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Old 28-06-2011, 05:51   #46
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pirate Re: What ever happened to learn by doing???? Read a book and go for it

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You misunderstand yachtmaster offshore and ocean. They are competency exams not training courses. They are not courses. In fact once you meet the sea miles qualification you can take the exam without any formal tuition.

The resulting ticket can be commercially endorsed and is good upto 200 tons

Dave
Dang... makes my 22m/80 tons a bit sad huh...
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Old 28-06-2011, 12:48   #47
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Re: What ever happened to learn by doing???? Read a book and go for it

Aloha all,
I've sailed with a few skippers with large boats that have no business being away from the dock. The reason is they don't know about safety and they don't know the rules of the road and are a danger to themselves and their passengers and other boaters in the water.
A basic sailing course could have at least put them on a level playing field before they bought their big boats.
After talking with a few skippers who needed crew I just walked away. I knew by our conversation that they shouldn't be going anywhere. Some learned sailing through friends that taught them bad habits, some learned by just jumping aboard their first boat.
Think back to when you first jumped aboard your boat without classes. How nervous were those folks around you in an anchorage or at a dock near you when you were flailing around with tiller and sails and not knowing which direction you were going or that you were caught in irons being blown on the rocks?
Sorry for the rant but this question can have more than one right answer. Sailing courses are really necessary for some folks and wouldn't hurt any of us.
kind regards,
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Old 28-06-2011, 12:57   #48
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Originally Posted by capttman
OK, can I have a gripe here? Every time I see a post with someone wanting to begin sailing all I seem to see is advice on getting ASA training take lessons etc....

My feeling is get a sunfish and go for it then a bigger and bigger till ya happy... Read a book, trial and error or OPB to learn.

Have we really become a bunch of morons who can't just do it any more or am I just old and cranky??

Come on slaughter me or agree with me or what do you think.......
Well There are still some of us that will learn by doing. I bought a 1976 25ft Oday and my plan is to drop it in the water and start pulling on lines and see what happens. No sailing experience at all. That way if I make a mistake I have to fix it which is a great way to learn. Of course I'll have safety in mind and will be cautious. Eventually I may need help to fine tune my skills but what the heck I am going for it.
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Old 28-06-2011, 13:40   #49
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Re: What ever happened to learn by doing???? Read a book and go for it

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Originally Posted by SkiprJohn View Post
Aloha all,
I've sailed with a few skippers with large boats that have no business being away from the dock. The reason is they don't know about safety and they don't know the rules of the road and are a danger to themselves and their passengers and other boaters in the water.
A basic sailing course could have at least put them on a level playing field before they bought their big boats.
After talking with a few skippers who needed crew I just walked away. I knew by our conversation that they shouldn't be going anywhere. Some learned sailing through friends that taught them bad habits, some learned by just jumping aboard their first boat.
Think back to when you first jumped aboard your boat without classes. How nervous were those folks around you in an anchorage or at a dock near you when you were flailing around with tiller and sails and not knowing which direction you were going or that you were caught in irons being blown on the rocks?
Sorry for the rant but this question can have more than one right answer. Sailing courses are really necessary for some folks and wouldn't hurt any of us.
kind regards,
Truer words were never spoken, SkprJohn... I made a fair living driving the boats of wealthy boat owners around who at least knew their limitations and while they loved to be at sea with their guests, there was no way they were competent to take their vessel away from the dock.
Unfortunately, there were others who thought their checkbook gave them license to sail or drive anything anywhere with occasional disasterous result.
In their defense, they were too busy being Captains of Industry to either take a course or get any sea time under their feet. Capt Phil
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Old 28-06-2011, 14:01   #50
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Re: What ever happened to learn by doing???? Read a book and go for it

I always advocate learning on a sailing dinghy. I'm also an advocate of continued formal training. Plenty of folks with experience simply have lots of experience doing things wrong. Every time I take a course I learn something new. Weather, knots, navigation, different types of vessels, different prospectives, etc.
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Old 28-06-2011, 14:07   #51
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Re: What ever happened to learn by doing???? Read a book and go for it

Almost time to do the count for and against...

See It's not the training I'm opposed to it's that at least half of you don't think outside the box.. Most of us that cruise think outside and live outside the box..

I am a licensed Capt been sailing over 50 years over 50,000 miles under my keel and see more and more incompetent people sailing and power boating now then ever.. They all have had a course though and know when their right.... Dead right add some common sense here.....
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Old 28-06-2011, 14:27   #52
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Re: What ever happened to learn by doing???? Read a book and go for it

seems this is nothing more than new way to divide us into various groups so some can feel superior to others

which group is going to be considered the low lifes?
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Old 28-06-2011, 14:32   #53
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Re: What ever happened to learn by doing???? Read a book and go for it

Here's my take on it. I've come to sailing in my middle age and was introduced to it by a friend. I have sailed with "experts" of varying levels from lake sailors to one who has done the "Around Alone" race. All of them had something to teach me. I have been doing sailing courses part time for 2 years. I have passed all the Yachtmaster theory and coastal level practical courses and just need a few more sea miles to sit for my 200t Master of Yachts. Some of the experienced sailors I've been to sea with certainly have been better sailors than my sailing school instructors. However, I have still learn't plenty from the sailing schools that I did not pick up from even the best of sailors. And I have learn't plenty from books and this forum that was not learned from experienced sailors or the sailing schools. Everyone has something to teach us, even if it's what not to do.

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Old 28-06-2011, 14:39   #54
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Re: What ever happened to learn by doing???? Read a book and go for it

count me in the lowlifes..LOL.. proudly i accept that --
i watched too many classes that have been in process of being taught--- as a result i will NOT EVER take the classes-- the instructors i have seen were yelling not teaching, they circled the kids from in a boston whaler, and one of my neighbors who is not either sailor nor seaman has been hired to instruct sailing..LOL... no way in hell would i ever take a certification class from these folks.....i am happy in my knowledge i was taught essentially as apprentice to my uncle who was a tallshipman and was a graduate of kings point and was round the world merchant mariner. goooood man, excellent teacher. i donot have faith nor trust in these creatures i watch abuse the folks and boats in mooring situations and in the sabots they are allegedly teaching to sail. they certainly do NOT know or teach RULES AND REGULATIONS.
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Old 28-06-2011, 14:45   #55
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Re: What ever happened to learn by doing???? Read a book and go for it

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seems this is nothing more than new way to divide us into various groups so some can feel superior to others

which group is going to be considered the low lifes?


Never any low lifes just different lives, kind of like republicans or democrats..LOL can u guess what I am..
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Old 28-06-2011, 14:48   #56
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Re: What ever happened to learn by doing???? Read a book and go for it

Still most do nor get it or an economist shouldn't try to write in english..lol

I just want to know why the first thing we say is take ASA 101....hahahaha
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Old 28-06-2011, 17:01   #57
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Re: What ever happened to learn by doing???? Read a book and go for it

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Originally Posted by Don Lucas View Post
seems this is nothing more than new way to divide us into various groups so some can feel superior to others

which group is going to be considered the low lifes?
Don, that's easy. It's always "the other one", of course
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Old 28-06-2011, 17:20   #58
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Re: What ever happened to learn by doing???? Read a book and go for it

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Aloha all,
I've sailed with a few skippers with large boats that have no business being away from the dock. The reason is they don't know about safety and they don't know the rules of the road and are a danger to themselves and their passengers and other boaters in the water.
A basic sailing course could have at least put them on a level playing field before they bought their big boats.
Sorry for the rant but this question can have more than one right answer. Sailing courses are really necessary for some folks and wouldn't hurt any of us.
kind regards,
I didn't even think about the chequebook sailors/owners, so that's a good point.

I've never been able to afford to own more boat than I can handle, so the boats have got bigger over the years as experience has grown and nobody's died in the process.

Those that come to the water with more wallet than experience are sure going to need some good instruction.
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Old 28-06-2011, 17:28   #59
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Re: What ever happened to learn by doing???? Read a book and go for it

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Still most do nor get it or an economist shouldn't try to write in english..lol

I just want to know why the first thing we say is take ASA 101....hahahaha
Because when people come to the forum and say they know nothing, ASA 101 isn't a bad way for them to pick up fundamentals.
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Old 28-06-2011, 17:35   #60
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Re: What ever happened to learn by doing???? Read a book and go for it

Ive read here that you can ¨learn as you go along¨ and ¨sure, you make the odd mistake¨! Hmmm...I guess im a late starter in my 40s, have done 2 courses so far up to Day Skipper, the biggest impact on me from those courses was the safety side of things that was drilled into us! There are more cruisers than there were 20 years ago, the sea is a busy place! From my side I dont think I perhaps would have studied quite as hard If it had not been for the courses, I would not want to be guilty of making a silly mistake that caused injury or even loss of life to someone just because i was ¨learning as I was going along¨! So based on that am a great suporter of doing a course!
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