Antenna for WiFi

[Beausoleil]

Originally Posted by High Cotton

Has anybody tried one of these ???

¤WaveRVII || - Wifi USB Adapter

Cotton,

At least this USB WiFi radio/antenna uses the IEEE 802.11g standard (54Mb/s) rather than the older, slower, less "friendly with others" 802.11b standard that the original WaveRV uses.

Pity they don't offer an 'g' version or even a 'pre-n' version of the original. The RVII is not for permanent external mounting in a marine environment...

My plan, when I get around to it, is to mount a marinized POE-powered client/bridge AP up on the mizzen - hopefully far away enough from my radome as to not fry!

[hellosailor]

That "marine environment" can really get you, can't it?<G>

The unit is small enough that it can be wrapped up in "coax seal" or self-vulcanizing tape or any kind. That would seal it up nicely.

I read further down the page on the specs, it is "just" a 200mW standard low-power WiFi radio with a standard 5db gain antenna, so the only real gain (pun allowed) is that there is no cable loss involved. Still, that's significant. 200mW with a 6db gain would be equal to an 800mW output, so they are coming close to the one watt ERP that is (or used to be, I don't recall) the US limit for ordinary users. Not a bad way to start although I'd expect to pay half that price for it.

I don't think anyone makes or stocks 802.11b equipment any more, the .g standard has been "final" for what, over five years now? The .b equipment was blown out in fire sales a long time ago, at least in the US. If someone didn't replace a .b model with .g, it just means they gave up on that particular market. And 802.11n should be replacing the .g equipment "Real Soon Now", I keep hearing it has and hasn't been finalized for the past year-plus. Matter of fact, my new WiFi card (chip) is an a-b-g-n card, for that very reason. They didn't say "n draft" they said "n". If I had a .n hub to test it with...<G>...

[W32PAMELA]

Originally Posted by hellosailor

Not a bad way to start although I'd expect to pay half that price for it.

How about paying a third the price for it. I suspect the thing is the engenius/senoa EUB-362 board repackaged in a different plastic case. I tried downloading the windows XP and 98 drivers to see if they would run an EUB-362 but the zip files are bad. The Vista drivers are for the same Atheros chipset used in the Eub-362 .

The EUB-362 can be googled for $45 to $50 from a number of places and 5db rubber duck antennas go for a lot less than $100.

Bob Stewart

[Microship]

I picked up one of the WaveRV rigs last year, but at the time there were no drivers for the Mac... apparently that has since changed. I traded it for a dedicated omni to use with my modified Linksys WET-11 (retrofitted with a 300 mW Senao card), which can also use a RadioLabs yagi (see photo) when directional makes sense.

Years ago, I built an elaborate video turret for the Microship project, but it has become a bit of a dinosaur now that it's cheaper to just scatter cameras around and switch among them (lesson there: do the electronics last on a custom boat project!). I'm now playing with hacking it to accept the RadioLabs RL1000, though I'm not sure it will be worth all the trouble. It's the irresistible allure of a good hack, mostly...

Anyway, WiFi is of course best when available, but I'm finding that for reliability, EVDO is pretty hard to beat (at least in coastal US... I'm sure it will break once I start ranging farther afield).

The current primary net connection on my boat is via Sprint EVDO flat-rate unlimited service ($60/month), with an on-board Wi-Fi router and an external marine dual-band cellular antenna driven by a 3-watt amplifier (which is not necessary in most places). The EVDO card can also pop out of the router and into my Mac for mobile use, and I was able to watch YouTube vids while driving up I-5 (I was the passenger). Performance is roughly DSL speed. Here are the major parts:

Shakespeare dual-band marine cellular antenna
Sprint Novatel EX720 EVDO card
Top Global EVDO Mobile Router
Wilson 3-watt bi-directional dual-band amplifier

They have just added a firmware update to the router that lets it do Google Earth compatible tracking for free, so if you want to leave a breadcrumb trail it can help justify the EVDO expense.

Having a round-the-clock connection in the boat is particularly nice when I'm not there, as I can peek at the on-board webcam during a windstorm to make sure the view is not changing too much (!). My current project is a little Linux box with some data collection hardware for remote systems monitoring, but that's getting off into another whole topic...

Cheers from Nomadness,
Steve

[mohave_steve]

Hello All,

I have spent considerable time working on this very issue.
Here is what I have found:

1) Card & Pigtail:
I have found the mechanical integrity of the antenna connectors on the cards I have tried to be unsuitable for mobile or marine use. I have destroyed cards from three different manufacturers in my trials. Also, the feedline loss at 2.4ghz is significant even using LMR400 coax from Times Microwave. If you need to place the external antenna very far from the laptop causes you to lose much of what you gained by installing a gain antenna and the LMR400 is thick & stiff making it difficult to route.

2) POE Solutions:
I have tried various ethernet client bridges that support POE. The Senao CB3 is a GREAT performer. Unfortunately it can be quite flakey when trying to configure for the system in a new marina (or RV park). Especially if the lacation is charging for Wifi and uses a billing gateway made by Nomadix or Colubris. I have been several places where I could not make my ethernet bridge work without spending WAY too much time and effort. Sad as I do this for a living. Lastly, standard POE implimentations (802.3af) use a 48v supply
and draw little current meaning small voltage drop over the cat5 run. Many of the popular consumer grade client bridges have used a 12v supply and draw much more current meaning greater voltage drop over the cat5 run. This limits how far you can run the cat5 from the poe injector to the client bridge. When the voltage at the bridge drops behavior becomes eratic.

3) USB:
The best (not perfect) solution I have found so far. The worst part about this solution is the limit of 16' on the USB cable. The solution I am currently using is a 70mw USB radio directly attached to a 9db gain antenna housed in a marinized housing. this is mounted about 25' up and I am using powered "active" USB extension cables (sealed at each junction) that are capable of being "chained" up to 75'. The software is quite simple and even automatically attaches to the strongest Wifi signal it finds when you fire it up. You can also view all available networks at the click of a button.

Wow... I didn't mean to write a novel........

Have fun.

Steve

[mohave_steve]

I just cant stop.......

Think about it:

Mode Speed
802.11b 11mb/s
802.11g 54mb/s
802.11n 248mb/s (yeah right)


Internet connection being shared: 1.5mb/s if you are lucky.

Kind of like piloting a Scarab that will go 90kts in a no wake zone.

Doesn't really matter how fast your connection is as long as it is faster than your Internet connection. Also, the increased range claims for 802.11n have proven to be insignificant.

Just my $.02

[Beausoleil]

Originally Posted by mohave_steve

Kind of like piloting a Scarab that will go 90kts in a no wake zone.

It doesn't really matter how fast your connection is as long as it is faster than your Internet connection. Also, the increased range claims for 802.11n have proven to be insignificant.

Steve,

Yeah, but 802.11n plays fairer in the presence of b/g, and g plays fairer than b. So overall, n (once its fully standardized and product is available) is the best choice.

And n's increased range claims come into play in the presence of interference (like multipath). MIMO (multiple in / multiple out) has significant performance gains over simple diversity antenna tuning.

And for POE - for example, D-Link's DWL-P50 adapter is 48V over the wire, and can supply either 5V or 12V. Might want to try it (although I've had a D-Link router go bad on me in the past...).

[mohave_steve]

I will agree that G & N are generally better behaved in a crowded enviroment. As to the range claims, I understand the concept but in practice we have found that pre-N devices generally don't outperform G by any significant amount. Perhaps it is the enviroment we have tested in. (Industrial Park, RV Park & Marina).

Perhaps it is all moot as in the near future most all of the devices available at your local retailer will be 802.11N.

Thank you for the response.

[hellosailor]

11.n speeds may be a moot point for most folks, hobbled by a slower broadband connection. But for home and office networks, it should allow faster transfers between local machines on the LAN, and that will count for some folks.

Part of the speed gained only by "shotgunning" (i.e. two pipes used at once, like the dual barrels of a shotgun) will only be seen in equipment that is more expensive, with MIMO hardware (multiple radios) in it. That's something the manufacturers don't seem willing or able to talk about--yet.

And then again, the US is currently ranked something like 16th or lower for broadband and internet performance/deployment. We've become a third world country in the telecommunications arena, with deregulation and carrier competitive games that have the collateral damage of "why improve things? that costs money."

[Cyber Mike]

I went with the 3 part yagi with usb connection off ebay. I pull it out when i need it. Search "wardriving usb" for results. 120 bucks, I'm done.

Michael
s/v Savannah

[ernoquic]

Hello everybody,

For me the best option is a 400 mw. accespoint called Mouse (w-lanshop.nl). I bought it in the Netherlands.
I can use it with its own 2,5 dbi antenna but i have an 9 dbi rubberduck and an 15 dbi Marine wifi antenna.

With this configuration i have always an internet connection in the Caribbean.

I had the Radiolabs Wave RV, but it stopped working.
I opened it and it was only an 100 mw usb stick connected to an little antenna, so it was not really 200 mw. what the say.

I tried als some outdoor clients 400 mw, but the mouse gives me much more receiving.

Good luk with it.

Erno
SY TARA

[MossC.]

Hello I was reading that you were looking to get a better signal while docked in the harbor. I use a portable wifi antenna and a usb card with a cable in between. This will reach several hundred feet. For more info check out my site at Britecom.net.
Thanks,
Moss

[simonmd]

Mate, this thread is over THREE YEARS OLD!!!

[pjazz]

Hi all, I've been shopping around for a Wifi booster for my Mac. Most marine kits are designed for PC/windows... (Rogue Wave, 5milewifi, etc...)

Has anyone found an acceptable/affordable solution for their Mac?

[W32PAMELA]

All the ethernet based systems will work with a MAC because they do not require drivers.