Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 22-08-2015, 21:54   #16
Registered User

Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Sydney Australia
Boat: Dufour 35 Classic
Posts: 21
Re: How hard is it to attach a wind transducer to the top of the mast?

I have a 1998 Dufour 35 Classic in Sydney Australia
Early this year the old Raymarine Rotavector wind transducer on the mast failed, which we later found out was due to a bearing seizing. Cant complain the unit was 17 years old!
Got a rigger to go up the mast and remove it with the intention of replacing the unit with a more modern Raymarine unit which I had bought previously.
Problem 1 was that the builders of the boat had used a conduit inside the mast to run the three wire cable to the wind unit, and the cables inside the conduit which included VHF radio, masthead light, Nav lights and deck lights had been cable tied together. There was no way that the old three core cable could be used as a messenger. The rigger would not run the new cable loose in the mast for fear of cable chafe with the halyards - fair enough.
Only way to fix this was for the mast to come out.

There are many other areas on this boat where the convenience of the builders was considered to the complete exclusion of any thought of the problems of replacing wires, pipes and conduits in the future.

Problem 2 - on safety and liability grounds the riggers would not re-use ANY of the existing standing rigging and it all "had to the replaced"

Problem 3 - their estimate - not a firm price, was $4500 AUD
In their favour, the riggers refused to bill me for the hour or so of work on the basis of "no cure no pay"

The boat remains without a wind instrument to my continuing annoyance as the boat's purser (the wife) refuses to allow me to spend that much money!!

It really is a case of too many lawyers - the riggers are not able to do the mast removal with the old standing rigging and will not (cannot under our laws?) accept any indemnity from me to just to do the work

I must say that removing the mast on this boat, with furling headsail, boom bag, lazy jacks, gas strut vang, etc would not be a job I would like to take on.
__________________

__________________
inspectr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-08-2015, 22:02   #17
Registered User
 
Rustic Charm's Avatar

Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Tasmania, Australia
Boat: Bieroc 36 foot Ketch
Posts: 4,898
Re: How hard is it to attach a wind transducer to the top of the mast?

[QUOTE=inspectr;1897700]I have a 1998 Dufour 35 Classic in Sydney Australia
Early this year the old Raymarine Rotavector wind transducer on the mast failed, which we later found out was due to a bearing seizing. Cant complain the unit was 17 years old!
Got a rigger to go up the mast and remove it with the intention of replacing the unit with a more modern Raymarine unit which I had bought previously.
Problem 1 was that the builders of the boat had used a conduit inside the mast to run the three wire cable to the wind unit, and the cables inside the conduit which included VHF radio, masthead light, Nav lights and deck lights had been cable tied together. There was no way that the old three core cable could be used as a messenger. The rigger would not run the new cable loose in the mast for fear of cable chafe with the halyards - fair enough.
Only way to fix this was for the mast to come out.

There are many other areas on this boat where the convenience of the builders was considered to the complete exclusion of any thought of the problems of replacing wires, pipes and conduits in the future.

Problem 2 - on safety and liability grounds the riggers would not re-use ANY of the existing standing rigging and it all "had to the replaced"

Problem 3 - their estimate - not a firm price, was $4500 AUD
In their favour, the riggers refused to bill me for the hour or so of work on the basis of "no cure no pay"

The boat remains without a wind instrument to my continuing annoyance as the boat's purser (the wife) refuses to allow me to spend that much money!!

It really is a case of too many lawyers - the riggers are not able to do the mast removal with the old standing rigging and will not (cannot under our laws?) accept any indemnity from me to just to do the work

I must say that removing the mast on this boat, with furling headsail, boom bag, lazy jacks, gas strut vang, etc would not be a job I would like to take on.[/QUOTE]

I don't know your boat, but I can't see a vessel of comparative size in which removing these items is particularly difficult or time consuming. I thought it was as you do, until I actually did it last year and found it was really quite easy.

From what you have said, I don't think you have a choice. If your standing rigging is too dangerous to reuse, then I'd suggest it's probably too far gone to leave on the boat and go sailing with.

$4500 to replace all the rigging, and run new wires inside the mast and new wind transducer seems about fair to me. well worth it for the peace of mind given what you have described is your problem.
__________________

__________________
Rustic Charm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-08-2015, 03:13   #18
Registered User

Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Tampa
Boat: Island Packet 31
Posts: 28
Re: How hard is it to attach a wind transducer to the top of the mast?

Quote:
Originally Posted by northoceanbeach View Post
What would happen if I drilled a big hole, maybe two inches across with a hole saw, inside my boat, under the mast? I want things to look nice of course, but the existing wires coming out of the bottom of the mast look rough, the come out through glands on the base of the mast and them into the caving top where they disappear and they look original, like thirty years old. I would like to run a new version wire or co ax cable or whatever it's called if I could and make this project all nex mast wiring.

I don't think I have conduit inside the mast because when I walk around the boat I can hear the vhf cable slapping all over the place.

So is that a good idea? Hole saw from inside the boat? Or would that weaken anything?
I have an IP-31 keel stepped mast. Last week I installed a new anchor light and RG-8X coax for the FM radio. I couldn't use the PVC due to an old wire for the anchor light lodged in the pipe, so I ran a new one down the mast with about 20, 3/8 inch bolts for a weight. At the bottom of the mast I have about a 2 inch round hold where these cable exit the mast and connect to the plugs for the radio and lights. I used 6 in wire ties every foot to keep the new calbes from clanging inside the mast, good technique if you don't have any of your halyards inside the mast!
__________________
MikePz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-08-2015, 04:47   #19
Registered User

Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Daytona Beach, Fl
Boat: Irwin 38 Mk II CC 38'
Posts: 253
Send a message via Skype™ to PuttingDoctor
Re: How hard is it to attach a wind transducer to the top of the mast?

Perhaps the Purser would see value in a wireless unit. Garmin have a solution that includes the black box bridge for othe NMEA connections. Practical Sailor did a review last year. Seems the Garmin for range and TacTick for smaller boats.
__________________
PuttingDoctor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-08-2015, 04:58   #20
Registered User
 
northoceanbeach's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: California
Boat: Cape Dory 28
Posts: 445
Re: How hard is it to attach a wind transducer to the top of the mast?

I haven't heard of the wireless transducers, but it's too late, I already have the wired one. I have all external halyards, so hopefully it will not be too hard.

I had a weak drill bit up there this first time, so I didn't get a hole done, but next time I'll be ready. Today was kind of the checking it all out trip and getting the steaming light bulbs out which did work to compare and get led.

It's going to be here to drill through the the metal top though, very thick metal.

No wonder the old instrument didn't work though, it fell apart in my hand.
northoceanbeach is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-08-2015, 17:16   #21
Registered User
 
OS2Dude's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Atlanta, GA
Boat: Catalina 30
Posts: 144
Images: 5
Re: How hard is it to attach a wind transducer to the top of the mast?

It depends. Are the halyards internal? Is there already a conduit inside the mast? Is there a 'messenger line' already there?

On our 1985 Catalina 30, there is a compression post inside the boat that is made up of 4 boards making a box column. The screws are hidden by plugs, but can be seen if you really look for them. I can also see the wires for the mast in the bilge running right up to the post base.

In the base of the mast, I can unscrew the plate holding the sheaves for the internal halyards and can reach the connectors for the wires going up the mast. You should also have something like this.

'Easiest' way is to use the existing lines to pull the new wires up the mast, but be aware that the steaming and foredeck lights do not exit at the top and will have to be pulled out early.

Issue is someone has to be at the mast head to do this. If you or someone you know likes to sit in an uncomfortable bosun's chair hanging from a halyard, it is not that hard. My brother did it for me. (I installed a wireless wind instrument, but he had to install a plate to have something to attach it to, as well as replace the VHF antenna and old analog windex.)

If you don't want to do an arial act, have the mast pulled and you can run the wires yourself. Either use an existing line as before, or get a long rod (Home Depot sells sectional rods electricians use to fish wires in buildings, a few of these would work) or if it is clear inside I've seen people blow a small string thru with an air compressor.

Good luck, and let us know.
__________________
OS2Dude is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24-08-2015, 04:41   #22
Registered User
 
northoceanbeach's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: California
Boat: Cape Dory 28
Posts: 445
Re: How hard is it to attach a wind transducer to the top of the mast?

I had my friend grind me up while I helped climb. It was my first time up a mast on any boat. It was fun, but it hurt, it was very uncomfortable like you said.

I got the bulbs out for the steaming/foredeck light. The foredeck still worked, although how I don't know, these bulbs,looked,original, or if not very old. The top one crumbled in my hand.

I have to go back yo soon, the top plate is really hard to frill through. I hope it's works.
northoceanbeach is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24-08-2015, 04:48   #23
Registered User
 
Rustic Charm's Avatar

Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Tasmania, Australia
Boat: Bieroc 36 foot Ketch
Posts: 4,898
Re: How hard is it to attach a wind transducer to the top of the mast?

Quote:
Originally Posted by northoceanbeach View Post
I had my friend grind me up while I helped climb. It was my first time up a mast on any boat. It was fun, but it hurt, it was very uncomfortable like you said.

I got the bulbs out for the steaming/foredeck light. The foredeck still worked, although how I don't know, these bulbs,looked,original, or if not very old. The top one crumbled in my hand.

I have to go back yo soon, the top plate is really hard to frill through. I hope it's works.
If it's painful to be lifted up then change your harness to a chair. It shouldn't be painful. My son lifted me up to mine today. Pleasant view, nice weather. He did all the hard work
__________________
Rustic Charm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24-08-2015, 06:30   #24
Registered User

Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Port Aransas, Texas
Boat: 2002 Seawind 1000 (33 ft) Cat
Posts: 840
Re: How hard is it to attach a wind transducer to the top of the mast?

How old is your standing rigging? I just changed out the electronics, and added a 4G radar, and went to a tricolor LED light on the top of the mast instead of the old anchor light. Also an LED steaming/deck light unit, and changed out the old ST50 wind base and wire to an ST60 base - since my control head and wand are now that model.

Although I changed out the shrouds several years ago, the rest of the standing rigging on the boat was original (12 years old). So decided to pull the mast, and have rigger redo all of the standing rigging, and at the same time add a conduit for my radar, etc. I didn't want to hear the slapping, plus a few people said the tie wrap method was hard to get the cable centered and didn't work for them. The crane for the job was $200 to get off of the boat, and $200 to put the mast back on - and operated by the yard. I just pulled the boat alongside the dock, and off it went.

Rigger cost is going to be considerably higher. But we are about to embark on retirement, and months away from the dock while cruising, and the last thing I want to deal with in the Bahamas - or anywhere - is standing rig failure. And slapping radar cable!
__________________

__________________
sailjumanji is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
mast, wind

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Wind transducer: True vs. apparent wind? RhythmDoctor OpenCPN 3 04-01-2015 15:28
Mast head wind speed transducer not spinning Caprice Marine Electronics 0 01-09-2014 02:27
Best way to re-attach cam cleat to mast? OldFrog75 Deck hardware: Rigging, Sails & Hoisting 15 04-08-2013 21:49
A Transducer is a Transducer, Correct? Herbseesmoore Marine Electronics 3 22-06-2013 06:23
Want To Buy: Raymarine Rotary Rudder Transducer and Fluxgate Transducer Kristian Classifieds Archive 0 22-02-2010 04:09



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 01:44.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.