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Old 06-09-2015, 14:24   #46
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Re: Sad news from Australian East Coast

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Originally Posted by Ann T. Cate View Post
Although the Top Hat is a small yacht, we know a couple who circumnavigated in one, and another couple who sailed one from Australia to Canada and return, via Mexico. They are not incompetent boats.

.........

Ann
Ann, Could you please confirm this was a Top Hat yacht?, & any links if possible
Thank you
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Old 06-09-2015, 22:01   #47
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Re: Sad news from Australian East Coast

TopHat: and everybody else.....

Well, I just went back through the whole thread, and I did not get it on CF.

Where I did hear it was on ham radio the day after the event, and I do not know if that source had it right. I assumed he did, but I honestly do not know for sure.

SO, THE VESSEL MAY OR MAY NOT HAVE BEEN A TOP HAT. --- WE DO NOT KNOW WHAT TYPE OF BOAT IT WAS.

I apologize for any difficulty I may have inadvertently caused by passing this along.

ann
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Old 06-09-2015, 23:22   #48
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Re: Sad news from Australian East Coast

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yep it is. Only credible explanation for such a vessel in such calm water is a ramming.
I had not heard of the Patanela mystery so very interesting thanks. I am not of the opinion that ramming was the "only" explanation however. One thing it seemed clear to me having read a few items about this now is that the vessel was 20 years old in 1988, and in need of a refit. Gas safety back then was not sufficiently advanced, with few vessels having separate gas lockers. Gas explosion is certainly one possibility for a sudden disappearance. The initial event could have blown the lifebuoy off the stern and the whole remaining sunk with all other gear still attached, all aboard killed during the initial event.

Speculation, of course, but certainly ramming is not the "only" possibility in this case.

And RIP to the sailors washed ashore in this case. Very sad. My instinct is the vessel sank and they took to the dinghy, which was overwhelmed.
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Old 07-09-2015, 04:54   #49
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Re: Sad news from Australian East Coast

Thank you for clearing that up Ann.

There was quite a stir on our Top Hat site and on the Seabreeze site this morning, as we have a Top Hat yacht that has the exact same voyage plan & some remarkable similarities to the lost yacht. The Top Hat skipper and yacht has now been safely accounted for.

A few details about the lost sailors has been released, they sounded like a couple of lovely blokes. RIP.

Mystery over deaths of experienced yachtsmen found on Stockton Beach
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Old 07-09-2015, 04:59   #50
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Re: Sad news from Australian East Coast

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Dieter, the quote below that relates the observations at knobby's head show that there wasn't all that much wind, despite your statement. The Tophat is small, but a pretty decent sea boat. Those conditions themselves shouldn't have caused them much grief.

I hope that the boat is recovered, but at this time it is becoming less likely.
And being 77 myself, I can't help a small frisson...

Jim
A year or two ago there was a ~40ft cat that encountered problems and partially sank off the Sunshine Coast Qld, on the night in question we were up at 2am on a south facing second floor balcony on a ridge 1km from the ocean and there wasn't enough wind to blow away a cigarette paper.

The reported conditions ~15nm away were 25kn gusting 35kn for hours. Go figure, it surprised the hell out of me.
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Old 07-09-2015, 20:22   #51
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Re: Sad news from Australian East Coast

The run from Newcastle to Port Stephens can be deceptive. In the morning the wind may be SE but after a couple of hours often swings more to the East so that what starts as an achievable beat becomes a frustrating headwind pushing you onto the beach. Can be a long way back to Newcastle so temptation is to push on.

I have had this happen to me not so long ago. Throw in a motor with a fuel problem and the Stocktons Bight beach approaches very quickly. As someone has noted, the water is not deep and the prevailing SE swell can be troublesome. not a great place to anchor.

I can appreciate the ease with which a small yacht or big ship could get into trouble.


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Old 07-09-2015, 20:42   #52
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Re: Sad news from Australian East Coast

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Originally Posted by sparau View Post
A year or two ago there was a ~40ft cat that encountered problems and partially sank off the Sunshine Coast Qld, on the night in question we were up at 2am on a south facing second floor balcony on a ridge 1km from the ocean and there wasn't enough wind to blow away a cigarette paper.

The reported conditions ~15nm away were 25kn gusting 35kn for hours. Go figure, it surprised the hell out of me.
I see that here all the time. The weatherman on the TV explained it once. From memory it has something to do with an inversion layer that causes the moving air to pass over and above the still layer of air over the land surface.
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Old 07-09-2015, 22:02   #53
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Re: Sad news from Australian East Coast

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I see that here all the time. The weatherman on the TV explained it once. From memory it has something to do with an inversion layer that causes the moving air to pass over and above the still layer of air over the land surface.
I've found that quite common up the Qld coast. Often with light westerly winds close in while the Sou'easters are howling further out.
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Old 13-09-2015, 20:04   #54
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Re: Sad news from Australian East Coast

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Kaz 2 isn't a mystery. It was an unfortunate incident that led to three men going missing. The exact circumstances of how they fell over is conjecture, but it was pretty clear there was no foul play and equally clear an accident occurred.

Nina went missing in a storm. No real mystery there either.
Ah, you must know more about Kaz 11 than anyone else does.

From everything I've read, the 3 men went missing, and nobody knows what caused it.

No storm, no bad weather, etc etc..
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Old 13-09-2015, 20:14   #55
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Re: Sad news from Australian East Coast

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Ah, you must know more about Kaz 11 than anyone else does.

From everything I've read, the 3 men went missing, and nobody knows what caused it.

No storm, no bad weather, etc etc..
On the contrary, I like anyone else and probably 'most people' read the publicly available coroners report.

You don't have to be rude and flippant in your response.
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Old 13-09-2015, 21:12   #56
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Re: Sad news from Australian East Coast

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On the contrary, I like anyone else and probably 'most people' read the publicly available coroners report. ......
Well, yes, but IMHO, the language of the Coroners report was just a PC version of "we don't know" so you might say I am one of those who do still consider it a "mystery". Not that I think it was foul play or such, but a mystery of unusual circumstances of which we may never know.
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Old 16-09-2015, 21:01   #57
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Re: Sad news from Australian East Coast

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On the contrary, I like anyone else and probably 'most people' read the publicly available coroners report.

You don't have to be rude and flippant in your response.
Why not? You say there's no mystery, but can't offer any explanation. The fact is, the disappearance of Kaz 2's crew is still unexplained. ie. - a mystery.

It's very reminiscent of the Marie Celeste - the boat was found in serviceable condition, food on the table etc, but the entire crew missing.
Generally referred to as "the Mystery of the Marie Celeste."
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Old 16-09-2015, 21:06   #58
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Re: Sad news from Australian East Coast

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Why not? You say there's no mystery, but can't offer any explanation. The fact is, the disappearance of Kaz 2's crew is still unexplained. ie. - a mystery.

It's very reminiscent of the Marie Celeste - the boat was found in serviceable condition, food on the table etc, but the entire crew missing.
Generally referred to as "the Mystery of the Marie Celeste."
It is nothing even similar to the Marie Celeste - though they have some pretty good ideas of what happened to the Marie Celeste too, but it's guess work. So, yes, definitely still a mystery.

AND I do offer an explanation. Read the Coroner's report! It sounds very reasonable.
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Old 16-09-2015, 21:09   #59
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Re: Sad news from Australian East Coast

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Originally Posted by 44'cruisingcat View Post
Why not? You say there's no mystery, but can't offer any explanation. The fact is, the disappearance of Kaz 2's crew is still unexplained. ie. - a mystery.

It's very reminiscent of the Marie Celeste - the boat was found in serviceable condition, food on the table etc, but the entire crew missing.
Generally referred to as "the Mystery of the Marie Celeste."
And more correctly known as the 'Mary Celeste'
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Old 16-09-2015, 23:11   #60
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Re: Sad news from Australian East Coast

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Why not? You say there's no mystery, but can't offer any explanation. The fact is, the disappearance of Kaz 2's crew is still unexplained. ie. - a mystery.

It's very reminiscent of the Marie Celeste - the boat was found in serviceable condition, food on the table etc, but the entire crew missing.
Generally referred to as "the Mystery of the Marie Celeste."
Not according to the Coroner. See Australian coroner ends mystery of 'ghost ship' | Australia news | The Guardian

But yesterday a coroner in Townsville, Queensland, ended the speculation that has been buzzing around the bars of Australian yachting clubs for months by ruling that the three friends drowned in a freak accident during what was supposed to have been a trip of a lifetime, even though their bodies have never been found.
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