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Old 10-05-2015, 08:46   #31
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Re: Who Has Gone From Sailboat to Motor Yacht?

I know its strange, but i'm trying to go to the sailing side (lite side?). Yes, I have found sailors think they are better than motor yachters. Its hard to talk about this subject because sailors get so offended. First thing, fuel cost isnt a concern. 7 kts @ 4 gals/hr isnt too much. $1000/month marina cost in the keys is horrible. Sailors motor all the way to the keys, then pay this amount for staying at a marina. Where's the savings? Reasons vary wildly from we have a large dog to not trusting anchoring out. I have found very little sailors actually sail as well. There's just not that much of a difference between a 43' Beneteau and a 43' Hatteras when motoring (at least in fuel). Then there's those who anchor out in a sail boat but need to run the diesel motor or genny to keep food cold. Where's the freedom in that? Also when I see sailors in the marinas that are using the shower and head facilities of the marina all the time. I call that camping aboard, Not living aboard. If you are going to be staying at marinas most of the time for goodness sake, buy a motor yacht. You can live aboard comfortably and use your own facilities. Its like a house on water. We havent regretted buying a M/V at all, and the upkeep hasnt been that much either. But as others have said, if the ocean is windy and seas 2-4 ft stay in port. I want to buy a sail boat to do some long distance traveling in the ocean. I'm sick of the ICW. Bridges, jet ski's, shallow water and so forth. Hope it works for you. Just dont let the price of diesel influence your choice.
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Old 10-05-2015, 08:58   #32
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Re: Who Has Gone From Sailboat to Motor Yacht?

There is a huge difference in fuel for most. My 44 foot sailboat burned .65 gal/hr over the life of the boat. My 47 foot sailboat burned more... about 1 gal+ per hour. As mentioned above, I motored a lot, my patience wears thin at about 4 knots, then the iron reacher comes on.
My 30 ft trawler burned at least 1.25 gal per hour, which is pretty good. Not sure why it burned so much, probably cause I pushed it more and it did have an oversized engine for a 30.
My only problem with power boats is I always feel "at risk" unless I have dual engines. Like if the engine quits I'm screwed. But duals burn more fuel. Love the accommodation of the Trawler though.
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Old 10-05-2015, 09:27   #33
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Re: Who Has Gone From Sailboat to Motor Yacht?

Mangawake,


Sailors motor all the way to the keys. You must have been speaking of the people with motor boats with masts.
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Old 10-05-2015, 09:35   #34
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Re: Who Has Gone From Sailboat to Motor Yacht?

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Originally Posted by Cheechako View Post
There is a huge difference in fuel for most. My 44 foot sailboat burned .65 gal/hr over the life of the boat. My 47 foot sailboat burned more... about 1 gal+ per hour. As mentioned above, I motored a lot, my patience wears thin at about 4 knots, then the iron reacher comes on.
My 30 ft trawler burned at least 1.25 gal per hour, which is pretty good. Not sure why it burned so much, probably cause I pushed it more and it did have an oversized engine for a 30.
My only problem with power boats is I always feel "at risk" unless I have dual engines. Like if the engine quits I'm screwed. But duals burn more fuel. Love the accommodation of the Trawler though.
Once you factor in the cost of sail maintenance and replacement and rigging costs as fuel cost, nothing is really free, then there is not a significant difference in sailboat verses an economical power boat. It isn't as simple as computing how many gallons of fuel you use on a sailboat verses a power boat. As for risk, you won't find us 350 miles offshore anymore. But we have about 15,000 miles without incident on a single engine. Then we lost all power in the middle of the Gulf of Mexico. TowboatUS to the rescue. A sailboat can loose a rudder or any number of things that would result in the same. The Coast Guard rescues crews on sailboats every day. There is a certain amount of risk no matter which way you go. Chuck
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Old 10-05-2015, 09:48   #35
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Re: Who Has Gone From Sailboat to Motor Yacht?

I've been back and forth. I started sail, then bought waterfront on the Rideau canal, where only power made sense, the better equipped for fishing, the more sense it made. I usually kept the power boat on a trailer in my driveway, but if I had a couple weeks vacation I would keep her in the water "moored" to trees.

My last two boats have been sail, but I would not be the least bit averse to going back to power again if I was on protected waters. Somebody mentioned power cats, I think that would be a cool option.

I think if I found myself on sheltered waters again, I would look for a shallow draft, low air draft, mono (because of the extra places you can visit with a narrow beam). Preferably twin screw and trailerable behind a decent pick up truck. Definitely diesel.

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Old 10-05-2015, 20:16   #36
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Re: Who Has Gone From Sailboat to Motor Yacht?

I started with a sailboat and soon found out that in the PNW the wind is not there when i need it and when it is there even on a nice summer day my ears got cold and i had to dress like i was going skiing in the mountains. So i decided the next sailboat would have a nice quiet inboard diesel for motoring and a pilothouse for all weather boating. I ended up doing lots more boating in the off season. Crank up the heater and enjoying the anchorages or the many state parks with no other boats in sight. So far i have put the sails up one time when i first got the boat just to sort out the rigging to be ready to sail. But have not put them up one time so sail. I like that i have a sailboat but i do motor everywhere and at 1/2 to 1 gallon an hour it is cheap fun. And i can go anywhere even in the rain.

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Old 10-05-2015, 23:42   #37
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Re: Who Has Gone From Sailboat to Motor Yacht?

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Originally Posted by wellin View Post
I started with a sailboat and soon found out that in the PNW the wind is not there when i need it and when it is there even on a nice summer day my ears got cold and i had to dress like i was going skiing in the mountains. So i decided the next sailboat would have a nice quiet inboard diesel for motoring and a pilothouse for all weather boating. I ended up doing lots more boating in the off season. Crank up the heater and enjoying the anchorages or the many state parks with no other boats in sight. So far i have put the sails up one time when i first got the boat just to sort out the rigging to be ready to sail. But have not put them up one time so sail. I like that i have a sailboat but i do motor everywhere and at 1/2 to 1 gallon an hour it is cheap fun. And i can go anywhere even in the rain.

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I'm with you on that, Andy; although I still use my sails the majority of the time. Sometimes for the silence, sometimes for stabilization. I love having full vision from a warm, comfortable pilothouse when its cold and wet outside. Although
From a cost point of view, the savings in fuel with an efficient narrow beam sailboat are eaten up in marina fees due to the extra length (=extra cost) required to get the same amount of accommodation below in the cave.
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Old 11-05-2015, 03:27   #38
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Re: Who Has Gone From Sailboat to Motor Yacht?

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Originally Posted by wellin View Post
I started with a sailboat and soon found out that in the PNW the wind is not there when i need it and when it is there even on a nice summer day my ears got cold and i had to dress like i was going skiing in the mountains. So i decided the next sailboat would have a nice quiet inboard diesel for motoring and a pilothouse for all weather boating. I ended up doing lots more boating in the off season. Crank up the heater and enjoying the anchorages or the many state parks with no other boats in sight. So far i have put the sails up one time when i first got the boat just to sort out the rigging to be ready to sail. But have not put them up one time so sail. I like that i have a sailboat but i do motor everywhere and at 1/2 to 1 gallon an hour it is cheap fun. And i can go anywhere even in the rain.

Andy

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Funny storey, but I do a ton of motoring too. The only time there is decent wind on the lower great lakes is in the shoulder seasons. My motor gets far more use than my sails, it's not even a close contest. I don't have a pilot house but I do have a nice canvas enclosure and heat down below.

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Old 11-05-2015, 03:40   #39
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Re: Who Has Gone From Sailboat to Motor Yacht?

Very interesting discussion as i have been thinking of going down this path for sometime. Having been a cat yacht owner i would not consider a mono M/Y, but a powercat is certainly in my sights. There are some good displacement power cats designs available. Something around the 50ft mark built light can be powered by twin 200hp diesels at a cruise speed of 8knts with extremly good fuel consumption. But could also top 18knts if required. Allso had an idea from the way we used to motor on our sailing cat is to just motor on 1 engine at a time. Whether this is feasable on a Motor cat i dont know , if it was fitted with good quality control pitch props so you could feather the 'off" engine, this would reduce fuel consumption even more, so increasing range, reduce engine wear and maintainence and the redundancy of having 2 engines, any thoughts on that?
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Old 11-05-2015, 03:52   #40
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Re: Who Has Gone From Sailboat to Motor Yacht?

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Very interesting discussion as i have been thinking of going down this path for sometime. Having been a cat yacht owner i would not consider a mono M/Y, but a powercat is certainly in my sights. There are some good displacement power cats designs available. Something around the 50ft mark built light can be powered by twin 200hp diesels at a cruise speed of 8knts with extremly good fuel consumption. But could also top 18knts if required. Allso had an idea from the way we used to motor on our sailing cat is to just motor on 1 engine at a time. Whether this is feasable on a Motor cat i dont know , if it was fitted with good quality control pitch props so you could feather the 'off" engine, this would reduce fuel consumption even more, so increasing range, reduce engine wear and maintainence and the redundancy of having 2 engines, any thoughts on that?
It could work, but I've spent some time on power cats and I don't find they motor very well on one engine, certainly not as well as a mono on one engine. The lever is too long and to keep the boat tracking you're constantly applying helm, which disturbs the water flow, and puts stress on your steering gear and autopilot (if your autopilot can even handle the work load). It could certainly work under special circumstances though.

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Old 11-05-2015, 04:03   #41
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Re: Who Has Gone From Sailboat to Motor Yacht?

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It could work, but I've spent some time on power cats and I don't find they motor very well on one engine, certainly not as well as a mono on one engine. The lever is too long and to keep the boat tracking you're constantly applying helm, which disturbs the water flow, and puts stress on your steering gear and autopilot (if your autopilot can even handle the work load). It could certainly work under special circumstances though.

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Hello Familyvan, if i hadnt had experience motoring like this in my sailcat i would probably agree with you,however i very rarely use my 2x 75 hp engines at the same time, have no need as i get all the speed out of one, up to 11knts if reqiured, and only 12 with both going WOT ,so no point. As for tracking, with the gori folding props there seems to be no drag and the you hardly hear a beep out of the pilot, tracks straight and true even thou the props are 25ft apart.
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Old 11-05-2015, 11:56   #42
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Re: Who Has Gone From Sailboat to Motor Yacht?

I don't think the question is as simple as that. Everything is a compromise and you have to make your own based upon what you want to do with the boat.

We are getting ready to do the loop and even though have done many parts of it in many kinds of boats, we choose something in between as a compromise with a smaller pilothouse sailboat.

Started with a long list of requirements and things we wanted or liked and morphed into a short-list of boats, then a compromise. Why not a pilothouse sailboat?
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Old 11-05-2015, 12:22   #43
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Re: Who Has Gone From Sailboat to Motor Yacht?

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Hello Familyvan, if i hadnt had experience motoring like this in my sailcat i would probably agree with you,however i very rarely use my 2x 75 hp engines at the same time, have no need as i get all the speed out of one, up to 11knts if reqiured, and only 12 with both going WOT ,so no point. As for tracking, with the gori folding props there seems to be no drag and the you hardly hear a beep out of the pilot, tracks straight and true even thou the props are 25ft apart.
That makes sense, I'm sure as with monos not all Cats are going to handle the same. I drive a power cat at work, she does okay with one engine, but she's steel and fairly heavy (188 tons), so the drag off one hull on a boat like that is likely to be greater than the drag on a sleek sailing cat.


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Old 11-05-2015, 12:25   #44
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Re: Who Has Gone From Sailboat to Motor Yacht?

Quote:
Originally Posted by thorcat View Post
Very interesting discussion as i have been thinking of going down this path for sometime. Having been a cat yacht owner i would not consider a mono M/Y, but a powercat is certainly in my sights. There are some good displacement power cats designs available. Something around the 50ft mark built light can be powered by twin 200hp diesels at a cruise speed of 8knts with extremly good fuel consumption. But could also top 18knts if required. Allso had an idea from the way we used to motor on our sailing cat is to just motor on 1 engine at a time. Whether this is feasable on a Motor cat i dont know , if it was fitted with good quality control pitch props so you could feather the 'off" engine, this would reduce fuel consumption even more, so increasing range, reduce engine wear and maintainence and the redundancy of having 2 engines, any thoughts on that?
Sorry!
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Old 11-05-2015, 12:37   #45
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Re: Who Has Gone From Sailboat to Motor Yacht?

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I don't think the question is as simple as that. Everything is a compromise and you have to make your own based upon what you want to do with the boat.

We are getting ready to do the loop and even though have done many parts of it in many kinds of boats, we choose something in between as a compromise with a smaller pilothouse sailboat.

Started with a long list of requirements and things we wanted or liked and morphed into a short-list of boats, then a compromise. Why not a pilothouse sailboat?
Can you tell us what type of pilothouse motorsailor you settled on & why? I'm a big fan of that kind of boat.
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