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Old 09-04-2015, 18:54   #16
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Re: Desktop, too high power cunsumption?

I'm not sure why this is so hard.

There are, excuse me, MEGA BYTES of information about procesors avialable to anyone who chooses to search the information.

On the, gasp!!!, internet.

Remote video screens, 12V vs. 120V power, processors, keyboards, mice/mouse/mouses/trackballs, etc.

This is not necessarily a BOATING question, but rather a "What is the smallest power consumer?" question.

Your signature/avatar also doesn't show what boat you do have.

Help us to help you.

Please.
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Old 09-04-2015, 19:09   #17
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Re: Desktop, too high power cunsumption?

Quote:
Originally Posted by barnakiel View Post
I too would just invest in a powerful laptop (or a mini PC) with an SSD.

Laptops do seem to take shaking up better than most house grade desktops. I have seen mil spec onboard computers, very resilient, very expensive.

Also, when power runs out, the laptop gives you the option to save your work. On a desktop, you need an extra UPS.

I have a friend who post-produces video on a boat. He uses a laptop too.

Well. Whatever. I guess.

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The Australian Defence Force analysed the durability of ruggedized versus consumer laptops over a 10 year period. The result. No difference but users universally hated the clunky waterproof keyboard membranes.

We consider laptops like toilet paper. Just another consumer item. Dont waste your money on expensive 'tough' laptops.

We look for a nice feel and finish, a backlit keyboard and ssd. We dont even bother looking at any other specs.

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Old 09-04-2015, 19:16   #18
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Re: Desktop, too high power cunsumption?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arrandir View Post
I’m interested in photography, that’s one reason why I would like to buy a boat and begin a cruising lifestyle. I’ve read several discussions about using a PC on board, most of them have the conclusion that a laptop is the best on a boat, but I need, compared to a average cruiser, a much more powerful computer. A single image from my camera is 25 Mb and I use HDR and focusing stacking a lot. I would like to bring my desktop on board to the boat I will buy in a few years, but is it "possible"? The continuous current is 6 amps, 15 amps in peakload, add a screen to the power consumption.
Is the power consumption too high on a sailboat (around 30’)? My plan is to use a laptop for everything except working with images and videos, maximum 2 hours/day.
My experience is that 3,5” harddrives are sensitive for vibrations, tilting… 2,5”, which are used in laptops, are less sensitive. Are 3,5” reliable on a sailboat?
A friend who is on this forum just showed me his desktop computer. Its super powerful for his work. The drives as solid state (SSD?) so vibration not a problem.
The actual computer is only about 4 inches by 4 inches. Tiny.
Screen is huge, 21 inches??
He was saying that power usage is minimal, npbut I forget if its run off an inverter or direct 12 v converted into whatever the computer needs.

The kit is out there and could be exactly what you need for high end graphics, video editing (pro level) etc.

I will email him this thread.


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Old 09-04-2015, 19:20   #19
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Re: Desktop, too high power cunsumption?

I just happened to be loading images on my laptop from my camera. Image sizes are up to 56MB. When I bought the new camera, I knew the large file sizes were going to require a new computer. The performance bottle neck was not the CPU but the disk drive when loading and saving images. I ended up buying a SSD drive to replace the mechanical hard on the new laptop which was a planned purchase. However, I did not buy the fastest SSD drive because the price/performance was not worth it.

The system has 8GB of RAM, which has been more than enough, and a i7-3630QM processor running at 2.4 Ghz. There were faster CPU's available but I don't think they would have made much difference photo processing wise so I bought a less expensive CPU. I do not do HDR but I suspect that might require more CPU but that would just cost a bit more money. The laptop also has a built in color calibrator.

I did buy a slightly better graphics adapter but I am not sure it makes much difference for what I do. It certainly is not anywhere near as powerful OR energy hogging as a desktop adapter but it has not been a problem.

One can easily buy a laptop to handle photo processing. I don't see owning a desktop ever again.

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Old 09-04-2015, 20:02   #20
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Re: Desktop, too high power cunsumption?

I've got a Gigabyte BRIX 4500 with 16Gb of RAM and a 1Gb SSD drive aboard (see GIGABYTE - Desktop PC - Mini-PC Barebone - GB-BXi7H-4500 (rev. 1.0)), it uses significantly less power than my previous HP Notebook. I manage thousands of pictures using Lightroom, edit with Photoshop and even do video editing with Adobe Premiere Pro. The I7 4500U 4-core processor with 2.4Ghz deals with these processing requirements with ease, although it does work more when I run concurrent virtual machines with large databases and data warehouse applications. Only when I'm really crunching does the builtin fan turn on, otherwise it is silent with no moving parts at all.

I've got some buck converters so that I can run the BRIX and the monitor directly off my DC battery bank but currently run them off my inverter.
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Old 09-04-2015, 20:05   #21
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Re: Desktop, too high power cunsumption?

Oh, yeah, SSID.

How could I have forgotten that basic idea.

How?

I'm sorry, but this is NOT an issue that has anything to do with boating.

It is ALL about computing issues.

There must be, somewhere, a computer website...............
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Old 09-04-2015, 21:40   #22
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Re: Desktop, too high power cunsumption?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stu Jackson View Post
Oh, yeah, SSID.

How could I have forgotten that basic idea.

How?

I'm sorry, but this is NOT an issue that has anything to do with boating.

It is ALL about computing issues.

There must be, somewhere, a computer website...............
There is

Creativecow.com

(Stands for: creative communities of the world)
You will find a very big active community of users
With many many forums
Ask away
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Old 09-04-2015, 21:54   #23
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Re: Desktop, too high power cunsumption?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stu Jackson View Post
Oh, yeah, SSID.

How could I have forgotten that basic idea.

How?

I'm sorry, but this is NOT an issue that has anything to do with boating.

It is ALL about computing issues.

There must be, somewhere, a computer website...............
Is is just as relevant to cruising (this is "Cruisers Forum" not the "Boating Forum") as the discussions about pressure cookers, looking after pets, etc and a d*mn site more relevant that global warming, jokes, photography and many other threads here.

If you don't like it, just ignore the thread.
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Old 10-04-2015, 08:43   #24
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Re: Desktop, too high power cunsumption?

In a few years, new more powerful laptops will satisfy your desire for processing power. In the meantime, why not focus on finding the boat that will take you to all those great places to photograph?
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Old 10-04-2015, 09:00   #25
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Re: Desktop, too high power cunsumption?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arrandir View Post
Iím interested in photography, thatís one reason why I would like to buy a boat and begin a cruising lifestyle. Iíve read several discussions about using a PC on board, most of them have the conclusion that a laptop is the best on a boat, but I need, compared to a average cruiser, a much more powerful computer. A single image from my camera is 25 Mb and I use HDR and focusing stacking a lot. I would like to bring my desktop on board to the boat I will buy in a few years, but is it "possible"? The continuous current is 6 amps, 15 amps in peakload, add a screen to the power consumption.
Is the power consumption too high on a sailboat (around 30í)? My plan is to use a laptop for everything except working with images and videos, maximum 2 hours/day.
My experience is that 3,5Ē harddrives are sensitive for vibrations, tiltingÖ 2,5Ē, which are used in laptops, are less sensitive. Are 3,5Ē reliable on a sailboat?
You certainly don't need a high end desktop to edit images, even 25MB RAW images... even with photo stacking.

I bought an ASUS Q550LF notebook for $600 as my primary rig. It's got a 15.6" IPS 1920x1080 screen, i7 4500 CPU, 8GB RAM, GeForce GT745M discrete graphics. It has a regular SATA and MSATA connector internally, so I've got a 256GB mSSD to boot from, a 1TB SSD for data storage, and another 1TB HD (that it came with) I put in place of the DVD drive. I've rendered video on it, and it's not unbearably slow.

I would say any current (mid to high end) i5 or i7 notebook can use photoshop for HDR/focus stacking all day long without any lag.

Keep it simple, you're going to live on a 30' boat, you're going to need all the space you can get.

The key is to get an IPS screen (or use an external IPS monitor) and get discrete graphics (preferably nvidia for cuda support).

If you intend to stay at the dock, a desktop will be fine because you have shore power (Except for the space issue). Also consider a desktop will put off more heat.

I shoot with a 5d2, a sony nex-5r, and a sony a6000 (and a bunch of gopros)
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Old 10-04-2015, 09:03   #26
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Re: Desktop, too high power cunsumption?

As most of the other posters have commented - you are probably using some "old" and power-hungry components.

I ran several simple mid-range HP lapbooks and they were never affected by vibration or anything else - except - periodically I would get salt water spray on the LCD screen or just wear out the LCD screen and then have to replace the computer.

A couple of times, I bought and replaced the LCD from parts purchased on-line but then I still had an "old" machine for a cost rather close of buying a new system. So I "deep-sixed" the old and bought the new. Which is not my favorite thing as it takes a week to get all the games and other "crap" programs off the new one and then transfer "my" favorites to the new plus all the files, maps, etc. And some of my favorite navigation stuff is legacy and might not work on whatever the "new" OS is these days.

Anyway, back to the subject - it might also be that the auxiliary things like monitors, external drives, servers, etc. are the real power hogs and need updating more than the computer.

One thing I did was install UPS power supplies so that power interuptions would not trash whatever I was working on at the time. Power interuptions, IMHO, are the real hazard of working with computers onboard. And loosing hours of work is seriously a headache generating situation.

Also, the advantage of lapbook computers is being able to take them ashore for which I feel it is mandatory to have a "Pelican" computer case that is water-tight. One friend was holding his lapbook and stepping over the lifeline to get ashore when his foot snagged and the computer went into 15 feet of water straight to the bottom. Scratch one computer - that was many times more expensive than a "Pelican" case.

But bottom-line - that kind of power drain is not a limiting factor - refrigeration units on a boat draw more than that. And with careful selection as outlined by many other posters above - the latest and greatest in today's computers will be ancient dinosaurs in a couple of years.
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Old 10-04-2015, 09:23   #27
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Re: Desktop, too high power cunsumption?

Perhaps I'll take a different approach to the question. You can have whatever computer you want, but you'll need to have the power system built to supply it.

If the desktop (and screen) takes 500 watts to power, that is probably around 50 amps at 12 volt once it gets through the (pure sine wave, I imagine) inverter. (An inverter is the easiest option, unless you really understand how computer work and electronics. A 12v computer is tricky business.)

Put this into your power consumption sheet you should already be building and see if you can install enough battery and charging capacity to handle it and all your other power needs.

Just thinking about it, I would suspect a desktop you are thinking of and the increase battery and charging capacity needed is generally too big for a 30 footer, where space for cruising is already at a premium. But if you toss enough money at it and make other sacrifices, I am sure it can be done.

I actually just did this process and landed on going with a 2013 15 inch MacBook Pro. It has the CPU, graphics card and Ram needed for the editing pictures and video in Adobe's CC while being much lower power than a desktop. Also, remember you can run windows on a Mac. Official refurbished ones can be had for $1,500.


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Old 10-04-2015, 09:47   #28
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Re: Desktop, too high power cunsumption?

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Originally Posted by StuM View Post
Is is just as relevant to cruising (this is "Cruisers Forum" not the "Boating Forum") as the discussions about pressure cookers, looking after pets, etc and a d*mn site more relevant that global warming, jokes, photography and many other threads here.

If you don't like it, just ignore the thread.
That wasn't the point.

Most all of the replies to the issues you mention have included LINKS to other 'sites that discuss those things in MUCH more detail.

There are tons of discussions here about pressure cookers. I have one. All the threads are helpful. All the theeads are so repetitive, because they link to a few well known pressure cooker specific websites. And every single one of the OPs could have found that information by either using the search engine on this forum or Google.

Other issues, like pets, are always engaging, because many folks have different pets with different proclivities. Many are quite funny, and all include some humor and many have photos.

I like the JOKE THREAD.

Beats asking about computing power, any day.

And global warming has great relevance to boating, 'cuz as the ea level rises, that island you're lookin' for in the South Pacific may not be there in a decade or two. Good thing to know, dontcha think?
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Old 10-04-2015, 10:19   #29
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Re: Desktop, too high power cunsumption?

You've gotten some great advice so far!

Wait until you buy your boat, then buy the laptop with the fastest CPU (or best price/performance CPU) then install an SSD drive in it. Mine could have come with an SSD drive, but it was too small and expensive for my tastes, so I ordered it with a 1TB HDD, then bought a Samsung 500GB SSD for less, (Samsung is my fave, all of my computers, including desktops, use SSD drives for speed and reliability) imaged the HDD onto the SSD, popped the SSD in and installed the HDD into a USB 3.0 enclosure and use it for backup files.
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Old 10-04-2015, 10:23   #30
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Re: Desktop, too high power cunsumption?

Thanks for all the replies.
I understand that you canít understand why I ask this question already now when I donít even have a boat. Thatís complicated and I will not bother you with that.
I think I will hope that new technology will solve the problem. I have thought about that before and have not been completely satisfied when I check what the past years have brought to us, but I think I will say that it is good enough after two more years development. I hope I will have more patience to wait while the computer is working when I quit my job and start cruising. I have to stay away from the camera store, a new camera can become expensive. I need a better computer if I buy a new camera. I need more solar panels to run the computer. I need a bigger boat to have enough space for the solar panels.

Quote:
There has already been a thread on this on this website. Do a search for 'Using a desktop computer aboard an offshore boat'.

I read several posts on this forum before I posted my question, but I found no new discussions with the information I wanted. The computers we buy for writing e-mails and other easy tasks need more than 30 minutes to complete some tasks I give them, it is not possible to use the computer during that time.

Quote:
If you build a really powerful desktop, it's going to draw a lot of power. I built a video editing machine - Intel I7 2700 unlocked CPU, overclocked to 5GHz, a medium/high end video card with a lot of processing power. The CPU alone drew 175w at full load, the GPU and shaders, etc consumed another 275w. A watercooling system with a total of 3 fans, plus 2 SATA3 SSDs in RAID 0 for speed were used. The system would not run with a 450w or 650w power supply, it took a 950w power supply to provide the clean power the system required to pass burn in and benchmark testing.

Iím glad I donít need that computer.

Quote:
There must be, somewhere, a computer website...............

The problem with those websites is that few people there know the limitations when you use a computer on a boat. I should have posted my questions there if I wanted to know something about computers in a house.
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