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Old 27-02-2013, 15:05   #1
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can I mix different rudder angle indicator and different autopilots

dear reader
I need a rudder indicator for my raymarine 400g autopilot.
now my question.
Can I mix different Rudder Angle Indicator and different autopilots.
Do I need a raymarine rudder indicator or can I use for example a Raritan etc.

thanks
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Old 27-02-2013, 17:13   #2
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Re: can I mix different rudder angle indicator and different autopilots

It depends. There are a few different "standards" for rudder indicators. Some are resistive, some are variable frequency, and some talk directly on the N2K bus. There may be others too. You'll need to read up on your AP and existing indicator to see what their specs are and see if you can deduce the type. Then read up on alternates and match up the specs. You might find some interchangeability. But then again, you might not.

The great thing about standards is that everyone gets their own.
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Old 28-02-2013, 03:20   #3
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Re: can I mix different rudder angle indicator and different autopilots

thanks for the answer.
Like I said I have a raymarine 400g but not the rudder indicator what I need to complete the system. Now new this thing cost approx 300 us. On ebay it goes still used for approx 150.- For this kind of money I can but a used autopilot with the indicator for much less from another brand. I have time and can search a little bit.
If any other ideas come up let me know.

thanks
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Old 28-02-2013, 08:55   #4
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Re: can I mix different rudder angle indicator and different autopilots

A bit confused. Is your rudder indicator not part of your autopilot? Are you looking for an indicator or a transducer which is the device that sends the rudder angle feedback to the autopilot and sometimes to a seperate indicator which is part of your instrumentation? As previously posted there are a few different types. If it is purely resistive the unit can be recalibrated, however many of the transducers are proprietary. ( a way for the companies to rip you off)
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Old 28-02-2013, 14:31   #5
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Re: can I mix different rudder angle indicator and different autopilots

hello
what I need for my raymarine 440g is normally this unit

Raymarine-Rotary-Rudder-Refere-M81105

New this is approx. 300 us. Also used still 150-200.-us
My question is only — are there other brands compatible and what make this unit so expensive. It s basically only a potentiometer.

thanks
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Old 02-03-2013, 12:11   #6
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Re: can I mix different rudder angle indicator and different autopilots

Generally speaking they are not interchangable. Your best bet wold be to find a used Raymarine pilot and get the rudder reference from that and then sell the rest of the AP.

A rudder indicator is the display of the rudder angle. It is a standalone instrument or part of the pilot head. The rudder reference (transducer) is the part that attaches to your quadrant (etc) and provides the rudder position signal to the AP.

I recall that Raymarinne uses a common rudder reference for all it's AP but don't quote me on that.

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Old 02-03-2013, 12:30   #7
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Re: can I mix different rudder angle indicator and different autopilots

If I can find it, have the rudder indicator somewhere. PM me if you want to buy it.
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Old 04-03-2013, 02:07   #8
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Re: can I mix different rudder angle indicator and different autopilots

hello roverhi,
Thanks for the offer. I would love it.
Here is my email. temp@awab.net
If you have a chance to find it give my a short notice.
all the best
peter
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Old 12-03-2013, 23:35   #9
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Re: can I mix different rudder angle indicator and different autopilots

Hi Awab,

maybe you have solved this ? FYI: I have built an autopilot and have made my own sensor that works great with the Raymarine products. Their electronics sends a low voltage, about 2 volts, across a linear potentiometer. The wiper of course goes back to the brain and sends the position voltage. I used a 8K ohm pot but added two small addtional pots to allow me to adjust the precise center point without having to mechanically move the pot. In summary, you can create a fine sensor with a high quality potentiometer, of course it must be kept dry.
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Old 13-03-2013, 13:02   #10
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Re: can I mix different rudder angle indicator and different autopilots

Look at Rudder Position Sensor-Raymarine to Simrad as well

I posted there:

Just measured my Ray position sensor.

It appears to be 2 resistors plus a linear pot.

Red---1.75K fixed---1.7k pot---1.75 k fixed---green
Blue-------------------^


Who knows if this line art will show up. The blue is the wiper.

Regards
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Old 22-04-2013, 17:58   #11
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Re: can I mix different rudder angle indicator and different autopilots

Ah, How wrong I was.... THe Ray Rudder reference is a single 5K linear pot with stops that limit its movement to 120 degrees. This results in the above measurments more or less.

Here is what I found:


ST60 Rudder reference transducerDescription
The Rudder Reference transducer (M81105) contains a single-turn 5k ohm plastic
potentiometer to provide the autopilot with rudder position information. When the
unit is replaced, correct installation is vital to achieve optimum steering
performance. Transducer arm movement is limited to +/- 60 degrees. Care must be
taken to make sure that the arm is opposite the cable entry when the rudder is
amidships. Failure to do this could result in damage to the rudder reference
transducer if the arm is driven onto its stops by the steering system.
Faulty rudder reference transducers should be replaced as a complete unit.
Functional Test
Disconnect the rudder reference transducer from the autopilot and check for
continuity.
Cable colour Arm position Resistance
Green/red Any position 5k ohm +/- 5%
Blue/green Anti clockwise stop 1.66k ohm +/- 10%
Blue/green Clockwise stop 3.3k ohm +/- 10
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Old 24-04-2013, 15:25   #12
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Re: can I mix different rudder angle indicator and different autopilots

hello,
thanks for this info. In the meantime I got an ray rudder indicator.
But still good to know.
all the best
peter
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