Forward pointing sonar devices for boats?

[GoingWalkabout]

I'm wondering if there is a device that can be set to scan for objects forward of the boat and that has a reasonable range. I know submarines have such detection technology but I'm wondering if someone has made such a device perhaps based on sonar for pleasure boats.

Any thoughts or ideas on this would be very much appreciated.

Thanks,
Chaya

[deblen]

Google Scanning Sonar. Expensive.works like underwater radar.Most major mfgrs have made them since WWII,but for comm. fishing,etc.
Yacht versions just starting to show in last few yrs.

Simrad Launches Forward Scanning Sonar, First Integrated With MFDs | | PassageMaker

[clownfishsydney]

We have a forward scanning sonar, an Interphase Outlook. This can look forward or down like a normal depth sounder. It works well when tracking the bottom ahead.

I am not sure what you might want it for, some people I have seen want to know if it will pick up something like a floating container in the open ocean. I have no idea if it will and hope I never need to see if it does.

[MYTraveler]

Furuno (and others, most notably Simrad and Wesmar) makes a scanning sonar that can be directed to scan back and forth or up and down in any horizontal or vertical configuration you can imagine. Price, installed is typically $20K +.

[Stumble]

The general feeling is that they just aren't ready for prime time yet. The technology is maturing,and I certainly don't falt anyone for having it already the systems just don't do a very good job. The big players in marine electronics are working pretty seriously at it right now and I expect new toys to come to market soon with better capabilities, but for now I wouldn't buy one. Honestly a better option for gunk holing would be a cheap wireless depth sounder mounted on a model boat.

See Panbo: The Marine Electronics Hub: EchoPilot Platinum FLS, better than expected for a recent review of the technology.

[MYTraveler]

Originally Posted by Stumble

The general feeling is that they just aren't ready for prime time yet.

I used to have the forward looking Interphase and would agree with your assessment as pertains to that unit and others like it. The Furuno technology is fundamentally different -- a transducer is hydraulically deployed to well below the bottom of the boat and is physically (and automatically) directed back and forth across the area to be scanned. (So, for example, when forward looking, that could be 30 degrees to port, sweeping to 30 degrees to starboard, at a very shallow angle to the horizontal.) I believe the Furuno technology is quite impressive and widely deployed, its biggest limitations being cost and room for the sea chest through which the transducer is deployed.

Attached (clicking on the picture makes it much more viewable) is a screenshot of from my CH-250 scanning 360 degrees around my boat, which is on the end tie of a slip. The main channel basin is on my port side (the left side of the picture), a passing boat and its turbulence can be seen off my port bow, several rows of docks on both sides of the channel, with the various boats occupying those dock, and the sea walls on both sides of the channel can be easily seen, even through the clutter of all of the boat bottoms in between, and notwithstanding the very shallow water. (It is returning meaningful echos more than 20 x the water depth distant.)

[GoingWalkabout]

Thanks everyone. I'm pleased to see that progress is being made in this field. Yes I'm looking at picking up craft and debris forward of my course. And with a good forward distance to sound alarms so a change of direction can be done either manually or by the autopilot.

When I've created electronics I've always worked backwards from what would be the ultimate product and then set about the R&D to achieve the goal. This has served me well in new product development and has allowed me to develop product light years ahead of others.

But by far most development is done by incremental steps. Innovation based on small advance steps. Which of course leads to a long time before you see anything revolutionary.

Now I'm not about to get my team to start building sonar devices with advanced computer interfaces that uses pattern matching and high definition image processing.

I am pleased to hear that marine equipment manufacturers are working on this product. I just hope that the development curve is more of a revolutionary one than an incremental one.

Much can be learned from existing technology already used by naval defence. But I do know that cutting edge sonar used by the DOD is top secret.

Any way. Thanks everyone for your contribution.

[meirriba]

Another product
3D forward looking sonar

[deblen]

Originally Posted by Going Walkabout

Thanks everyone. I'm pleased to see that progress is being made in this field. Yes I'm looking at picking up craft and debris forward of my course. And with a good forward distance to sound alarms so a change of direction can be done either manually or by the autopilot.

When I've created electronics I've always worked backwards from what would be the ultimate product and then set about the R&D to achieve the goal. This has served me well in new product development and has allowed me to develop product light years ahead of others.

But by far most development is done by incremental steps. Innovation based on small advance steps. Which of course leads to a long time before you see anything revolutionary.

Now I'm not about to get my team to start building sonar devices with advanced computer interfaces that uses pattern matching and high definition image processing.

I am pleased to hear that marine equipment manufacturers are working on this product. I just hope that the development curve is more of a revolutionary one than an incremental one.

Much can be learned from existing technology already used by naval defence. But I do know that cutting edge sonar used by the DOD is top secret.

Any way. Thanks everyone for your contribution.

If you are interested in pursuing this further,I suggest you speak with Airmar.The underwater transducer is the "limiting" factor in scanning sonar.
The display electronics have been readily available for years.
Airmar Technology Corporation » The Leader in Ultrasonic Transducers and Sensing Technology

Also Google MAQ Sonar. Cheers/Len

[deblen]

Originally Posted by meirriba

Another product
3D forward looking sonar

Thanks for link Mark. Good to see progress being made in "small boat" sonar.In my working life(Marine Electronics),I was spoiled by very expensive scanning sonar systems used by herring purse seiners.
Even in those systems,the limiting distance factor was the sound dome/transducer & frequency.
200Khz will only detect fish to about 40fathoms/240ft/100 mtrs.Just the nature of underwater acoustics.
50 or 28 khz will reach somewhat further,but an expensive,physically large,phased array sound dome is reqd. to focus those freqs into a narrow enough beam,to avoid "bouncing" of signal beam off the surface & bottom,which causes so much clutter.
Throw in the necessity of gyro stabilization reqd to keep the beam in the water column-more expense.
Not condemning any companies attempts to build a useful working sonar for a "small boat" price.Huge market for one in the commercial world,as well as recreational.
Would definitely prevent many groundings.Cheers/Len

[Cadence]

Originally Posted by Going Walkabout

I'm wondering if there is a device that can be set to scan for objects forward of the boat and that has a reasonable range. I know submarines have such detection technology but I'm wondering if someone has made such a device perhaps based on sonar for pleasure boats.

Any thoughts or ideas on this would be very much appreciated.

Thanks,
Chaya

I believe the entire bubble bow of the subs are filled with transducers. Commercial fishing has been using a side scan sonar for years I have no idea on effectiveness, cost or size. Speaking of fishing ships in effect, hunting for massive schools of fish. As fast as technology is advancing today wait a couple of years and they will probably be over the counter electronics with a display the size of what is on your bridge today.

[1000 islands]

Being in the 1000 Islands where the depth goes from 200 feet to 2 feet in matter of a boat length, I had 2 through hull transducers installed.

One is the normal pointing straight down and the other points about 20 degrees forward.

The forward pointing one is connected to a rather cheap depth/fish finder with a depth alarm, so I only look at it when in water I'm not familiar with, or when there's lots of shoals etc.

It's not accurate by a country mile, but it does give me warning when I'm heading into shallow water and is pretty accurate when there is less than 5 feet below.

The system has been excellent for getting into places that we could only dream of previously.

And it is becoming popular, the boat that docks next to me is installing one this spring as well as a few others around the marina.

[Scrimshaw4]

I've had an Interphase sonar scanner , forward and side scan, since 1998. I upgraded it in '09 to the fullcolor display. It works great. In very shallow water it will provide excellent readings but it's signal will confuse your depth sounder. That's not a problem as the unit will provide very accurate depth readings. Only problem is that the company was bought out by Garmin for it's technology and has been discontinued.

[scuba0_1]

Originally Posted by meirriba

Another product
3D forward looking sonar

Nice but heavy price 10000.00

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[scuba0_1]

The more they work the more the price will come down. I would love one on our New boat for sure

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