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Old 25-08-2016, 13:56   #16
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Re: When you know nothing...

I think if your first consideration is layout, you'll need to ease into this a bit more. Soon you'll realize that the layout is a function of what works best for a boat that is being propelled by a balance of forces... the sails versus the very heavy lump of lead under the floor. And it is NORMAL for the boat to lean over and get splashed occasionally! It is really hard to appreciate how sailboats are layed out until you really have that feeling, and hopefully passion, for sailing. If you are thinking of getting from point A to point B, and the boat is much like an RV, you likely be terribly disappointed with a sailboat. Get a fast, fun little sailboat.. no motor! Then see if you catch the bug. If not then you can debate powerboat options.
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Old 25-08-2016, 14:04   #17
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Re: When you know nothing...

Perhaps one of the Biggest Myths about the Cruising Community is that it takes years of training and experience to do it and that it is "hard". There are two kinds of Cruisers I have Cruised with and sell gear to on a daily basis.

1. They have owned a boat for 30yrs taken every course and training imaginable and are finally feeling safe and ready to cast off. Only after crewing on other boats extensively to gain knowledge. They have taken the Diesel engine courses, Electrical For Dummies, Rescue at Sea and Weather Classes, you know the drill. They know what they are doing and are usually the leaders of the "when do we leave the anchorage on the crossing" group.

And then

2. They bought the boat 4 months ago and are heading off Cruising (either down the US East Coast to the Carib or Down Baja to Mexico). They have no idea what they don't know but 99.9% of them will make it safely until their Skills catch up to their Dreams. They are the ones taking advice and gaining knowledge from the No1 group above and from the friends they meet in the anchorages along the way. The Key to the success of this Group is being able to put their pride away and take good advice from the other helpful cruisers that will happily pass it on over drinks and dinghy raft-ups.

From my experience....it's about a 50/50 mix between the two groups.
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Old 25-08-2016, 14:41   #18
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Re: When you know nothing...

I think you'll find powerboats more comfortable and a better ride in most conditions. I sailed for years when younger. If I was going to cross oceans, sail would make more sense, but I would get a motorsailer. I can't see being in the weather, hot, cold, rain and snow in a normal sailing cockpit. You can learn from people in your area. Offer fuel, etc. There are books on boat handling. I agree with SV 3rd Day. Most new owners just go.
In defense of Detroit Diesels, in talking to previous owners of this boat, determined the engines went somewhere above 20,000 hours since overhaul. I bought the boat wanting Detroit mains and knowing I would overhaul them. They will continue to run for my lifetime.
Detroit Diesels are known as extremely reliable. No injector pump, no difficult bleeding procedure, no electric needs, no circuit boards, no electronic sensors. Yes they are expensive to do major repairs, but so is Cat or any other heavy duty diesel. Although I prefer to go faster, I can get 2 mpg in an 83', 80 ton boat.
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Old 25-08-2016, 14:51   #19
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Re: When you know nothing...

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Originally Posted by TooCoys View Post
Monohulls seem to all have the same layout - couch on both sides with that table on the mast in the middle, and the master stateroom is always tucked under the cockpit which would make it very uncomfortable to sleep in. If I could put a sail on my RV we'd be golden.
Some boats have a raised cockpit (not really a "pit" anymore). That leaves more space for the master stateroom below the cockpit.

But if you are talking about 50' boats, then you should maybe buy a center cockpit boat that has lots of space for the master stateroom behind the cockpit.
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Old 25-08-2016, 15:00   #20
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Re: When you know nothing...

Then there are the Catamarans....now that's floating Condo Living Amigo!

No offense to Cats by calling them floating condos, hell almost all of us Mono guys would have a Cat if we could afford it!
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Old 25-08-2016, 15:43   #21
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Re: When you know nothing...

Im always surprised when someone says you 'must' start small and slowly to graduate up the ladder. Why? There is no meaningful justification. It is just another option.
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Old 25-08-2016, 17:42   #22
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Re: When you know nothing...

Quote:
Originally Posted by SV THIRD DAY View Post
Perhaps one of the Biggest Myths about the Cruising Community is that it takes years of training and experience to do it and that it is "hard". There are two kinds of Cruisers I have Cruised with and sell gear to on a daily basis.

1. They have owned a boat for 30yrs taken every course and training imaginable and are finally feeling safe and ready to cast off. Only after crewing on other boats extensively to gain knowledge. They have taken the Diesel engine courses, Electrical For Dummies, Rescue at Sea and Weather Classes, you know the drill. They know what they are doing and are usually the leaders of the "when do we leave the anchorage on the crossing" group.

And then

2. They bought the boat 4 months ago and are heading off Cruising (either down the US East Coast to the Carib or Down Baja to Mexico). They have no idea what they don't know but 99.9% of them will make it safely until their Skills catch up to their Dreams. They are the ones taking advice and gaining knowledge from the No1 group above and from the friends they meet in the anchorages along the way. The Key to the success of this Group is being able to put their pride away and take good advice from the other helpful cruisers that will happily pass it on over drinks and dinghy raft-ups.

From my experience....it's about a 50/50 mix between the two groups.

Sounds like you don't cruise with or sell gear to the majority of cruisers I see.

They have taken few, if any, formal courses but have gained experience over years sailing on a range of boats and probably have owned several of increasing size over the years. They may have 'bought their boat 4 months ago and are heading off cruising', but they've built the necessary skills and experience to do so over many years.

ISTM, that north americans seem to place a lot more reliance on sailing courses and formal qualifications than do people from most other countries.
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Old 25-08-2016, 17:58   #23
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Re: When you know nothing...

Oh that certainly could be the case my wife's always telling me I live in my own fantasy world. But it's the only world I know so I run with it
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Old 26-08-2016, 02:29   #24
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Re: When you know nothing...

Quite so.......Its a little frustrating to read so many posts of what one MUST do;
1) Join a club
2) Start in a tiny dinghy for one year
3) then upgrade by 5ft per year
4) Start to crew for coastal passages
5) Graduate to off-shore
6) Finally, go cruising - after kitting out the boat with triple sets of everything 'cos you still dont know the basics.

By this stage, you are older than Jesus Christ himself, have spent 100's of millions $'s on courses and trading boats.............

Im not advocating buying a 285ft boat and just shoving off - but that does work for many people and there is nothing wrong with that (perhaps on a smaller boat tho'). It also worked for me, as well - but I also discovered what I didnt know and plugged those gaps.

I am still grateful to Munro Bezuidenhout from when he ran his sailing school in the early '80's - has anyone come across him? Possibly in the Caribbean?




Quote:
Originally Posted by StuM View Post
Sounds like you don't cruise with or sell gear to the majority of cruisers I see.

They have taken few, if any, formal courses but have gained experience over years sailing on a range of boats and probably have owned several of increasing size over the years. They may have 'bought their boat 4 months ago and are heading off cruising', but they've built the necessary skills and experience to do so over many years.

ISTM, that north americans seem to place a lot more reliance on sailing courses and formal qualifications than do people from most other countries.
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Old 26-08-2016, 03:11   #25
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Re: When you know nothing...

For the OP....

Buy yourself something around 30 foot.... cheap but seaworthy and not requiring a total refit any work on it.....
Keep on living ashore... spend the next three years or so learning to sail.... daysails, then weekends out, then a night sail.... softlee softlee....

Decide if you really like the life.... learn what works and what doesn't... look at lots of boats.... charter a bit maybe....

Then buy one you think will do the job for you..... and away you go...
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Old 26-08-2016, 08:43   #26
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Re: When you know nothing...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bulawayo View Post
Im always surprised when someone says you 'must' start small and slowly to graduate up the ladder. Why? There is no meaningful justification. It is just another option.
Yes, there are many perfectly good ways to start sailing. There are also many different kind of people, with different skills and different learning habits. Everyone should pick a strategy that seems to suit him/her best. One size does not fit all.

If someone has the habit or rushing into new things and ending up in problems before learning what he/she should not have done, then he/she should be more careful than usual when starting sailing. Boating differs from driving a car in that sea is very powerful and may get angry at times, and you can not pull over or drive to the nearest service station when you run into problems.

But for most people it is enough to "just do it" the way that looks safe and most natural to them. Most people do understand quite well what they should and should not do with their current skills.

One should have also some interest to study problem/emergency situations on paper, courses, youtube etc. since one should not start learning those skills only when one desperately needs them.
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Old 27-08-2016, 12:25   #27
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Re: When you know nothing...

For the OP...

Check out captainjohn.org .
Read everything on the site, everything !
I've been given several boats, bought several too.
Some sailed again. More of them did not. They also serve other purposes, such as in my case, sandbox playground for the kids, nautical bits for sale or eye candy in the yard, or the "you can have the trailer but the boat goes with it" deal. Or the "fix it to prove you want it and I'll bring the title" deal. Yeah I did that once. Bought someone else's long abandoned project , and 2500$ turns into 25000$ fast. But I knew that.
Do some diligent research for yourself. Test the water. Be careful. Gain knowledge. If you are strong willed and have the bank roll, I suggest go for it before you get any older. You may appreciate your boat more and familiarize yourself with her if you do work on her yourself. But as others have said, find one that needs little or no work and get out there with it. If you sail with others first you will know if it's for you or not.
Keep in mind it's not all fair winds out there, things can get shatty and do. It's not life for everybody. Some escape to it, and some never return to dirt as home. Sometimes I drive to the harbor and when I get there , a seagull shits on my head
I hope it works out for you.
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Old 27-08-2016, 12:33   #28
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Re: When you know nothing...

I could DEFINITELY see myself living in this space.

1976 Yorktown Sloop Sail Boat For Sale - www.yachtworld.com
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Old 27-08-2016, 13:06   #29
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Re: When you know nothing...

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2. They bought the boat 4 months ago and are heading off Cruising (either down the US East Coast to the Carib or Down Baja to Mexico). They have no idea what they don't know but 99.9% of them will make it safely until their Skills catch up to their Dreams. They are the ones taking advice and gaining knowledge from the No1 group above and from the friends they meet in the anchorages along the way. The Key to the success of this Group is being able to put their pride away and take good advice from the other helpful cruisers that will happily pass it on over drinks and dinghy raft-ups.

From my experience....it's about a 50/50 mix between the two groups.


I'm in group 2. I research obsessively before making a purchase, and then use as many resources as I can afterwards to learn.

I would never consider setting out on a long cruise alone. Whether we go power, or sail, I fully intend on hiring an experienced captain until I feel confident I can operate the boat by myself.

I dont know that we'll ever be world cruisers either, and will probably end up staying in the gulf/carribean areas, but we definitely know that we want to live aboard. Even if that means we only cruise the Texas coast during summer vacations. We're young, without kids, and have a little (not much) expendable income.
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Old 27-08-2016, 13:17   #30
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Re: When you know nothing...

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Originally Posted by TooCoys View Post
I could DEFINITELY see myself living in this space.

1976 Yorktown Sloop Sail Boat For Sale - www.yachtworld.com
Aye , she's a beauty, and well fitted it seems. She's in Cali you in Texas?
If you bring her around consider lock fees . Or if you transport her to your port check those fees also. If you plan on pacific sailing , you may want to investigate that coast and what it has to offer.
Keep in mind the bridge clearance and draft in waters intercostal can cause limitations to access. It won't prevent you from inter coastal sailin , just will limit certain accessibility to some marinas and ports.

We sailed the Atlantic seaboard intercoastals in a 5 1/2 draft , a pain in the arse with groundings after Sandy remodeled the ditch with shoaling and new inlets , many still not fixed by the corp of engineers for lack of funds. There are areas known as honey holes for Seatow and towboatus. I recall marker 116 looking like a parking lot for sailboats.
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