Charlie · 01-08-2006, 21:00

Thanks Gord:

As usual you are a wealth of knowledge. I'm leaning towards just fixing the Alpha 3000 and adding a windvane and then if I feel particuilarly frivilous I will add a small tiller pilot that will control the windvane as shown on the monitor site.

jimbim · 02-08-2006, 22:46

Well, the small tiller pilot might be overkill

Joli · 03-08-2006, 05:19

Just sail the boat for a while and see whats what. Don't spend any dough unless you have safety issues that need resolving immediately.

31-07-2006, 09:27	#46
Charlie Registered User Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Nevada City. CA Boat: Sceptre 41 Ohana Posts: 2,104 Images: 6	This Thread came back alive at a perfect time. We expect to take possesion of the boat in about three weeks. I keep thinking that I need this or that and had narrowed it down to 1) GPS Chart Plotter/sounder, 2) auto pilot, 3) wind vane. There are already a depth sounder, wind speed & angle, radar and a few other things on board. But your commets are making me rethink this. The auto pilot and windvane seem like must haves for cruising. I don't want to handsteer for days at a time. The GPS plotter on the other hand I might just go for the portable. That way I can wait till the price drops or get last years model since we aren't leaving tommorrow. Thanks for the replies. You've saved me a few thousand bucks. __________________ Fair Winds, Charlie Between us there was, as I have already said somewhere, the bond of the sea. Besides holding our hearts together through long periods of separation, it had the effect of making us tolerant of each other's yarns -- and even convictions. Heart of Darkness Joseph Conrad

31-07-2006, 21:46	#51
Charlie Registered User Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Nevada City. CA Boat: Sceptre 41 Ohana Posts: 2,104 Images: 6	The boat that I have under contract has an Alpha 3000. I'm thinking that I would like to get something as a back up since the autopilots are notoriously unreliable. Maybe I'll back up the pilot with a windvane. thanks for all the comments they are driving me towards spending less money. __________________ Fair Winds, Charlie Between us there was, as I have already said somewhere, the bond of the sea. Besides holding our hearts together through long periods of separation, it had the effect of making us tolerant of each other's yarns -- and even convictions. Heart of Darkness Joseph Conrad

01-08-2006, 05:22	#53
GordMay CF Adviser Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Thunder Bay, Ontario - 48-29N x 89-20W Boat: C.L.O.D. (Cruiser Living On Dirt) Posts: 13,539 Images: 233	”The inner life of an autopilot” ~ by Sven Donaldson From Ocean Navigator #120, Mar/Apr 2002 http://www.oceannavigator.com/article.php?a=1183 For other Self Steering articles, see also: http://www.oceannavigator.com/browse/subject.php?s=37 __________________ Gord May ~~_/)_~~ (Gord & Maggie - s/v"Southbound") "If you didn't have time/$ to do it right in the first place, when will you get the time/$ to fix it?" Custom Search CF ➥ http://www.google.com/cse/home?cx=01...%3A2lb6ozabif0

01-08-2006, 21:00	#54
Charlie Registered User Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Nevada City. CA Boat: Sceptre 41 Ohana Posts: 2,104 Images: 6	Thanks Gord: As usual you are a wealth of knowledge. I'm leaning towards just fixing the Alpha 3000 and adding a windvane and then if I feel particuilarly frivilous I will add a small tiller pilot that will control the windvane as shown on the monitor site. __________________ Fair Winds, Charlie Between us there was, as I have already said somewhere, the bond of the sea. Besides holding our hearts together through long periods of separation, it had the effect of making us tolerant of each other's yarns -- and even convictions. Heart of Darkness Joseph Conrad

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31-07-2006, 11:06	#47
jimbim Registered User Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Southeast Asia, etc Boat: Vancouver 27 "Quiver" Posts: 113	Charlie, You really don't need both a windvane and autopilot. Windvane is enough. If you spend a lot of time motoring where there is no wind, hook a little auto-pilot to the windvane. As this page describes: http://www.selfsteer.com/products/monitor/autoPilot.php I know a few people with similar set ups and they work like a dream. Just go sailing. Have fun. And don't spend a dime that you don't absolutely have to spend for at least a year. (And paper charts work fine!) Good luck.

31-07-2006, 15:20	#48
defjef Registered User Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: up from NYC Boat: Shiva - Contest 36s Posts: 1,921	You definitely want some sort of self steering. I installed an Alpha 3000 with a mosfet. It is a hydraulic ram and has steered the boat 99% of the time since it was installed. I even anchor and pick up a mooring with it! For long offshore passages a wind vane would certainly be the way to go.. but some autopilots can interface with wind instruments and steer to wind and not to course. I am happy with the auto pilot and not the vane... and have never found it a power hog. The Alpha 3000 does not interface with position fixers so it requires that YOU set the course with a dial which is like a compass rose. To tack you turn it 90-100°. When you hand steer you mechanically disengage the ram with a teleflex cable. There is no drag or effect on the helm whatsoever. You can also control how much correction you want.. which WILL use more or less power as it can respond to every motion of the boat and try to correct with the rudder. I have used this pilot for 17 yrs and love it. I would give it a very strong recommendation. I did a delivery on a boat that had another pilot and it would occasionally go off duty and sound a faint alarm. To get it back on.. you had to re program your heading before it would "latch on". I thought this was much less effective than the system I use. I love the auto pilot. Jef sv Shiva Contest 36s

31-07-2006, 15:29	#49
hellosailor Registered User Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 4,299	I must confess, that the more I meet and hear of autopilots, the more respect I have for the few boats I have been on that really can hold almost any course on their own after being trimmed for it. I think I would be willing to forgive a boat of almost any sin (bunk too short, cabin too low, no jacuzzi in the heads<G>) as long as it had that all too rare quality of being able to sail without any crew on the helm.

31-07-2006, 20:14	#50
Strygaldwir Registered User Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Deale, Maryland Boat: SeaView - Privilege 37 Posts: 856 Images: 5	So, you're sold on catamarans?

01-08-2006, 05:03	#52
btrayfors Senior Cruiser Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Chesapeake Region Boat: 42' Bob Perry sloop, "Born Free" Posts: 1,428 Images: 3	Charlie, The Alpha 3000 is one of the most reliable autopilots you can have. It's simple and rugged. They have steered flawlessly around the world in various singlehanded races, and have proven their reliability over several decades. So, don't give up on it quite yet. I was always intending to fit one aboard my 42' sloop when my Autohelm 5000 gave out, but when the time came I wasn't sure about the future of the company, spare parts, etc. Can't remember exactly what put me off. Bought a W-H P3C instead, arguably the best autopilot available. Love it. Bill

02-08-2006, 22:46	#55
jimbim Registered User Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Southeast Asia, etc Boat: Vancouver 27 "Quiver" Posts: 113	Well, the small tiller pilot might be overkill

03-08-2006, 05:19	#56
Joli Registered User Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Ohio Posts: 1,845	Just sail the boat for a while and see whats what. Don't spend any dough unless you have safety issues that need resolving immediately.

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