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Old 26-11-2016, 09:43   #46
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Re: Would you do this to cut sailing cost?

Nope - Not a chance.
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Old 26-11-2016, 10:05   #47
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Re: Would you do this to cut sailing cost?

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Nope - Not a chance.
Would you do this to cut sailing cost?

I'm not in it to make $$.

Every time someone posts about "boats & investments," guess what happens?

Used to be that experiences were part of memories. Then they invented film and digital pictures so if it wasn't "captured" on film it almost didn't happen. (I know, my wife thinks I feel that way given all the pictures I take, but I'm glad I did: so many memories, and once you get to my dotage, you NEED the photos to even begin to remember! )

Then along came video and static film just wasn't enough.

Now, if it doesn't have an "app" it doesn't exist.

Why not just sail? If you want or need "company" [and some people simply can't get along without it], look for crew.

I don't think we're in it for the $$, just like parenting.
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Old 27-11-2016, 10:52   #48
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Re: Would you do this to cut sailing cost?

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Originally Posted by belizesailor View Post
Hooking up paying passengers with recreational boats presents legal issues. Many already run illegal charters, but for obvious reasons try to stay off the radar. Registering and advertising on a web site, puts them on the radar. Im guessing not many will sign up for that.

Legitimate guided fishing buisnesses (I know a few owners and guides) already spend lots of money to promote their web sites and have relationships with travel brokers etc...so dont have a need for a service like proposed by one post..probably the business reason its not being done...no demand.

A model that does work is fractional ownership. See viable businesses built on this model like SailTime.
Thanks for your answer and the idea to focus on fishing buisnesses. Could you provide the links to the sites you're talking about or send me them via private message?
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Old 27-11-2016, 14:46   #49
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Re: Would you do this to cut sailing cost?

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Originally Posted by 30yearslater View Post
Well Beatnik the idea is great in theory but in practice it might be a bit trickier. The minute price enters the equation a whole can of worms gets opened. The licensing requirements when carrying passengers for hire in the U.S. are quite clear. I am the organizer of a local Meetup.com group for this type of purpose without requiring pay for service. Some of my members have inquired why I don't charge a fee. It is precisely the regulatory requirements. Then you have the issue with a license/past performance does not guarantee similar outcome for the skipper. Vestas Wind comes to mind as does the Costa Concordia. Professional sailors with hundreds of thousands of miles logged putting a boat on the rocks in the middle of an ocean or sea is a formula for litigation. Nice idea if there is a big enough insurance policy. Personally I'll stay with no charge since I will have the boat and costs of using it anyway.
Thanks for the answer. I wouldn't say that "passengers for hire in the U.S. are quite clear", rather it's a bit tricky. I found a nice explanation on Boatsafe.com which goes into great details of explaining what is "passenger for hire" by quoting United States Code.

Here's the bottom line that they wrote: if you are a recreational boater, you are allowed to share expenses for a day on the water. Just don't make payment mandatory if someone wants a boat ride.

BoatSafe.com

You mentioned that you're an organizer of a local Meetup.com which doesn't require pay for service. Could you provide some details about this Meetup? Is it a hobby of yours? I'm just curious to know what motivates you to organize these events without being paid.

BTW - based on the answer provided above (which I find quite logical) you can ask for shared expenses and it won't get you in legal trouble
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Old 29-11-2016, 12:29   #50
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Re: Would you do this to cut sailing cost?

Boat and bod for hire for many years.Had many 'entrepreneurs' trying to sell my product as agents for a cut. Pain in the butt most of the time. Legit city tourism office sold my tickets and probably made some money from them but it gave me obvious legitimicy .Nothing like being told 'Oh, "them", Sorry ,I can't tell you anything about "them."' to dampen the timid. Most of my business was internet, word of mouth, and obvious good product in a tourist oriented harbour. EVERYBODY uses trip advisor And direct info from my webpage. If you are a concierge in a pompous hotel you can make some serious easy money but only because you caught them before they saw my boat. ON the brighter side disclaimers of responsibility (for ticket seller)can sometimes actually hold up in court if listed on legit operators insurance .Probably null/void if corners are being cut.Serious stuff. In Canada there are NO legal disclaimers.
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Old 29-11-2016, 12:52   #51
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Re: Would you do this to cut sailing cost?

i always get a chuckle out of the reaction of self-invitees onto my boat when i ask them if they can swim - to which people who cant usually lie - and then tell them 'good, cos you're swimming out to the boat if you want to get aboard'.
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Old 29-11-2016, 13:18   #52
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Re: Would you do this to cut sailing cost?

I'm left with this overall feeling:

Most experienced boat owners don't like the exposure to unknown passengers, and would not participate. The risks of liability are substantial, even with waivers, etc. The possible fiscal benefits are small, considering the effort and risk involved. The "vetting" of potential "crew" or skipper by means of internet affidavits may sound ok, but is meaningless IMO... or do YOU believe everything you see on the www?

The only one who really stands to benefit is the OP, who risks nothing, but takes a cut.

I don't like the idea.

Jim
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Old 29-11-2016, 13:36   #53
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Re: Would you do this to cut sailing cost?

I know the standard for the aviation community when I went to flight school was that friends or passengers were only allowed to contribute a portion of the flights cost. Say I flew me and two friends in a rented plane for 3 hours at $180 an operating our fee. My friends would each pay their share which would be $180, plus whatever the fuel expenses were divided by 3.

If something like this was followed such as the skipper having figured out a logical cost of operation per day and the guest contributing a portion of that I don't think they could be considered a full on paying passenger. Then again I'm no lawyer.

I don't see any difference with using an app to find crew and having them help pay costs or using web forums such as this. If crew wants to help contribute to operating costs it shouldn't be any different as far as insurance is concerned.
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Old 04-12-2016, 15:38   #54
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Re: Would you do this to cut sailing cost?

I feel like we live in a bloody wofld, getting worse
In the 90s i hosted to-become close friends as sailors...

Last year, experience was miserable upon any terms, and i asked for nil, just courtesy and dedication
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Old 07-12-2016, 09:26   #55
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Re: Would you do this to cut sailing cost?

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Originally Posted by Beatnik View Post
Thanks for your answer and the idea to focus on fishing buisnesses. Could you provide the links to the sites you're talking about or send me them via private message?
Just Google sport fishing in any hot spot like Panama, Guatemala, Belize...

Ones I know personally are:

Hooked on Panama

Casa Vieja Guatemala

...

My point was actually that they are already very well promoted and dont need such a service. How do you beat promotional services like Google AdWords?

Some smaller less sophiticated operators might need such a service.
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Old 07-12-2016, 12:43   #56
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Re: Would you do this to cut sailing cost?

To me, OP's original IDEA is 100% valid. I think new modalities of sailing, cruising and ownership call for new solutions to cost management, crewing and pastime management.

How to implement it is open to discussion, modification, testing and !!! delivering a proof. (Pudding ....etc.)

The one who finds the right solution first (or who implements the solution best) wins.

The one who does not do should never tell the one doing that something cannot get done.

An old Chinese proverb.

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