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Old 15-04-2013, 07:27   #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wotname
Sorry Jimbo, the PLB does not qualify as an EPIRB in any Aussie state as far as the regs. go.
Hmm, ok. Thanks, Wotname, for that! I guess we will end up with an Epirb in that case.
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Old 15-04-2013, 07:31   #62
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Originally Posted by zeehag
check of oz as a possible cruising place for more than one reason---
no spot
no termites
no cat
wow.........

mebbe after the world falls and no more nanny states exist.....mebbe then i can visit over there...until then.........
Foreign yachts don't have to have an Epirb, I understand. Maybe Wotname or another Aussie can confirm that.

You can bring your cat, but he will go thru Quarantine. Crazy cat ladies don't go thru quarantine.

No termites allowed!
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Old 15-04-2013, 07:39   #63
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Re: Have Epirb's been superseded by the Personal Emergency response beacons?

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Originally Posted by Jimbo485 View Post
Foreign yachts don't have to have an Epirb, I understand. Maybe Wotname or another Aussie can confirm that.
I can't confirm this but I am pretty sure you are correct!

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Originally Posted by Jimbo485 View Post
You can bring your cat, but he will go thru Quarantine. Crazy cat ladies don't go thru quarantine.

No termites allowed!
Both these statements are correct and although they occasionally miss the termites - they never miss those cat ladies
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Old 15-04-2013, 08:37   #64
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Re: Have Epirb's been superseded by the Personal Emergency response beacons?

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Far from viewing PLB's as the poor cousins to epirb's I am viewing them as a significant step forward in functionality and usefulness. That is what I was hoping would be debated.
I'm not trying to be impolite, but it sounds like you started with your conclusion and are now unwilling to consider any contrary information.

Compared to a modern GPS-EPIRB, a PLB is not "a significant step forward in functionality". It is certainly more useful if the goal is to carry it on your person, but otherwise it is no better, and in several ways worse, than an EPIRB.

A PLB is essentially a miniaturized and reduced-functionality EPIRB.

For two-way messaging capability, look at the Iridium-based beacons (global), or the SPOT-like devices (restricted area). We have already discussed why these are not true emergency beacons (although they can be used for this).
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Old 15-04-2013, 09:33   #65
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Re: Have Epirb's been superseded by the Personal Emergency response beacons?

--------------
To get back to the thread, I really don't see the point in choosing something else but something designed for the purpose. It's perfectly fine if that is all you have and not a dime to spare. But if you haven't bought anything yet, the best, and obvious, choice should be something that will deliver the quickest, the longest, and the best. Nothing is on par with a full-fledged GPS EPIRB for the very reasons which has been pointed out again and again.
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Old 15-04-2013, 09:56   #66
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Re: Have Epirb's been superseded by the Personal Emergency response beacons?

I did start with a thesis Paul that is correct. However it is not a case of disregarding other information but a case of finding relevant fact.

Since Mcmurdo have a PLB that now has a 48 hour battery the advantage of an epirb over a PLB seems to be that it can float in a transmit orientation and they can be automatically triggered. I am still undecided, the question was/is genuine? As I own neither and I started to research epirbs available I came across the new kids on the block.

I am intrigued and very undecided.
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Old 15-04-2013, 10:11   #67
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Re: Have Epirb's been superseded by the Personal Emergency response beacons?

--------------




Before sounding off do some reading. ARC and Mcmurdoe products ARE DESIGNED for CRUISING boats in the OCEAN. WHAT REASONS?, Preference yes but little fact! In fact a lot of misinformation. I have emailed both the main manufactures and asked then for clarification of their products that they market to OFF SHore Sailors.

Question stands:

Desktop or lap top or tablet or smart phone? Opps sorry but you get my drift.

It is not about saving a dime. It is about functionality, practical use, like computer preference. I am looking to spend more on 2 devices both permanently attached to life vests. So the question I am sending to the companies asks them what compromise am I making, safety wise, if I went this way over a traditional EPIRB stand alone model.

Do you understand better now :-)
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Old 15-04-2013, 10:14   #68
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Re: Have Epirb's been superseded by the Personal Emergency response beacons?

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Originally Posted by NorthPacific View Post
I did start with a thesis Paul that is correct. However it is not a case of disregarding other information but a case of finding relevant fact.

Since Mcmurdo have a PLB that now has a 48 hour battery the advantage of an epirb over a PLB seems to be that it can float in a transmit orientation and they can be automatically triggered.
And that the EPIRB is registered to your boat, and more likely has more power for transmission than the smaller PLB. If it gets solas approval as an EPIRB, but it wont, as it won't float upright, and in real life has less battery life than a full-fledged EPIRB, and most likely less transmission power, and are not automatic.

I still don't get why you refuse to consider an Epirb. It seems it's more important for you to wear it. If so, buy one of each. Buy the EPIRB and buy a nice, really small PLB you can wear on your lifevest at all times. There, the best of both worlds.
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Old 15-04-2013, 10:22   #69
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Re: Have Epirb's been superseded by the Personal Emergency response beacons?

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ARC and Mcmurdoe products ARE DESIGNED for CRUISING boats in the OCEAN. WHAT REASONS?, Preference yes but little fact! In fact a lot of misinformation. I have emailed both the main manufactures and asked then for clarification of their products that they market to OFF SHore Sailors.
Yes, but they are not all alike. Nor on par with each other. Hence higher" requirements of full-fledged EPIRBS.


Quote:
Question stands Desktop or lap top or tablet or smart phone? Opps sorry but you get my drift.
YOu think that supports your ideas? Being rescued when you are in a life raft is rather specific, so just like your desktop/laptop/tablet/smartphone can do many of the same things, if you have to do heavy lifting or even write a little, the smartphone is the worse of the choices. And for much the same reasons, that PLB is a worse choice than a full-fledged EPIRB: The EPIRB performs better and for longer when it comes to get you noticed and saved. The PLB less so, and the SPOT recommended by Zeehag, even (much) less so.
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Old 15-04-2013, 10:30   #70
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Re: Have Epirb's been superseded by the Personal Emergency response beacons?

Oh, you added a bit:

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Originally Posted by NorthPacific View Post
It is not about saving a dime. It is about functionality, practical use, like computer preference.
But this is not solely about preference. Your analogy of computers is missing the point: If you want to edit videos or writing a book, the damn smartphone is the worst choice of the lot. In the case of the PLBs vs. EPIRBs vs SPOT, the PLB is the second worse choice.

And if it's not about saving money, why not get something that will float the right way up, allowing it communicate with the life saving satellites? Don't answer, at this point, that is something I have no hope of getting you to realise the necessity of.



Quote:
I am looking to spend more on 2 devices both permanently attached to life vests. So the question I am sending to the companies asks them what compromise am I making, safety wise, if I went this way over a traditional EPIRB stand alone model.

Do you understand better now :-)
Yes, I understand that you think that two PLBs on lifevest is just as good as an epirb, and that you fail to realise how difficult it will be to keep it upright in roaring seas, and that you fail to realise it is not registered to your boat, and that you're willing to sacrifice the period the thing transmits for the "convenience" of not having a full fledged EPIRB on board.

If it's not about saving money, the best option is to have both: An epirb for the boat, and a PLB for each person on board.
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Old 15-04-2013, 10:31   #71
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Re: Have Epirb's been superseded by the Personal Emergency response beacons?

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Originally Posted by Caracal View Post
And that the EPIRB is registered to your boat, and more likely has more power for transmission than the smaller PLB.
Most EPIRBs and PLBs transmit at 5 watts on 406 MHz. Some of the new PLBs transmit at 6 watts.

I don't really have a dog in this race, but let me just comment that I spend a lot of time sailing on other people's boats, and/or sea kayaking. For me, were I only to own 1 device, the PLB would make more sense.

When it came time to purchase a second device, an iridium sat phone made more sense. Again, I spend a lot of time involved in multi-week sea kayak expeditions, so the increased flexibility of PLB in combination with a sat phone makes a difference.

I also generally carry a SPOT, but that's more as a check-in device, or as a way to get help in a non-crisis situation. On a recent sea kayak expedition, for example, we were running low on water but it was not at the point where we were ready to call out the Mexican navy via EPIRB. Both SPOT and the sat phone gave us a way to get the extra 20 liters we needed to complete the trip without rationing.
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Old 15-04-2013, 10:35   #72
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Re: Have Epirb's been superseded by the Personal Emergency response beacons?

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Most EPIRBs and PLBs transmit at 5 watts on 406 MHz. Some of the new PLBs transmit at 6 watts.
That leaves the question how a smaller PLB could possible meet the 48 hours needed for EPIRBS.

Quote:
I don't really have a dog in this race, but let me just comment that I spend a lot of time sailing on other people's boats, and/or sea kayaking. For me, were I only to own 1 device, the PLB would make more sense.
I too have a PLB I use mostly for coastal/open water rowing. It's a good choice. But if you have your own boat, and you have the money to buy both, I don't see why one would buy a PLB solely.
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Old 15-04-2013, 10:35   #73
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Re: Have Epirb's been superseded by the Personal Emergency response beacons?

Caracal,

Sorry, fact would suggest that much of what you have said is wrong. Have I ever mention SPOT unless it was to disregard it?

Sorry about using the computer example. Was using it to illustrate how from one format, many have developed, that serve functionality and practicality. I see that this was lost on you.

You should look to see which national and international organizations support the PLB format I have mentioned. Does a emergency beacon floating outside your raft work better than the one tied to your life vest in the raft? Does a epirb rolling around in the ocean work better than a ELB rolling around? Come on man. What is this notion of having to hold the thing perfectly perpendicular did the manufactures tell you that?

DO some reading, I have heard your opinion. I was looking for factual assistance not diatribe. I will base my purchase on fact not fiction. Maybe the manufactures can shed some light.

Bet you are using a Desk Top :-)
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Old 15-04-2013, 11:23   #74
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Re: Have Epirb's been superseded by the Personal Emergency response beacons?



I have a Spot Communicator and used it while crewing a delivery up the coast of Mexico. Even though I shut the unit off after every use, I noticed that regular batteries don't last long in this device. I think the Spot device is better than nothing, but I would feel much better having a PLB in an emergency. Just my $0.02.
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Old 15-04-2013, 12:01   #75
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Re: Have Epirb's been superseded by the Personal Emergency response beacons?

AHEM! I've just spent 20 minutes of my life cleaning up this thread. Usually I will PM the transgressors and politely inform them of the rules they broke, and why their posts got edited, but in this case there were so many players it would have taken another 20 minutes.

The major offense was violating the "Be Nice" rule (reprinted below)

We take the "be nice" rule VERY seriously! We do not tolerate ANY rudeness.

The rules in their entirety are here: http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...ork&page=rules
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