Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
  This discussion is proudly sponsored by:
Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about their products on Cruisers Forums. Advertise Here
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 22-07-2019, 02:57   #1
Registered User

Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 13
Choosing new electronics today

Hi All. Im looking for any guidance from those better informed then I am.
We have an all Raymarine environment which is as old as my 440 Voyage Cat which is a 2004. This includes a C120 plotter with ST60 wind & depth, Raymarine 24 mile radar and ST6000 autopilot, AIS receiver and Raymarine bracelets.
We are looking at upgrading the chart plotter and AIS as a minimum but pondering a more comprehensive upgrade. Any knowledge or suggestions RE how much to replace or brands eg should we consider moving to Garmin. What extras are now available which we should consider eg AIS to PFDs and ability to use iPads. Any warning on got-yas or limitations.
Thanks in advance
__________________

gezza is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-07-2019, 05:37   #2
Senior Cruiser
 
tkeithlu's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Carrabelle, Florida
Boat: Fiberglas shattering 44' steel trawler
Posts: 1,334
Re: Choosing new electronics today

Hmmm. General thought. To what degree do you want an integrated system, a glass cockpit as it were, and to what extent do you want to keep different instruments, largely nav, separate? Both have advantages and disadvantages. An integrated system can put everything on one or two screens and overlay radar and AIS on charts, for example, but requires that you go with one manufacturer, since there is no really common system. It also can mean that you lose the whole thing when the monitor fails. Separate elements allow you to pick and choose the best from several manufacturers, but you lose integration and need more space at your helm for displays.

I went with separate, but I have lots of cockpit space and no problem integrating different screens in my head. My plan B is having some ofthe system when one element fails. You might make the opposite decision.

Aside, I have not found any Garmin electronics I don't like, but sometimes a cheaper second best is fine with me.
__________________

__________________
Never let anything mechanical know that you are in a hurry.
tkeithlu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-07-2019, 05:56   #3
Registered User
 
MV Wanderlust's Avatar

Join Date: May 2016
Location: Palmetto, FL
Boat: "Wanderlust" -- 1999 Jefferson Rivanna 52'
Posts: 781
Images: 27
Re: Choosing new electronics today

What Tim said. The level of desired integration plays into the brands you choose. That being said, the NMEA2000 communications protocol, which devices can and do use to communicate, is supposed to bridge the gap between brands.

We also have a Raymarine C120W. It is our backup chartplotter and is mostly now used as a monitor for the rear view camera. We have a much more modern Garmin 7612xsv chartplotter as our primary. It is tied into the NMEA 2000 backbone and is able to communicate with the Simrad AP28 autopilot. Different brands, but the NMEA 2000 protocol allows the autopilot to read nav data from the Garmin and auto-steer for us (when conditions allow).

Like Tim, I've never found a Garmin product that I didn't like. Easy-to-use interfaces and good customer support.

John
__________________
John and Deb Easley
John - USCG 50 ton Master
1999 Jefferson Rivanna 52' CPMY
MV Wanderlust is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-07-2019, 08:24   #4
Registered User
 
Svan's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Toronto
Boat: PDQ Capella 36
Posts: 111
Re: Choosing new electronics today

Our 2003 boat has same generation equipment as OP. Four years ago we upgraded the plotter to a raymarine c95 (non touchscreen). Then in following years our depth sounder failed, autopilot started to do crazy Ivans, the windex crumbled. I switched from a NMEA183 backbone to seatalk NG and raymarine replacements for all. Everything worked the first time and the autopilot install was trivial as the drive motor and wheel mount were unchanged.

The plotter has tighter integration with the autopilot than you would get over NMEA but the c series interface is so nitwit i have had to disable it.
I still am very envious of garmin plotters, I have liked their interfaces since the earliest AA-powered hiking GPS.
Svan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-07-2019, 09:22   #5
Registered User

Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Allentown, PA
Boat: Hunter 46
Posts: 9
Re: Choosing new electronics today

I have pretty much the same system and of the same vintage. Pretty sure you'll need to replace the radar if you upgrade even to a newer vintage Raymarine.
whynot929 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-07-2019, 09:38   #6
Registered User
 
Orion Jim's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Noank, Ct. USA
Boat: Cape Dory 31
Posts: 1,614
Images: 8
Re: Choosing new electronics today

I replaced all my electronics last fall. I went from a Raymarine C80 to a Garmin 7610.....the improvement from my 10 year old plotter is amazing. My Raymarine wind instrument was replaced by a Garmin G Wind sensor coupled to a Garmin GMI20 display.....phenomenal upgrade. I replaced my Raymarine Tridata with a Raymarine I50 Tridata since I always liked this display. I also added a Garmin AIS “B” transponder. I replaced my Raymarine radar with a Garmin GMR Fantom Doppler unit, another amazing improvement. I replaced all the cables, power lines, the depth transducer and the speed paddle wheel. I didn’t want anything old left for use with anything new to be certain the upgrade was complete. Everything works great and I’ve had no issues at all. The new instruments and the multi function display are light years ahead of the 10 year old stuff they replaced.
Orion Jim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-07-2019, 10:22   #7
Registered User

Join Date: Sep 2016
Boat: Montgomery 23
Posts: 136
Re: Choosing new electronics today

Quote:
Originally Posted by gezza View Post
Hi All. Im looking for any guidance from those better informed then I am.
We have an all Raymarine environment which is as old as my 440 Voyage Cat which is a 2004. This includes a C120 plotter with ST60 wind & depth, Raymarine 24 mile radar and ST6000 autopilot, AIS receiver and Raymarine bracelets.
We are looking at upgrading the chart plotter and AIS as a minimum but pondering a more comprehensive upgrade. Any knowledge or suggestions RE how much to replace or brands eg should we consider moving to Garmin. What extras are now available which we should consider eg AIS to PFDs and ability to use iPads. Any warning on got-yas or limitations.
Thanks in advance
While Garmin does seem to be the darling of marine electronics just now, we've struggled mightily trying to 'update' their products (after they're a few years old) in the past. And while they might be much improved I'm still cranky about it and would look to Ray, Simrad, or Furuno myself. Maybe Vesper for AIS. We don't integrate anything, and consider individual electronic devices a sort of poor-man's redundancy.
rmlarson1098 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-07-2019, 11:19   #8
Registered User
 
Stu Jackson's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Cowichan Bay, BC (Maple Bay Marina)
Posts: 7,909
Re: Choosing new electronics today

a friend of a friend had a not-so-old Raymarine system that worked just fine. Since she has more $$ than brains she had it ripped out and replaced with another manufacturer's equipment (doesn't matter what she bought). She is now aghast at how much she misses her old equipment, which she knew how to make work. She bought a touch screen in an area where it rains a lot and even with a full cockpit enclosure on her IP350 she dislikes it (no buttons for backup or choice).



Point being, that before you leap, make darned sure you go TRY IT OUT IN THE STORE.


Some brands are a LOT less intuitive than others. Some brands have heaps and levels of menus that would make Microsoft blush!


Good luck. You may very well need a lot of it.
__________________
Stu Jackson
Catalina 34 #224 (1986) C34IA Secretary
Cowichan Bay, BC, (Maple Bay Marina) SR/FK, M25, Rocna 10 (22#) (NZ model)
Stu Jackson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-07-2019, 11:23   #9
Registered User

Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: Scotland
Boat: 42ft Moody Ketch
Posts: 392
Re: Choosing new electronics today

If it all works why replace the only real difference is pretty colors and those that think they need to update every 3 years bit like a home computer and TV this is how companies survive they market their products on the fear that you are missing out. Your existing AIS will do the same as a new one, same as chart plotter etc.
Yuor money your choice my opinon
tarian is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-07-2019, 11:29   #10
Registered User

Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: East Coast Florida
Boat: Chris Craft 38 Commander 1965
Posts: 256
Re: Choosing new electronics today

Much of the systems can be mix and match now days except Radar and Chartplotter need to of the same manufacturer (and sometime series). As said NMEA 2000 has solved many of the interconnectivity issues - except for those things like sonar and radar imaging. sonar data can be shared over the network so if you only need digital depth numbers on a particular station those can be displayed on many devices.

All the major companies seem to have similar product lines and it boils down to user interface and ease of use. Garmin is not often a choice of professional installer/repairmen because they feel Garmin is more of a self installed/configured type market and has limited repairability - ie lack of ability to get repair parts from the factory. When things go wrong it usually goes back to the factory and if a current model may be repaired or replaced. If Not then you must upgrade - very little repairability.

Updates are easy with Active captain these days although keeping multiple devices synced can be a little intimidating.

My system includes chartplotters all GPSMap new 7607 xsv, a 1042 xsv, old 740s, Garmin Steadycast heading sensor, Raymarine EVOlution with ST70 and newer controllers, Standard Horizon VHF with DSC and a PC running windows 10 and Open CPN. All networked on the NMEA 2000 backbone. Maretron Fuel management system. Backup sounder is an old Sitex CVS106 not networked.
Before the wiring was incomplete and horrendously messy with the old NMEA 0183.
Squanderbucks is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-07-2019, 11:31   #11
Registered User
 
gulfcoastsailor's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Florida
Boat: Freedom 32
Posts: 149
Images: 2
Re: Choosing new electronics today

If you are talking brand names, my go-to everything sailing expert guy says right now the right brand is Raymarine. According to him, Raymarine entered a long term R&D with the USN. Not only are they influxed with cash but they are in a position to create some advanced civilian units from the expertise they are getting by dealing with the USN.
gulfcoastsailor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-07-2019, 13:15   #12
Registered User

Join Date: Jul 2017
Posts: 236
Re: Choosing new electronics today

I am not sure I would move to Garmin. In my opinion, Raymarine is at least one step ahead of Garmin and B&G right now, especially on UI and flexibility of integration (I am stuck with B&G, but if I could choose today, I would go Raymarine).
iPad support is a must. That way, you can have an "infinite" number of screens onboard, plus you integrate seamlessly with many really cool apps and take advantage of the iPad/iPhone UI.
FabioC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-07-2019, 17:18   #13
Registered User
 
CarinaPDX's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Portland, Oregon, USA
Boat: 31' Cape George Cutter
Posts: 2,349
Re: Choosing new electronics today

If your system is fully functional then why replace it? Perhaps you have a load of money burning a hole in your pocket? If the chartplotter has current charts available and the radar works then what is the compelling reason to replace them? While newer equipment will have some new features, which may provide some pleasure or utility, is it really worth it? It seems to me that you have a good, well-integrated package that solves the problems, and any increment will cost a lot more in time and money than justified. YMMV

If it were me and I had some module, like the AIS, for which there are significant upgrades available then I would start by putting in an N2K backbone if you don't already have one. Connect the backbone to the chartplotter and then add N2K modules as needed. With N2K it will also be easy to replace the chartplotter when the time comes.

I was just talking with another CF member who has Furuno NN3D MFDs, no longer current products. We both agreed that having controls separate from the display was a big advantage: putting salty fingers on a touchscreen degrades the visibility. I spend enough time rinsing the salt off of the display as it is - I don't need to add to the problem. Our MFDs are about a decade old, but current charts are available and they certainly are more than adequate tools.

As much as I like messing about with the latest technology, I think it is better to spend time and money out sailing instead of making the perfect boat... (And I speak from experience here)

Greg
CarinaPDX is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-07-2019, 17:50   #14
Registered User

Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Fremantle
Boat: South Coast 36
Posts: 12
Re: Choosing new electronics today

With all the new sources of boat and navigation data NMEA 0183 and 2000 are getting on a bit. Signal K is starting to look like a good option.

Being able to have two way communication between the 3 protocols it is a good way to have a staged transfer to new technology. I currently have outdated (still functional) Raymarine system, I like the idea of being able to add tablets (Ipad, Android) to monitor and control the Raymarine system as well as the engine, fridges, charging and more.

Signal K Signal K » Welcome
Signal K Gallery Signal K » Gallery
A good article on Signal K including the Wilhelm App http://i-marineapps.blogspot.com/201...rine+Apps)&m=1

Mark
aualby is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25-07-2019, 00:00   #15
Registered User

Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: San Francisco Bay area
Boat: Condor Trimaran 30 foot
Posts: 1,270
Re: Choosing new electronics today

Mark, thanks for the info about Signal K. I didn’t know.
__________________

alansmith is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
electronics

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Best Electronics Suite for Largish Cruiser Today ? Dockhead Marine Electronics 12 26-01-2011 09:18
Choosing Sails for New Boat - Help! pacmaann2 Deck hardware: Rigging, Sails & Hoisting 6 21-07-2009 14:15
Choosing a new roller furler. Help bmiller Monohull Sailboats 12 11-07-2007 06:17
Help with choosing a new headsail bmiller General Sailing Forum 5 14-04-2006 20:34
help in choosing a cruiser claynnc Monohull Sailboats 16 03-01-2006 20:20

Advertise Here


Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 05:52.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
×

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.