Cruisers Forum
 


Closed Thread
  This discussion is proudly sponsored by:
Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about their products on Cruisers Forums. Advertise Here
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 01-01-2017, 16:44   #1
Registered User
 
SV Enough's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: St. Petersburg FL
Boat: Morgan, center cockpit sloop, 44 - Enough
Posts: 123
Class B AIS waste of money

I'm hoping to prompt some discussion on what a total waste of money purchasing and installing a class B transponder on your please craft is.

If your objective is is "be seen by commercial traffic", forget it! I personally have been summoned to the bridge to SPECIFICALLY check Furuno/ECDIS radar settings and ensure that "except class B" is ON, meaning exclude them. For proof see

http://gcaptain.com/class-filtering-targets-ships/

Mark Fay,
Merchant Marine Credential Jr. Engineer, QMED, AS-E / MSC ET
SV Enough is offline  
Old 01-01-2017, 16:48   #2
Long Range Cruiser
 
MarkJ's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Australian living on "Sea Life" currently in England.
Boat: Beneteau 393 "Sea Life"
Posts: 12,822
Images: 25
Re: Class B AIS waste of money

Yes you are right.

Total waste of money.

Especially when ignorant illegal ships officers turn the damn thing off.
__________________
Notes on a Circumnavigation.
OurLifeAtSea.com

Somalia Pirates and our Convoy
MarkJ is offline  
Old 01-01-2017, 16:54   #3
Registered User

Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Bellingham
Boat: Outbound 44
Posts: 9,319
Re: Class B AIS waste of money

What nonsense. AIS is very high on the bang for the buck electronics on a cruising boat. If a commercial ship needs to or decides to declutter a screen to make their display more readable, that's their choice. It doesn't negate all the other times that an AIS signal is a good value.
__________________
Paul
Paul L is offline  
Old 01-01-2017, 17:12   #4
Senior Cruiser
 
StuM's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Port Moresby,Papua New Guinea
Boat: FP Belize Maestro 43 and OPBs
Posts: 12,888
Re: Class B AIS waste of money

Quote:
Originally Posted by SV Enough View Post
I'm hoping to prompt some discussion on what a total waste of money purchasing and installing a class B transponder on your please craft is.

If your objective is is "be seen by commercial traffic", forget it! I personally have been summoned to the bridge to SPECIFICALLY check Furuno/ECDIS radar settings and ensure that "except class B" is ON, meaning exclude them. For proof see

Class B AIS - Filtering Of Targets By Ships – gCaptain

Mark Fay,
Merchant Marine Credential Jr. Engineer, QMED, AS-E / MSC ET
Absolute FUD!.

From your link, this:

"While Class B data can, and sometimes should, be suppressed in port it is important technology that will help us avoid boats which venture offshore. Therefore deactivating the display of Class-B targets on your ECDIS and RADAR is an action that should be logged and a note should be placed in your passage plan (or penciled next to the sea buoy on the chart) to remind all watchstanders to reactivate the setting once you have set out for sea."

I don't rely on a ship using AIS in a harbour/port area to see me. I make damned sure that I don't cause any trouble for the ships regardless of whether they see me or not. And even receive only AIS is fine for that in a harbour.
StuM is offline  
Old 01-01-2017, 17:21   #5
Moderator Emeritus
 
Paul Elliott's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 4,663
Images: 4
Re: Class B AIS waste of money

I've had numerous ships on the high seas confirm that they are seeing my Class-B transponder. Some of these have initiated the VHF conversation, just because they were interested in what a sailboat was doing 1000 miles from land.

So, perhaps some ships disable their AIS Class-B reception, but in my unscientific survey most don't.
__________________
Paul Elliott, S/V VALIS - Pacific Seacraft 44 #16 - Friday Harbor, WA
www.sailvalis.com
Paul Elliott is offline  
Old 01-01-2017, 17:31   #6
Registered User
 
Cotemar's Avatar

Community Sponsor

Join Date: Dec 2007
Boat: Mahe 36, Helia 44 Evo, MY 37
Posts: 5,731
Class B AIS waste of money

Class B AIS is as good as you make it.

If ships do not want to see you in a harbor, so be it.

It's the LAW OF TONNAGE. Stay out of their way or pay the price.
.
.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	speed_2_ship-hits-boat.jpg
Views:	1748
Size:	55.9 KB
ID:	138806  
Cotemar is offline  
Old 01-01-2017, 17:40   #7
Registered User
 
Polux's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Portugal/Med
Boat: Comet 41s
Posts: 6,140
Re: Class B AIS waste of money

Quote:
Originally Posted by SV Enough View Post
I'm hoping to prompt some discussion on what a total waste of money purchasing and installing a class B transponder on your please craft is.

If your objective is is "be seen by commercial traffic", forget it! I personally have been summoned to the bridge to SPECIFICALLY check Furuno/ECDIS radar settings and ensure that "except class B" is ON, meaning exclude them. For proof see

Class B AIS - Filtering Of Targets By Ships – gCaptain

Mark Fay,
Merchant Marine Credential Jr. Engineer, QMED, AS-E / MSC ET
What I have heard is that ships only turn AIS B of in some zones with high intensity traffic where the many AIS B targets can be very confusing.

It was on one of those zones that the Captain disconnected the AIS B targets?
Polux is offline  
Old 01-01-2017, 18:05   #8
Registered User
 
daletournier's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Australia
Boat: Catalina 470
Posts: 4,578
Re: Class B AIS waste of money

My experience is that many ships haven't seen me until I radio them. But, I definitely don't think they are a waste of money, they are right up there on my must have list.

Sent from my vivo Y35 using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app
daletournier is offline  
Old 01-01-2017, 18:08   #9
Senior Cruiser
 
boatman61's Avatar

Community Sponsor
Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: PORTUGAL
Posts: 30,561
Images: 2
pirate Re: Class B AIS waste of money

Definitely NOT a waste of money if you feel you need one..
Otherwise.. Yes..
__________________

It was a dark and stormy night and the captain of the ship said.. "Hey Jim, spin us a yarn." and the yarn began like this.. "It was a dark and stormy night.."
boatman61 is offline  
Old 01-01-2017, 18:11   #10
Registered User
 
daletournier's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Australia
Boat: Catalina 470
Posts: 4,578
Re: Class B AIS waste of money

The thing with a ais is there's no downside that I can see, how can knowing exactly where ships are in relation to your own vessel or they ( once notified) knowing exactly where you are be a bad thing?

Sent from my vivo Y35 using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app
daletournier is offline  
Old 01-01-2017, 18:14   #11
Moderator
 
Jim Cate's Avatar

Join Date: May 2008
Location: cruising SW Pacific
Boat: Jon Sayer 1-off 46 ft fract rig sloop strip plank in W Red Cedar
Posts: 21,135
Re: Class B AIS waste of money

In waters crowded with pleasure boats using class B AIS, one can hardly blame the ship for turning off the B alarms. I usually do that myself when in such places!

But so far I've not seen that ships have filtered me out at sea. I've spoken to a couple who were not altering course at great distance, just to be sure. They have all said that they were tracking us and would alter course as required. There may not be 100% compliance with allowing class B alarms at sea, but then there isn't 100% compliance with the requirement for competent watchkeepers on the bridge (as Jessica Watson found out).

Waste of money? Ridiculous, IMO.

Jim
__________________
Jim and Ann s/v Insatiable II, lying Port Cygnet Tasmania once again.
Jim Cate is online now  
Old 01-01-2017, 19:31   #12
Registered User

Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Back in Montt.
Boat: Westerly Sealord
Posts: 8,178
Re: Class B AIS waste of money

OK, hands up everybody who has followed the trail that led from Gcaptain to Panbo and then all the way down to Dr Norris... Panbo: The Marine Electronics Hub: Class B AIS filtering, the word from Dr. Norris

The desire of 'big ship' bridge teams to disable Class B AIS would possibly not be so great if WAFIs turned off their AIS when it was not needed... eg.. when alongside ( see pic ) and when just out for a Sunday sail around the harbour.

As the good Doctor says .. ' It should not be forgotten that the bridge windows form the most widely used navigational aid. '

Another small note... I have spent some time in the not too distant past in the Auckland area where all the fast ferries run Class B as do quite large ships of the Royal New Zealand Navy.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Class B.jpg
Views:	1000
Size:	66.3 KB
ID:	138811  
__________________
A little bit about Chile can be found here https://www.docdroid.net/bO63FbL/202...anchorages-pdf
El Pinguino is offline  
Old 01-01-2017, 19:42   #13
Registered User

Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Back in Montt.
Boat: Westerly Sealord
Posts: 8,178
Re: Class B AIS waste of money

Speaking of which...

Hello peoples....... you really do not need to be running AIS in Sydney Harbour on a sunny afternoon.....!!
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	sydney.jpg
Views:	854
Size:	396.9 KB
ID:	138812  
__________________
A little bit about Chile can be found here https://www.docdroid.net/bO63FbL/202...anchorages-pdf
El Pinguino is offline  
Old 01-01-2017, 19:47   #14
Registered User

Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Florida, Daytona
Boat: Cabo Rico 38
Posts: 236
Re: Class B AIS waste of money

...And, even if they MIGHT filter my signal out, I still see them - If you don't expect them to be looking out for you, you wont get surprised...
Afrinus is offline  
Old 01-01-2017, 21:40   #15
Senior Cruiser
 
newhaul's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: puget sound washington
Boat: 1968 Islander bahama 24 hull 182, 1963 columbia 29 defender. hull # 60
Posts: 12,113
Re: Class B AIS waste of money

In some parts of the world they are actually required on foreign pleasure craft.
__________________
Non illigitamus carborundum
newhaul is offline  
Closed Thread

Tags
ais, money

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Navigational Aids are a Waste of Money ! sneuman Navigation 189 02-04-2021 06:24
Money, money money.. and Banks Tortz Liveaboard's Forum 29 29-09-2016 17:13
Money Money Money loop Dollars & Cents 46 01-05-2011 17:54
J-School for Racing - Worth it or Waste of Money? BIG JOE Training, Licensing & Certification 14 27-10-2009 05:36
'Naval Architects and Designers Are a Waste of Money' LtBrett Construction, Maintenance & Refit 16 13-09-2009 20:47

Advertise Here


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 01:03.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.