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Old 28-08-2016, 14:13   #136
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pirate Re: Supplements, health foods and exercise strategies for cruisers

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Originally Posted by Caribbeachbum View Post

Science can be uncertain and unpleasant, but it's better than superstition.
What..?? That big Pharma and the medical profession have your interests at heart...
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Old 28-08-2016, 14:20   #137
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Re: Supplements, health foods and exercise strategies for cruisers

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What..?? That big Pharma and the medical profession have your interests at heart...
They most definitely do not.
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Old 28-08-2016, 14:40   #138
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Re: Supplements, health foods and exercise strategies for cruisers

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I don't doubt your truthfulness, though I'm skeptical of your correctness. And even if you are correct in this case, it's utterly meaningless except perhaps as an indication that some real science might be worthwhile.

Except, of course, that much real science has already been done on the subject, and it's been proven to be no more effective than any other placebo. I have no problem with the idea the big pharma seeks profit above all. But in this case, like vitamin supplements discussed elsewhere herein, the science is not ambiguous.

You're believing in magic. Your choice, of course. Millions do every day, it makes them feel better about themselves and their lives. It gives hope, where there appeared to be none otherwise.

I favor reality; and choose to follow the evidence no matter where it leads, even when it contradicts something I very much want to be true.
I do not believe in magic as you say. I have had unfortunately operations involving full anesthetic. Which I can say I prefer. No memory of the event except the twilite phase upon waking. I do remember the intravenous injection prior to going under and being wheeled into the operating theatre. That pre op intravenous stuff is mind altering in a pleasant way. Not that I desire to replicate it. So I am not rushing off to use acupuncture but I am not going to hide from the truth that I have seen it work.
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Old 28-08-2016, 14:45   #139
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Re: Supplements, health foods and exercise strategies for cruisers

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This is not hard at all, Weavis. I can't speak for any here but myself. But I am easily swayed by real evidence (rather than anecdotes). Point me to a bona fide clinical study using a statically meanifully sample size where the sample members were anesthetized for surgery using only acupuncture. I will read it.

I'm willing to bet that you wouldn't go under the knife without real anesthesia, the kind of anesthesia that underwent clinical trials at multiple levels before being used on humans, and then more trials on humans, before being allowed into general use.

Science can be uncertain and unpleasant, but it's better than superstition.
Keeping on calling something you don't understand superstition doesn't make it so.

By the way. My father died of a mistake by the anesthesiologist during a simple nasal operation. His doctor told him he could fix his snoring with the simple operation. Sure did stop his snoring.
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Old 28-08-2016, 14:46   #140
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Re: Supplements, health foods and exercise strategies for cruisers

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Originally Posted by Caribbeachbum View Post
This is not hard at all, Weavis. I can't speak for any here but myself. But I am easily swayed by real evidence (rather than anecdotes). Point me to a bona fide clinical study using a statically meanifully sample size where the sample members were anesthetized for surgery using only acupuncture. I will read it.

I'm willing to bet that you wouldn't go under the knife without real anesthesia, the kind of anesthesia that underwent clinical trials at multiple levels before being used on humans, and then more trials on humans, before being allowed into general use.

Science can be uncertain and unpleasant, but it's better than superstition.
Here is the error made. I never ever mentioned using acupuncture for anesthesia in operative procedures.

That was not my statement.
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Old 28-08-2016, 14:52   #141
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Re: Supplements, health foods and exercise strategies for cruisers

What does the world famous Mayo Clinic have to say about acupuncture.

Why it's done
By Mayo Clinic Staff
Appointments & care

Chemotherapy-induced and postoperative nausea and vomiting
Dental pain
Fibromyalgia
Headaches, including tension and migraine headaches
Labor pain
Low back pain
Neck pain
Osteoarthritis
Menstrual cramps

Warning the following video shows real life surgery. That is cutting into flesh etc. From UCLA





https://youtu.be/6ThmAqf--t8


https://youtu.be/6ThmAqf--t8
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Old 29-08-2016, 00:27   #142
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Re: Supplements, health foods and exercise strategies for cruisers

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Originally Posted by GoingWalkabout View Post
What does the world famous Mayo Clinic have to say about acupuncture.

Why it's done
By Mayo Clinic Staff
Appointments & care

Chemotherapy-induced and postoperative nausea and vomiting
Dental pain
Fibromyalgia
Headaches, including tension and migraine headaches
Labor pain
Low back pain
Neck pain
Osteoarthritis
Menstrual cramps

Warning the following video shows real life surgery. That is cutting into flesh etc. From UCLA





https://youtu.be/6ThmAqf--t8


https://youtu.be/6ThmAqf--t8
You actually believe what you see in your lame 1950's video from Chairman Mao's China? WOW... That's very misleading, it's just archival footage from the UCLA film library... totally incomplete. My magic video shows a more complete surgery.

Honestly, It's difficult for me to believe someone can be this gullible. But hey, it's your money.... Spend it however you like.
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Old 29-08-2016, 01:10   #143
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Re: Supplements, health foods and exercise strategies for cruisers

Also from the Mayo Clinic wedsite:
"Acupuncture
Definition

Acupuncture involves the insertion of extremely thin needles through your skin at strategic points on your body. A key component of traditional Chinese medicine, acupuncture is most commonly used to treat pain.

Traditional Chinese medicine explains acupuncture as a technique for balancing the flow of energy or life force — known as qi or chi (CHEE) — believed to flow through pathways (meridians) in your body. By inserting needles into specific points along these meridians, acupuncture practitioners believe that your energy flow will re-balance.

In contrast, many Western practitioners view the acupuncture points as places to stimulate nerves, muscles and connective tissue. Some believe that this stimulation boosts your body's natural painkillers and increases blood flow."

The description is filled with phrases like "some believe," "acupuncture practitioners believe," "rebalance your energy flow" "life force" etc..

Nothing there about positive clinical outcomes based on a scientific study.
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Old 29-08-2016, 04:33   #144
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Re: Supplements, health foods and exercise strategies for cruisers

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It's mainstream because it's correct. In fact, you are one of the very people you refer to, ignoring science in favor of what you'd like to be true instead. Might as well try prayer instead of anesthesia, it's just as likely to be effective. That is, not at all. Unless, of course, you pray that the medical team gives you real anesthesia ...
Back off bud. Re read my posts. There is nothing in them about my "beliefs". My understanding of any if it, from a scientifix view" is very low. I argue no points in favor or against. Yes I did point out that some common medical practices were once thought to be wrong. That's fact not my "belief". And being a historical fact does highlight that knowledge changes and, yes, what some think of as "voodoo" now, may be proven in the future to be something else.

Belief is a horrible way to judge anything outside of religious ideology. If you want knowledge ask questions. If you are content with "belief" as your quidance you wallow in your own ignorance.
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Old 29-08-2016, 05:06   #145
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Re: Supplements, health foods and exercise strategies for cruisers

I trod on a nail yesterday. I can tell you acupunture doesnt work.
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Old 29-08-2016, 06:04   #146
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Re: Supplements, health foods and exercise strategies for cruisers

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You actually believe what you see in your lame 1950's video from Chairman Mao's China? WOW... .
Interesting enough, for those here that don't know it, acupuncture had pretty much been disproven as an all around heath care solution and died away as a practice until Chairman Mao revived it as a sort of Chinese Nationalist propaganda tool to revel the Chinese culture into his system.

I read this in a recent article, which I cannot find now. The article went on to say that in a scientific study that the expert acupuncturist skill set has no more benefit than if you took the same needles and jabbed them randomly in different places. It also noted they believe it releases a natural painkiller into the bloodstream but I forgot the name -- hormone or something, starts with an A.

I've had it done for sleep problems and it seemed to work for me, but the effect is temporary.
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Old 30-08-2016, 05:16   #147
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Re: Supplements, health foods and exercise strategies for cruisers

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I dont recall the numbers but my cholesterol was barely borderline for high and my doc also wanted me to take statins. Barely borderline. I refused. My bf has also refused his doc. Doing research we discovered that statins are far worse than haveing high cholesterol. My bf gave his doc the research he did and now his doc is onboard and has also refused statins.
I love it, thanks for that update!
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Old 30-08-2016, 05:42   #148
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Re: Supplements, health foods and exercise strategies for cruisers

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You are one of the intelligent few. Your patients are very lucky.
+2 I'm with GoingWalkabout on this!
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Old 30-08-2016, 07:16   #149
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Re: Supplements, health foods and exercise strategies for cruisers

A good multi-vitamin. Fruits and veggies, just like you would on land. Go for a swim or dive!
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