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Old 08-04-2014, 18:35   #31
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Re: Any current Maretron Wind Speed Users?

Garmin uses it's own GPS antenna. My Garmin will not work with my Vesper XB-8000 either because it requires it's own antenna and they can't be run at the same time. And it will not recognize the Vesper antenna.

So my Maretron, Garmin, Vesper and Garmin 441s are all on their own backbone, which is fine with me. As well the Garmin will not show the Airmar heading sensor on its sensor list, which is identical to the Garmin heading sensor. But it seems to be working.
My brand new Garmin MFD failed on the way to SF so all I really lost was was a big screen and radar.
And here I got the impression that all NMEA 4000 stuff was supposed to be able to communicate with each other.
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Old 08-04-2014, 19:57   #32
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Re: Any current Maretron Wind Speed Users?

Well, Garmin is off my list…

Mark
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Old 08-04-2014, 21:17   #33
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Re: Any current Maretron Wind Speed Users?

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Originally Posted by colemj View Post
Well, Garmin is off my list…

Mark
Garmin would not interface correctly with my Simrad DD15 rudder sensor either... we had to replace it with a Garmin rudder sensor.

If I could go back... I would look at Furuno or Simrad more closely.
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Old 09-04-2014, 08:49   #34
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Re: Any current Maretron Wind Speed Users?

zboss: It's an Orca (Orca Green Marine Masthead Photodiode Lights - LED Nav Lights - Navigation Lights - Lighting - Downwind Marine). Notice the black plastic vertical band down the face. Nice unit, it has a daytime shut-off switch, which was disconcerting when I tested the light and it wouldn't work, until my hand partially covered the lamp and set things right. When the anchor light and the nav lights are switched on together, it makes the strobe light work at one second intervals. Nice feature for attracting attention.
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Old 09-04-2014, 09:20   #35
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Re: Any current Maretron Wind Speed Users?

Quote:
Originally Posted by zboss View Post
Garmin would not interface correctly with my Simrad DD15 rudder sensor either... we had to replace it with a Garmin rudder sensor.

If I could go back... I would look at Furuno or Simrad more closely.
If all of this is generally true and not something specific about your system, then it sounds like Garmin has gotten too big for its britches and is trying to lock people in like Raymarine did in the past. Perhaps the marine market will deal with them the same way they dealt with Raymarine…

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Old 09-04-2014, 09:55   #36
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Re: Any current Maretron Wind Speed Users?

I will say that Garmins service seems to be adequate. When you call them you get to talk to a Western person.
When the MFD was having trouble with lines on the display they sent me an updated chip. Then when it crashed a week later they gave me a warrantee code to send it back for rework, which only took a couple weeks.

The reason I went with Garmin was the radar, and I didn't want to mix devices any more then I had to. But it all works now, just separately. Maretron and Furuno displays were expensive.
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Old 09-04-2014, 20:11   #37
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Re: Any current Maretron Wind Speed Users?

I do think that Garmin is going through growing pains... its expensive to test every version of every piece of NMEA 2000 equipment, and they have to support a much wider range of products (aviation and automative equipment for example) that simrad and other marine centric companies do not.

I am not sure that they are trying to lock us in but (through my profession) I am familiar with many of the people working software testing at Garmin corporate. IMO, they are more of a consumer level software company than a semi-pro hardware company. There is nothing wrong with that, its just that the focus and approaches to development are a little different.

They continually update their firmware and make it easy to upgrade and they have added a lot of really cool features in the latest update, including support for Garmin Helm and the use of laylines for tacking and gybing, features that are available on competitors hardware that was not available when we purchased our plotter. From that perspective, we are pleased that we are getting better features from our existing investment.
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Old 09-04-2014, 20:26   #38
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Re: Any current Maretron Wind Speed Users?

You are giving them too much credit or excuses. There is no testing every version of every piece of equipment necessary - they simply only need to write software that conforms to the NMEA2000 standard.

This is easy to do, has no bearing on features and compatibility, and every other company - down to the smallest 2 men and a dog shops - seem to be able to do it effortlessly.

The fact that Garmin are not doing this seems to be a way to lock consumers into full Garmin solutions instead of giving them choices in their equipment. Raymarine paid for doing just that with their company as the penalty price. I hope Garmin pays this price in the marine market also, if they refuse to change.

FWIW, nobody else in the business is doing this anymore - they all learned that painful lesson the hard way. Raymarine is the only one that still has some autopilot non-conformity, but they are changing their tune as fast as they can since FLIR took them over. And Garmin is a large company, around for a long time, that is certainly not "going through growing pains".

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Old 10-04-2014, 07:04   #39
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Re: Any current Maretron Wind Speed Users?

Garmin prefer the auto market and Magellan went the same way. Try finding a marine Magellan GPS these days.

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Old 10-04-2014, 09:23   #40
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Re: Any current Maretron Wind Speed Users?

We also use the Maretron weather system and have had no real issues with it. I selected the Hella LED Tricolor because it has a channel and removable opening on the top that allowed us to mount the Maretron on top of the Tricolor.
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Old 10-04-2014, 20:40   #41
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Re: Any current Maretron Wind Speed Users?

Quote:
Originally Posted by zboss View Post
I think it is competing with the internal and external Garmin GPS. The airmar does not show up as an option at all on the GPS and course settings, although it does work for the environmental and other settings.
Pretty sure Mark is right about your set up.

What Garmin unit are you talking about? A chart plotter or instrument. Pretty sure you can choose the preferred gps source. I have 2 sounders on my network and can choose between them. Have to admit it took me a while to figure it out, pretty sure it is in the settings-->communications-->NMEA2000 setup area.

Its true about displaying some of the parameters, the chart plotter do not display/recognize some PGN's. The Garmin instruments (GMI10 & 20) are better at displaying more information, but do not come close to the Maretron units.
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Old 06-05-2014, 17:35   #42
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Re: Any current Maretron Wind Speed Users?

I have a '73 Yankee 30 with full Datamarine instrument system. After a transatlantic, Mediterranean adventure and some racing here in Tampa, my wind sensor is going bad and there don't seem to be spare parts available, even DMI doesn't advertise servicing them any more. I have been looking for a replacement and have been following this thread, considering going N2K and one of the ultrasonic sensors. Then I turned my attention to the Simrad/B&G Triton and the package including the classical whirligig wind sensor. Hm. I suggested and installed the setup on friends boat (no ulterior motives) and while testing it with the sensor in my hands in the cockpit, I noticed that the T41 display lags behind the windvane by a second or two. I thought I need to adjust damping (and so far I haven't found how to do that), but Practical Sailor also mentioned the lag in their part 2 on wind instruments and appeared to blame the N2K system for it. That got me suspicious that the B&G transducer, or even any N2K (doesn't sound right) may not be my best option.
Granted, when cruising or crossing the ocean in big waves, the delay may not hurt, possibly improve the autopilot "steer to wind" function. But now I do a lot racing on Tampa bay and here the conditions tend to smooth water and shifty winds. My Antea does pretty well, my edge is windward work and my secret weapon is my apparent wind indicator. I have long ago noticed that the changes in flow over my genoa (telltales) let me know of a windshift second or two after the needle on my Datamarine analog makes a move from its 28 degrees sweet spot. Something to do with the inertial quality of the laminar flow? So in fact, my step motor based Datamarine wind indicator allows me to adjust course before the telltails tell me my sails are out of trim.
Anyone out there cares to comment? The question is sensitivity, repeatebility and response time of the various systems. Is it possible that the N2K protocol would inherently delay information from sensors as Practical Sailor seemed to imply? One of the posts here once mentioned the possibility of finding a replacement step motor for the Datamarine masthead units from a non-marine source, but I can't find it now.
Sorry about the rant, Stan
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Old 06-05-2014, 19:39   #43
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Re: Any current Maretron Wind Speed Users?

Austin, would you have a photo of your Maretron/Hella tricolor assembly? That sounds ideal for me, as I wish to install a Lensref trilobe radar reflector atop my masthead, with the tricolor and Maretron stacked above it.
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Old 06-05-2014, 21:42   #44
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Re: Any current Maretron Wind Speed Users?

I haven't noticed any lag on our Triton displays or Maretron ultrasonic transducer. Granted, though, I am not looking for a one second precision so may not have noticed that. Given that the Maretron data transfer rate is 10Hz, any delay is not due to the transducer. For the display to cause a delay, it would have to be catching and displaying only 5-10% of the data available on the bus.

I haven't seen the PS article, so cannot comment on what they imply or how you interpreted it. However, if it was a general delay of that magnitude due only to the N2K protocol, then that would wreak havoc with compass data, GPS data, ARPA ability, and many other sensors and transducers. Autopilots wouldn't work and radars wouldn't track. Multiple displays would be constantly out of sync. So I doubt it is a general N2K issue.

Adjusting the damping is very easy on the Triton and explained well in the manual. It is in the setup menu under "damping".

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Old 08-05-2014, 06:14   #45
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Re: Any current Maretron Wind Speed Users?

The total latency package =

1) digitizing the analog data at the sensor
2) N2K access control protocol
3) programmable dampening at the display

I would believe the issue is one of dampening in the Triton and not an N2K latency issue. Although the N2K network will have more latency than a pure analog sensor wired directly to a display, I doubt the network latency is perceivable by a human. Since most (95+%) of N2K networks are loaded at <10%, the latency caused by the listen before talk protocol would not be appreciable. With that said, a very poor implementation of digitizing the sensor data prior to putting on the N2K network could cause additional latency. One would like to think this is high on an engineer's list to get that time down to an acceptable value during the design phase of the product.
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